Is this game supposed to have sound or did hourglass not produce audio?
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't
12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!"
Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet
MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish
[Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person
MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol
Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing
Wow, you actually did Iji! And killed Tor with a rocket, no less :)
I'd love some more submission text, e.g. on why you're using the easiest difficulty level. Also would love to see a full ribbon/poster/supercharge run at some point!
EZGames69 wrote:
I do not get any audio outside of Hourglass with the copy of the game the author of the TAS provided. However, when I delete the save file, I do get audio when launching the game. So it seems the included save file completely mutes audio (even though it's actually enabled in the menu).
Why would we need an unofficial mirror for the RNG? I would expect the official release to be used, not some random source.
Also, why was version 1.6 chosen? According to the game's changelog, the latest version (1.7) has more weapons and Iji moves 20% faster, among other advantages.
It's the most widely-played version. Note from the changelog that the game was released september 2008 and had periodic patches until 1.6 was released on march 2010. Then nothing happens for seven years, and then suddenly v1.7 appears.
1.7 is a bit unusual. It changes pacifist gameplay from dodging enemies to shooting them with non-lethal weapons (i.e. the new "passive" weapons, but this doesn't strike me as useful for a TAS), and adds a new ending for pacifist players where after you defeat the final boss, an earlier boss walks in and one-shot kills you. Yes, Iji walks faster, but other than that I don't see any advantages to 1.7, and 1.6 remains the most common version.
So, it turns out the included save file has the audio completely disabled. The TAS also desyncs instantly if I try to play it back with audio. (btw, I do in fact get audio when running the game in Hourglass)
I'm not sure how I feel about this.
For reference, from a clean state, the save file holds this data upon exiting:
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
ZXCQWER00001000000959599595995959959590000000ASD
6.92360889100000E+0009
Ijicryption v2.2 (29/11/08)
WARNING: MANUALLY MODIFYING THIS SAVEFILE WILL MAKE IT CORRUPT
The save file the author included holds this instead:
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
0000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000000
ZXCQWER33110001024035299595995959959590000000ASD
5.41521070100000E+0009
Ijicryption v2.2 (29/11/08)
WARNING: MANUALLY MODIFYING THIS SAVEFILE WILL MAKE IT CORRUPT
(it also makes a "Records" menu entry appear in the main menu)
c-square wrote:
Isn't it supposed to be timed from power on?
It does, in fact, start from the moment the game window pops up. It's the same in libTAS.
..unless I misunderstood your question, in which case I apologise.
It does, in fact, start from the moment the game window pops up. It's the same in libTAS.
..unless I misunderstood your question, in which case I apologise.
DOS timing includes boot up of the OS, C64 timing includes loading of the game. I would think Windows and Linux timings would be the same for consistency. Or DOS and C64 timings could start from the first frame the game code is actually running.
DOS timing includes boot up of the OS, C64 timing includes loading of the game. I would think Windows and Linux timings would be the same for consistency. Or DOS and C64 timings could start from the first frame the game code is actually running.
Do you really want to include the whole Windows or Linux boot-up sequence, something that varies wildly between PCs (and even VMs)? You'd pretty much require the exact same setup as the author of the TAS, something that's pretty much infeasible. Not to mention it'd mean capturing the entire screen, not just the game.
By the way, the Doom TASes we have published on this site go straight into the game. No menus, no boot-up sequence.
With our current methods of emulation, DOS (via jpc-rr) and C64 timing should be guaranteed consistent from power-on and through loading; so long as the same disk images are used.
While I acknowledge that inclusion of these loading/boot sequences causes the published time of runs using those systems/emulators to be somewhat inflated in relation to actual gameplay, it's a minor issue because of the consistency.
For games using a program like libTAS (as opposed to a true emulator like jpc-rr), where boot-up can vary so drastically, I think it makes more sense not to include boot-up sequence in the timing. The only way to effectively compare runs using libTAS/Windows is starting from a point where consistency should be guaranteed which may be game-start instead of power-on.
I think I will redo the TAS in order to have the audio as well.
Well I'd say the music is worth it.
But if you plan on redoing things, maybe you should ask the community for input on (1) using version 1.6 or 1.7; (2) getting the good ending where you save Dan, or the bad one like you do now; (3) whether to use easiest or hardest difficulty; and (4) pacifist or no, as that's a fairly big deal in this game (and gives you the Massacre weapon for the endboss).
Now your run will probably acceptable regardless of these choices, but it never hurts getting some wider opinion on what people prefer seeing in a run. Good luck! :D
I think I will redo the TAS in order to have the audio as well.
Well I'd say the music is worth it.
But if you plan on redoing things, maybe you should ask the community for input on (1) using version 1.6 or 1.7; (2) getting the good ending where you save Dan, or the bad one like you do now; (3) whether to use easiest or hardest difficulty; and (4) pacifist or no, as that's a fairly big deal in this game (and gives you the Massacre weapon for the endboss).
Now your run will probably acceptable regardless of these choices, but it never hurts getting some wider opinion on what people prefer seeing in a run. Good luck! :D
(1) Only 1.6 works in houglass, I'd love to be able to do 1.7. If anyone can get 1.7 to work with savestates, please let me know.
(2, 3, 4) I think it only makes sence to do a TAS how the game is speedrun normally. This means normal difficulty and the route in the TAS. I will do a pacifist run seperately where I save Dan.
(2, 3, 4) I think it only makes sence to do a TAS how the game is speedrun normally.
I was hoping you'd have more of a reason behind this choice beyond "that's how some guys at speedrun.com did it".
For instance, this guy "normally" speedruns the game at the highest difficulty level, and while saving Dan, and using a different route; whereas that player and this one "normally" speedrun at the secret-higher-than-highest difficulty level (and activating the powered-up version of the final boss). So I'm curious why you picked your particular criteria instead of, say, these ones.
(2, 3, 4) I think it only makes sence to do a TAS how the game is speedrun normally.
I was hoping you'd have more of a reason behind this choice beyond "that's how some guys at speedrun.com did it".
For instance, this guy "normally" speedruns the game at the highest difficulty level, and while saving Dan, and using a different route; whereas that player and this one "normally" speedrun at the secret-higher-than-highest difficulty level (and activating the powered-up version of the final boss). So I'm curious why you picked your particular criteria instead of, say, these ones.
It's the fastest way to beat the game that's why. Playing on a higher difficulty would make many shortcuts unavailable. The bosses do not differ a whole lot, unless you do supercharge Tor but I don't think that's worth the extra time. Also those categories are not run and I like to see how big of an improvement TAS makes over human play.
Really all it does is makes shortcuts unavailable therefore making the run unneceserily longer.
According to the manual, 'extreme' difficulty does all of the following:
You can gain 3 levels per Sector
Cracking time is decreased by 4 seconds
Certain enemies attack at a very fast rate
Certain enemies almost always dodge/reflect projectiles
When failing to crack a security box: it has a 25% chance of exploding
When failing to crack a door: there's a 75% chance its Security will increase by 1
Red nanofields recover 1 HP
Bosses are very difficult
Nano Overloads do not exist
It strikes me that faster enemies, less health powerups, and very difficult bosses could make for a more exciting run. The manual doesn't mention anything about making shortcuts unavailable. For instance, Extreme still allows you enough levels to get a Nuke required for the shortcut for the level 5 boss...
For games using a program like libTAS (as opposed to a true emulator like jpc-rr), where boot-up can vary so drastically, I think it makes more sense not to include boot-up sequence in the timing. The only way to effectively compare runs using libTAS/Windows is starting from a point where consistency should be guaranteed which may be game-start instead of power-on.
Really all it does is makes shortcuts unavailable therefore making the run unneceserily longer.
According to the manual, 'extreme' difficulty does all of the following:
You can gain 3 levels per Sector
Cracking time is decreased by 4 seconds
Certain enemies attack at a very fast rate
Certain enemies almost always dodge/reflect projectiles
When failing to crack a security box: it has a 25% chance of exploding
When failing to crack a door: there's a 75% chance its Security will increase by 1
Red nanofields recover 1 HP
Bosses are very difficult
Nano Overloads do not exist
It strikes me that faster enemies, less health powerups, and very difficult bosses could make for a more exciting run. The manual doesn't mention anything about making shortcuts unavailable. For instance, Extreme still allows you enough levels to get a Nuke required for the shortcut for the level 5 boss...
I would do ultimortal difficulty if I went for any higher difficulty. Am considering doing that once I'm done with this run. Maybe a 2 HP run.
Matslo123 has the ability to cancel it himself, but decided to change the text to link to the new submission for some reason.
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't
12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!"
Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet
MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish
[Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person
MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol
Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing
