I can help you if you want for the route planing.
Also about your video, I already see the same thing a long time ago on youtube, but I was not able to find it again.
Thanks that would really be appreciated. I figured it was already found but I couldn't find a video of it, that's why I didn't say it was new or something :P ... I'm currently at 6835 rerecords and I'm not even 2 minutes into the actual playing, so it'll take a while before I even finish Glimmer up.
Also, I was thinking for summer forest to postpone collection a few gems until after we were to come back from Autumn Plains. As for a small (undetailed) explanation it'd be like (say I'm just now coming out of Glimmer) get the gems that are to the right of Spyro and circle around. I'm pretty sure that it'd be faster to charge down the steps and get all of the gems in the room where if you fail hunter shows up, and then to get back up use the whirlwind. As you exit that room, ignore the gem on the left (should be a red gem) because we can get that coming back from Autumn Plains. It'd be good to get all gems except for that one in this area, as for the gems in the water, I'll have to see a route for it to be split up with since we're going there 2 times. As for the rest of the gems, they'll be split up going along with the route you proposed like a year ago.
I think the next few months will be spent on just this bit, so nothing to worry about on the Winter Tundra until I/we get there.
I partly understood that wall of text ;)
I have a little bit of a route for Summer Forest - after getting Hunter's orb, then gliding over to the other orb, like you discussed a year ago, you can go through the cave backwards getting the gems, and once out, use this swimming glitch: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1bhvwD0I1Ac
Which could make some gem collecting a bit easier before entering the next level, and/or possibly be used to get orb above sunny beach and hurricos without having to climb (even with climb while backtracking to Sunny Beach would be quite slow?)
Also, I have a possible idea to skip climbing in Sunny Beach - I'm downloading a NTSC-U ROM right now, just checking you're using NTSC-U too?
I really don't see how to skip climbing in Sunny Beach since there is no way to swim in the air in this level (or maybe you have an idea how to) and the ladder is just too high to reach it with double jump. Our last hope is a proxy jump, but it's a very situational glitch (maybe we can make one with a turtle ?).
About Summer Forest, the route should be :
Colossus (get all gems in the way)
Purchase swiming
Hunter's orb
Gliding to the other orb
Swiming in the air (the one that Hutch show)
Crush
All Autumn Plains levels up to Magma Cone (speak with Professor so he will open the door) and purchase climbing (so there should be Icy Speedway and Shady Oasis left)
Return to Summer Forest
Idol Springs
Hurricos
Sunny Beach
Speedway
Aquaria Towers
Go to Autumn Plains (since you speak with Professor, it will send you at the Gulp door)
Icy Speedway
The 2 Autumn Plains orb (suicide after that)
Shady Oasis
Gulp
I really don't see how to skip climbing in Sunny Beach since there is no way to swim in the air in this level (or maybe you have an idea how to) and the ladder is just too high to reach it with double jump. Our last hope is a proxy jump, but it's a very situational glitch (maybe we can make one with a turtle ?).
About Summer Forest, the route should be :
Colossus (get all gems in the way)
Purchase swiming
Hunter's orb
Gliding to the other orb
Swiming in the air (the one that Hutch show)
Crush
All Autumn Plains levels up to Magma Cone (speak with Professor so he will open the door) and purchase climbing (so there should be Icy Speedway and Shady Oasis left)
Return to Summer Forest
Idol Springs
Hurricos
Sunny Beach
Speedway
Aquaria Towers
Go to Autumn Plains (since you speak with Professor, it will send you at the Gulp door)
Icy Speedway
The 2 Autumn Plains orb (suicide after that)
Shady Oasis
Gulp
First is new, second is old - some other guy did it without going on the outside hill.
I wonder if using that glitch on Aquaria towers you could go half inside the wall of each of the towers with the baby seahorses to save time?
Although doesn't it respawn you in the centre at the top of each one?
As I said on skype (although you probably haven't logged in Torn), the ROM I downloaded didn't work, so I'll try again soon, but I just got a 3ds, so I'm having a bit of fun with that atm :)
First is new, second is old - some other guy did it without going on the outside hill.
I wonder if using that glitch on Aquaria towers you could go half inside the wall of each of the towers with the baby seahorses to save time?
Although doesn't it respawn you in the centre at the top of each one?
As I said on skype (although you probably haven't logged in Torn), the ROM I downloaded didn't work, so I'll try again soon, but I just got a 3ds, so I'm having a bit of fun with that atm :)
Yeah first is new to me afaik, maybe new in general :P.. Second is old, and obvious :D ... According to the guy of the video, the game doesn't check to see if you've done all of baby seahorse towers, so you could just do #6 and get the orb. As for respawning, not sure I'll check tomorrow (it's 5:15 AM for me atm, kinda too tired to check). [lie]Torn always checks his skype[/lie]. You should redl when you can :D, enjoy the 3Ds, you get Zelda 3D??
First is new, second is old - some other guy did it without going on the outside hill.
I wonder if using that glitch on Aquaria towers you could go half inside the wall of each of the towers with the baby seahorses to save time?
Although doesn't it respawn you in the centre at the top of each one?
As I said on skype (although you probably haven't logged in Torn), the ROM I downloaded didn't work, so I'll try again soon, but I just got a 3ds, so I'm having a bit of fun with that atm :)
Yeah first is new to me afaik, maybe new in general :P.. Second is old, and obvious :D ... According to the guy of the video, the game doesn't check to see if you've done all of baby seahorse towers, so you could just do #6 and get the orb. As for respawning, not sure I'll check tomorrow (it's 5:15 AM for me atm, kinda too tired to check). [lie]Torn always checks his skype[/lie]. You should redl when you can :D, enjoy the 3Ds, you get Zelda 3D??
1. Good :)
2. redl?? redo? If so, redo what, download of the ROM?
3. Naa, too expensive, I actually started playing it for the first time very slowly on project 64 shortly before the announcement/release of it on the 3ds, so I'm going to buy mkds, and preorder mk3ds (I'm a regular in the mario kart/mario kart wii community)
I'd be happy to do this. I play this game quite often, am decent with emulators, and love this game so much. Hutch, I don't fully understand if you are going to do this or not, or if we could possibly do a duo!, but I'd still love to do this, as this is my favourite videogame ever.
If you want anything or need some help discovering routes, I'm never really busy so I can help, and teach you anything you need to know.
(this is under the assumption that someone may need some new glitch or tactic)
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(2014) <Mothrayas> COMPLICATED MATH, MY NEW GREATEST WEAKNESS!
I'd be happy to do this. I play this game quite often, am decent with emulators, and love this game so much. Hutch, I don't fully understand if you are going to do this or not, or if we could possibly do a duo!, but I'd still love to do this, as this is my favourite videogame ever.
If you want anything or need some help discovering routes, I'm never really busy so I can help, and teach you anything you need to know.
(this is under the assumption that someone may need some new glitch or tactic)
Uhmmm, you've misunderstood everything :)
Torn is the main TASer of this, I was working on Spyro 3 and gave up (whether temporarily or not is not yet decided :))
Lapogne and myself are currently just helping with planning.
The two glitches are old. As Torn said, the OOB glitch in aquaria tower can be use to rescue the 6th baby and get the orb.
And yes, Torn is the main TASer for the moment, I think I will help him once my Spyro 1 TAS will be finish, but there is still a lot of work to do before this.
I figured the glitch was old because I could remember seeing it somewhere but couldn't remember exactly where :P. As bad as it sounds, I'm still doing Glimmer, it looks pretty great right now though, but any help you guys can give would be appreciated, 100%'s aren't easy to do.
Glimmer video up soon enough... Don't know when though. Also Hutch when I said redl I mean re download.
Any progress with this?
Since you deleted your youtube channel, I'll assume not, but just typing this to bump it and make it more likely that you see this.
Any progress with this?
Since you deleted your youtube channel, I'll assume not, but just typing this to bump it and make it more likely that you see this.
Why yes, yes this is. I got my old one back here. I'll release a video in a bit, but it isn't much truthfully. I've got school again, so not as simple to constantly do things anymore.
Any progress with this?
Since you deleted your youtube channel, I'll assume not, but just typing this to bump it and make it more likely that you see this.
Why yes, yes this is. I got my old one back here. I'll release a video in a bit, but it isn't much truthfully. I've got school again, so not as simple to constantly do things anymore.
That's cool, I know how you feel, I found it hard to find motivation to progress on Spyro 3 in the summer holidays (so hard that I didn't actually do any), let alone now I'm back at school, but I'm just glad you aren't gone :)
UPDATE:
The route has drastically changed because sunny beach now has a climb skip.
" http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCC1S2cO22c "
As such the route now goes like this:
1. Glimmer
2. Colossus
Purchase swiming
3. Idol Springs
Hunter's orb
Gliding to the other orb
Swiming in the air glitch
orb which normally requires climb to get
4. Hurricos
5. Sunny Beach (NOTE: I will need help on this as I've yet to be able to pull this trick off D:)
6. Ocean Speedway
orb near the speedway
7. Aquaria Towers
Crush
-SUMMER FOREST COMPLETE NO BACK TRACKING -
All levels on the lower level of autumn plains
Purchase climb
Scorch
Fracture Hills (Rush through it, get 100% on return)
Talk to the professor?????
Magma Cone
The 2 Autumn Plains orb (suicide after that)
Shady Oasis (Rush through it, get 100% on return)
Gulp
Purchase skull bash
(Metro Speedway 100% ON RETURN TO AUTUMN PLAINS)
-To be announced-
~~~~~~~~~~
Other news: I've discovered a glitch where if you fly under non open portals (in out of bounds), that you can enter them anyway, whether or not you have enough orbs or gems to pay for it to open normally... And according to the game, you've opened it whenever you return to the home world. I do believe this can even be used to get to dragon shores early, but since it doesn't really serve a speed purpose, it wont be used... But I think it's pretty neat anyway lol.
Hello dear TAS-Runners, I did a pretty good TAS WIP for this exact speedrun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPjT8G22MNI
Check it out and leave some feedback. I really did put a lot of effort into this!
Hello dear TAS-Runners, I did a pretty good TAS WIP for this exact speedrun.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QPjT8G22MNI
Check it out and leave some feedback. I really did put a lot of effort into this!
Hi TheYoungStarsOfTheWorld, I'm going to be frank and helpful to you.
As a tool assisted speedrun, that was completely horrible.
And as a speedrun that was horrible.
A tool assisted speedrun, the runs hosted at this site use tools, hence the "Tool Assisted" part, namely frame advance, which is playing the game frame by frame (a frame is an image, think of a picture frame, but instead of the frame that holds it, the picture itself, for other purposes that are 50 (for European PAL roms) and 60 (For pretty much everywhere elsewhere on Earth/NTSC Roms) Frames per second (FPS), slow down (self explanatory, but if you need a explanation: Not playing the game at full speed), scripting (name LUA Scripting), MOST IMPORTANTLY rerecording (The massive abuse of save states and the loading of those save states to undo MISTAKES), and other things... Even using robots (Yes robots) to play games to perfection, although... Nothing is perfect, so we try our best.
You obviously have no idea what you're doing in regards to TASing, so I'll link you to some stuff that can help you:
1. http://tasvideos.org/WelcomeToTASVideos.html
2. http://tasvideos.org/MovieRules.html
3. http://tasvideos.org/Guidelines.html
4. http://tasvideos.org/TASHowTo.html
But... Before you can TAS a game, atleast beat the game ONCE. Then learn to speedrun the game (check here for details of Spyro 2: Riptos Rage, NOT Gateway to Glimmer) ...
Speedrun: http://speeddemosarchive.com/Spyro2.html
TAS (any% by Lapogne36): http://tasvideos.org/1523M.html
I recommend you read all the links I've provided you, and watch BOTH the videos I gave you... If you're interested in speedrunning or Tas'ing it's best to do it right! And in advance, I do apologize if I've come off as rude, I don't mean it that way!
Hello, this is Crash41596 "The guy who discovered the turtle soup skip". I would like to join in on the tas. I do have a very optimized route for this run that I would like to share and some what execute.
Route
-----------------------------------
Glimmer 100%
Summer Forest 1
- Get half of the gems in the first area(Due to needing swim), then continue to where Elora is. Then jump down and get the gems on the ground, go up the stairs get the one gem next to the teleporters,proceed and get the 2 baskets then get the 2 gems behind colossus.
Colossus 100%Summer Forest 2
-Pay for swim then clear out the area next to the idol springs.
Idol Springs 100%Summer Forest 3
-Do hunter's challenge then do a double jump through the building, bringing you back to the start of summer forest, clear out that area, then go in the water and clear it out getting the orb, then clear out the area below colossus and continue normally to hurricos collecting gems.
Hurricos 100%Sunny Beach 100%
-Use turtle soup skip http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCC1S2cO22c also possible while flaming the turtle then jumping on it, then doing a double jump.
Summer Forest 4
-Collect what ever gems are before Ocean Speedway
Ocean Speedway
-I remember having a very good route for this. It's probably in my speedrun some where. I always manage to get a sub 1m
Summer Forest 5
Collect all the gems before the orb, then get the orb, then double jump on to the aquaria tower's barrier, then do the charge swim in air with the water next to the sunny beach area, then get the orb up to along with the gems, then clear out all the gems before the boss.
Aquaria Tower's 100% Crush
-Abuse getting hit to keep Crush from moving from platform to platform, then when the platforms turn blue do not get hit and have him go to a blue pad, then abuse getting hit to keep him on the blue platforms, because the blue platforms are the fasted.
That is the route for the first hub world. The rest is pretty easy to route. Who knew the first hub of the game would be the most confusing to route.
Hey Crash, thanks for showing interest.. I read your reply a few days ago but I've been busy so I figured replying before now would be pointless.
That route is great and I'll be sure to add your name to authors list of the pjm movie. I've got exams Friday (tomorrow from the day of posting) and this coming Monday, then I'm out for summer break, so I'll be able to put alot of time into this, so we can begin working on it then. Also, I believe you said you wanted my current work, sadly I've had to keep redoing my work cause I keep finding improvements on Glimmer, and pjm files don't have a stable method of editing, so I just redo it all. But within the week I'll send you what I've got as far as Glimmer goes.
Crash, Cyprys, Lapogne. Here's just a simple lua script I edited from a base script (from pirohiko's Crash Bandicoot 2 Lua script)... Edited to fit Spyro 2. This is if you guys check this and I'm not on skype (which is likely lol). Sure it's basic, and not exactly the best ever, but it works. Some values aren't written down because Crash already has most of the values we need, and the others shouldn't be too hard to find...
Also, to anyone reading this. How do I make lua script text... not... so small ? lol
Language: lua
--Hello, this is a lua script designed for "NTSC-U Spyro 2: Ripto's Rage". -- means it's a comment line!
local HEADER = 0x5F38C
local pScale = 2109000
local vScale = 100000
--The above values needn't be messed with! (??)
gui.register(function()
local addr = memory.readdword(HEADER)
if addr ~= 0 then
addr = addr -0x80000000
else
--That's for drawing the Gui Register and header, not much on that.
gui.text(8,45,"")
return
end
--(line 16)
--These values affect Spyro's world. "Local x - Local XY are all about spyro's position".
--
--
--Where as values "Local D - Local Orbs" all affect Spyro's enviroment.
--The values "local X - Local D... After "readdwordsigned"...
--The ( x ) is there for us to input the addresses where needbe.
local X = memory.readdwordsigned( x ) / pScale
local Y = memory.readdwordsigned( x ) / pScale
local Z = memory.readdwordsigned( x ) / pScale
local XV = memory.readdwordsigned( x ) / vScale
local YV = memory.readdwordsigned( x ) / vScale
local ZV = memory.readdwordsigned( x ) / vScale
local V = memory.readdwordsigned( x ) / vScale
local XY = math.sqrt(XV*XV+YV*YV)
local D = memory.readwordsigned( x ) / 4096*360
local Gems = memory.readword(0x67660)
local Orbs = memory.readword(0x6702C)
--
--These values affect the actual text that gets put onto the screen.
--
gui.text(8,52,
string.format("%8d : Rerecord Count \n",movie.rerecordcount() )
..string.format("%4d/%3d : Gems \n", Gems , 10000 )
..string.format("%4d/%3d : Orbs \n", Orbs , 64 )
.."\n"
..string.format("%8.2f : Z Pos \n", Z )
..string.format("%8.2f : Z Vel \n", ZV )
..string.format("%8.2f : X Pos \n", X )
..string.format("%8.2f : X Vel \n", XV )
..string.format("%8.2f : Y Pos \n", Y )
..string.format("%8.2f : Y Vel \n", YV )
..string.format("%8.2f : XY Vel \n", XY )
..string.format("%8.2f : Velocity \n", V )
..string.format("%8.2f : Degrees \n", D )
)
end)
Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6450
Location: The land down under.
Torn338 wrote:
Here's just a simple lua script I edited from a base script (from pirohiko's Crash Bandicoot 2 Lua script)... Edited to fit Spyro 2.
Language: lua
Lua Code in here
I had a look at your lua script there is an error on line 3
"Spyro2.lua:3(line 3): '=' expected near 'line'
Also it's not a good idea to grab a script from a completely different game as you do need to change parts of the script.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account.Something better for yourself and also others.
Here's just a simple lua script I edited from a base script (from pirohiko's Crash Bandicoot 2 Lua script)... Edited to fit Spyro 2.
Language: lua
Lua Code in here
I had a look at your lua script there is an error on line 3
"Spyro2.lua:3(line 3): '=' expected near 'line'
Also it's not a good idea to grab a script from a completely different game as you do need to change parts of the script.
Yeah, the line 3 error was a mistake either on my part or TASVideos code display part. I'll explain, the "Comment Line!" on line 3, should actually just be on line 1. I have no idea why it got pushed down to line 3 on the forums, but it's still on line 1 in the actual script, but I'll edit the forum post to fix that.
About grabbing a script from a different game: Either way, you can look at the script and tell what values you really want, and those you don't. The base script had things like "boxes", which I turned into "Gems" for example. Sure it's not the smartest thing to do, I agree, but either way the script would have "nearly" looked the same in the end.
In the actual lua script (the one I have saved on my computer), and the one that should now be fixed on the lua script section of my other post... It shouldn't have any errors until about line 23 where instead of numbers or address, it simple has an "x". If you guys still get errors please tell me? It works fine here.
Hello, this is Crash41596 "The guy who discovered the turtle soup skip". I would like to join in on the tas. I do have a very optimized route for this run that I would like to share and some what execute.
Route
-----------------------------------
Glimmer 100%
Summer Forest 1
- Get half of the gems in the first area(Due to needing swim), then continue to where Elora is. Then jump down and get the gems on the ground, go up the stairs get the one gem next to the teleporters,proceed and get the 2 baskets then get the 2 gems behind colossus.
Colossus 100%Summer Forest 2
-Pay for swim then clear out the area next to the idol springs.
Idol Springs 100%Summer Forest 3
-Do hunter's challenge then do a double jump through the building, bringing you back to the start of summer forest, clear out that area, then go in the water and clear it out getting the orb, then clear out the area below colossus and continue normally to hurricos collecting gems.
Hurricos 100%Sunny Beach 100%
-Use turtle soup skip http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jCC1S2cO22c also possible while flaming the turtle then jumping on it, then doing a double jump.
Summer Forest 4
-Collect what ever gems are before Ocean Speedway
Ocean Speedway
-I remember having a very good route for this. It's probably in my speedrun some where. I always manage to get a sub 1m
Summer Forest 5
Collect all the gems before the orb, then get the orb, then double jump on to the aquaria tower's barrier, then do the charge swim in air with the water next to the sunny beach area, then get the orb up to along with the gems, then clear out all the gems before the boss.
Aquaria Tower's 100% Crush
-Abuse getting hit to keep Crush from moving from platform to platform, then when the platforms turn blue do not get hit and have him go to a blue pad, then abuse getting hit to keep him on the blue platforms, because the blue platforms are the fasted.
That is the route for the first hub world. The rest is pretty easy to route. Who knew the first hub of the game would be the most confusing to route.
This route is really good, but I think it could be a little bit better. Here are the changes I would make.
1. You can purchase the swim ability before entering Colossus quite easily without sacrificing time since you will already have 400 gems from Glimmer alone (from skipping Money Bags). It is faster to enter Idol Springs first anyway since you would otherwise have to run to Idol Springs and then run back toward Colossus again. You should collect all of the gems outside Glimmer (except the ones near the water tunnel) and collect all of the gems in the pit and on the stairs in the next room (running down the stairs and taking the whirlwind is the fastest). When you enter the area near Idol Springs, collect all of the gems around Idol Springs counter-clockwise, including the gem worth 25 nearby. Ignore the gems near Hunter for now. By then you should have enough gems to purchase the swim ability.
At this point, go back to Hunter and complete his challenge for the orb. Glide to the ledge above Colossus and take that orb. Then swim through the tunnel back toward Glimmer and collect those gems. At this point, you can either run back to Idol Springs or perform the swim in air glitch there and swim to Idol Springs, passing through the boundaries. I am not sure which method is faster. Using the swim method, you could pick up the lone red gem to the left when you enter the Idol Springs area (near where the portals to Autumn Plains and Winter Tundra would be) that you probably missed. This can be collected without swaying from your path toward Idol Springs if you are swimming through the air (and through walls), but will require a very minor detour if you run back. After Idol Springs, finish up Colossus (break the two boxes and on the way there and grab the two hidden gems before entering the level) and then finish up the gems in the water under Colossus before proceeding to the second half of Summer Forest.
2. You can perform the swim in air glitch from the door near Sunny Beach instead of on top of Aquaria Towers' wall. This method is most likely faster because you must go through this door to collect some loose gems anyway. This should be done after Sunny Beach and Hurricos. Before performing the glitch using the door, be sure to loot the three boxes near Money Bags over by Aquaria Towers. After performing the swim in air glitch and collecting the orb and gems above the ladder, proceed toward Ocean Speedway and continue on the route from there.
Here is the route I propose for Autumn Plains.
1. Crystal Glacier 100%
2. Skelos Badlands 100%
3. Metro Speedway 100%
4. Get the orb on top of the wall
5. Breeze Harbor 100% (Make sure all of the gems in the first part of Autumn Plains have been collected since we won't be returning to this part except for Zephyr.)
6. Purchase the climb ability.
7. Scorch 100%
8. Fracture Hills (We can't 100% the level on the first trip for obvious reasons. What to collect on the first trip is up for debate, but we should focus our time on the Summer Forest and Autumn Plains route first before breaking down individual levels.)
9. Magma Cone 100%
10. Shady Oasis (Same as Fracture Hills)
11. Icy Speedway 100%
12. Collect the gems on the roof and glide to the ledge with the orb near Zephyr. Then fly to Zephyr. At this point, Autumn Plains should be completed.
13. Zephyr 100%
14. Spyro should automatically be teleported near Gulp.
15. Defeat Gulp.
I might take a shot at making this TAS since it seems most people here are either taking a break or giving up completely. I never seem to see large projects through to the end such as this so there are no guarantees I could complete something this complicated, but I will take a shot nonetheless. Hopefully most of you guys are still active and will provide feedback on what I have added.
We've moved this discussion over to Skype actually. It's not dead. The routes listed on this page are very outdated. I wouldn't mind any help on it, but with small time savers always being found it's hard to just up and do it knowing you will immediately have to redo a part over and over.
You'll be sure to want to check out this video first ... It was the major find that completely rewrote the route.
Link to video
That saves a whopping 6 minutes (at the very least). You'll want to also check out the many RTA (Real Time Attack) speedruns by the group of spyro players, not just the world record one. To make it simple, don't got to SDA -- it's run is slow compared to today's routes. You'll also want to check out Crash41596, SSBMstuff, Cyprys, and possibly others (who's names I forget haha) nevertheless you'll find the usual people who do things like rta on twitch.tv and SpeedRunsLive.
I believe any% WR is 0:28'26"37 for non TAS. Lapogne's TAS on any% is really outdated too. Just to get a heads-up I think the 100% WR is around 2:15 but knowing me that's probably wrong, and I believe that in that they didn't use the early super flame (so estimated tas time is like 2:05).
Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6450
Location: The land down under.
Torn338 wrote:
You'll also want to check out Crash41596, SSBMstuff, Cyprys, and possibly others (who's names I forget haha) nevertheless you'll find the usual people who do things like rta on twitch.tv and SpeedRunsLive.
You'll also want to check out Crash41596, SSBMstuff, Cyprys, and possibly others (who's names I forget haha) nevertheless you'll find the usual people who do things like rta on twitch.tv and SpeedRunsLive.
Thanks for that, I searched for it but couldn't find it so I just said to look up the people... But it's not necessarily about just knowing the times but knowing what to do; hence why I said to search for their actual runs.
