Submission Text Full Submission Page

The8bitbeast's Comments

I made this submission to update #4754: IzzyThePenguin's SMS Ys: The Vanished Omens "game end glitch" in 00:17.11 to the new version of Bizhawk.
All inputs are my own, but after checking against John's TAS, there is no time saved in gameplay.
The main reason for this submission is that current rules require the BIOS to be enabled and included in the timing. As the run is extremely short, this timing difference has a significant impact. I asked John if he would be willing to update his TAS rather than having me submit this, but he said it would be easier for me to submit it instead. Depending on the publication technicalities, I'm also happy for this button file to update the existing publication rather than create a new one if that's a possibility.
In terms of my own research with this game, I've tried various different strategies in the shop. Use of the up and pause buttons can manipulate the outcome of the glitch, but I couldn't trigger the credits without using John's setup. More research is needed on this glitch as I feel that the TAS could come much lower.
Below is John's submission text as there is lots of useful information in there.

John's Original Submission Text

Ys: The Vanished Omens is normally a game about exploring the world, defeating bosses, collecting items and experience and saving the world. Thanks to how broken the mirror inside Pim's shop is, however, Adol decides he doesn't want to bother with any of that pesky exploring business, and instead warps himself to the end of his journey.

Game objectives

.Warp to credits
.Corrupts memory

Comments

I have been running this game RTA for some time now, using the same route as the TAS this obsoletes. I discovered by pure coincidence that certain vertical scrolls allow the credits warp to be triggered without entering the in-game menu. I wanted to see if this would save any time, and the result is this TAS, which saves 21 frames over the previous by CoolKirby.

Stage by stage comments

Minea Village

All of the overworld portion takes place inside Minea Village. Where the previous TAS scrolled vertically so that the bottom pixel visible is the bottom pixel of the middle set of buildings, the new setup requires that you instead go 8 pixels lower. This costs a total of 16 frames of additional movement. The horizontal scroll remains the same. The main time save in this TAS comes from not having to enter the menu. This saves 37 frames.

Pim's Shop

The menus are identical to CoolKirby's TAS. The mirror is bought, then buying it again is attempted 3 times. Leaving the shop at this point triggers the credits warp.

feos: Judging...


TASVideoAgent
They/Them
Moderator
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 15579
Location: 127.0.0.1
Banned User
Joined: 8/2/2017
Posts: 89
Location: Brazil
Nice same new TAS with SMS bios! Yes vote!
Cuphead TASes desyncs unfortunately.
EZGames69
He/They
Publisher, Reviewer, Expert player (4461)
Joined: 5/29/2017
Posts: 2761
I like how the last thing you see is the character selecting "leave", I guess the game is technically correct.
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't 12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!" Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish [Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing
Joined: 8/7/2011
Posts: 166
This run puts the "ease" in "Ys".
Dwedit
He/Him
Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 692
Location: Chicago
EZGames69 wrote:
I like how the last thing you see is the character selecting "leave", I guess the game is technically correct.
I have to go now. My planet needs me.
Site Admin, Skilled player (1254)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11475
Location: Lake Char­gogg­a­gogg­man­chaugg­a­gogg­chau­bun­a­gung­a­maugg
Gameplay in this movie is actually 1 frame longer than in the old submission. And even if it was of equal length, we require gameplay improvement to be there to obsolete the previous movie. In rare cases a secondary movie gets added to the publication, but the site hasn't been designed to work that way, and every such case involves hacking the database manually. It can be done when the new file has significant improvements in accuracy, for example it now syncs on console, but we don't add secondary movie files only because they were done on a newer emulator version. Especially if it's also slower in gameplay.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
The8bitbeast
He/Him
Expert player (2633)
Joined: 11/26/2015
Posts: 183
Location: Australia
feos wrote:
Gameplay in this movie is actually 1 frame longer than in the old submission.
Not sure if I agree here. My submitted movie has last input at 1645 and truncates at 1646. After resyncing John's TAS by shifting the inputs back from the bios, that also ends at 1645/1646. Maybe there's something I'm missing? Anyway, in regards to submission, my main motivation for submitting this was based around the Zool TAS that I'll be submitting soon. Zool is faster than Ys, but Ys appears to be faster on the site due to BIOS not being included in it's current timing. Zool (with BIOS): 21.609 Zool (no BIOS): 11.249 Ys (with BIOS): 27.470 Ys (no BIOS): 17.110 Usually I wouldn't mind these timing discrepancies too much, but it could cause a frustrating misconception that Ys is the fastest master system game, whereas Zool is actually the fastest Master System game. Although finding the fastest Master System game is a fairly niche topic, it would be nice if the Ys TAS time was somehow updated to include the BIOS to avoid any confusion. That being said, I understand that a fresh publication isn't necessarily the way to achieve this. Considering there are no gameplay improvements, I understand the rules that are in place to prevent people slapping their name on a publication by resyncing it in new emulator versions. So I've cancelled this submission to align with consistent rule application, but if there's anyway at all to update the Ys publication time to include the BIOS I would appreciate that being done.
TASVideosGrue
They/Them
Joined: 10/1/2008
Posts: 2785
Location: The dark corners of the TASVideos server
om, nom, nom... minty!
Site Admin, Skilled player (1254)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11475
Location: Lake Char­gogg­a­gogg­man­chaugg­a­gogg­chau­bun­a­gung­a­maugg
I think I measured it wrong by using AVI dumps to compare, one with alt sync and one without. Now I'm dumping without alt sync and gameplay has identical length.
The8bitbeast wrote:
Usually I wouldn't mind these timing discrepancies too much, but it could cause a frustrating misconception that Ys is the fastest master system game, whereas Zool is actually the fastest Master System game. Although finding the fastest Master System game is a fairly niche topic, it would be nice if the Ys TAS time was somehow updated to include the BIOS to avoid any confusion.
We just mention such things in publication descriptions.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.