(Link to video)
Submission Text Full Submission Page

Knuckles in Sonic The Hedgehog TAS in 14:08.33 by McBobX

Goals

  • Aims for in-game time instead of real time
  • Takes damage to save time
  • Unofficiel Game
  • Genre:Action
  • Genre:Platforme

Comments

This is my first Sega Genesis and Sonic run. Knuckles in Sonic The Hedgehog is a hack of Sonic The Hedgehog which replace the main caracter (Sonic) with a suboptimal one (Knuckles) with new movements and abilities. This is an improvement of 2197 frames or 36.61s due to use a new zipping method and new zips in some acts.

Enjoy the run

feos: This run is faster than the 6-year-old movie. And it uses newer tricks than that one. But it seems the latest techniques found in Knuckles in Sonic for the last few years were not examined at all. Because this submission loses time to the existing WIPs. The newest times are reported in these threads [dead links removed]. In MZ1 this submission loses more than 2 seconds.
If the losses were insignificant, this submission could have been published, but there are too much missed time savers that are known and public, so I consider the losses significant. The viewers' response seen in posts and especially votes also didn't show much support towards publishing this submission until the faster one is done. I advice to do research and beat (or at least match) the existing records before submitting. Rejecting for sub-optimality, even though it does improve the 6-year-old movie, as happened for example here.

Show more

Hide
Posted: 8/10/2013 3:30 PM
Quote
TASVideoAgent
They/Them
Moderator
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 15626
Location: 127.0.0.1
This topic is for the purpose of discussing #4041: McBobX's Genesis Knuckles in Sonic the Hedgehog in 14:09.43
Posted: 8/10/2013 5:27 PM
Quote
SmashManiac
Player (13)
Joined: 6/17/2006
Posts: 510
I love this hack! Also, this looks very well optimized! Congratulations and yes vote! :)
The BIG List of Video Game Randomizers
Posted: 8/10/2013 5:29 PM
Quote
WST
She/Her
Active player (490)
Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1697
Location: RU · ID · AM
Sorry for disappointing a Sonic TASer again today, but once again it’s a very clear No from me. First, this sumbission doesn’t beat the latest Qwerty’s results. Second, it even does not abuse all zips and tricks known today. Third, it does not look as a pacifist run. Is it supposed to be a regular TAS? Maybe, but it’s still not good enough. I’d suggest the author better join Qwerty’s WIP and help by contributing input into his project.
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2 my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)
Posted: 8/10/2013 6:24 PM
Quote
Tangent
Joined: 3/9/2009
Posts: 530
WST wrote:
Sorry for disappointing a Sonic TASer again today, but once again it’s a very clear No from me. First, this sumbission doesn’t beat the latest Qwerty’s results. Second, it even does not abuse all zips and tricks known today. Third, it does not look as a pacifist run. Is it supposed to be a regular TAS? Maybe, but it’s still not good enough. I’d suggest the author better join Qwerty’s WIP and help by contributing input into his project.
It's faster than the existing run though (from 2006...), so it's really a choice between a poor run or a worse run. It's not a situation that the rules address very well I don't think. It's very obviously not a pacifist run either. It kills enemies all the time. Mislabeled?
Posted: 8/10/2013 6:30 PM
Quote
WST
She/Her
Active player (490)
Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1697
Location: RU · ID · AM
I just said my opinion on it… Mr McBobX should have read the forum’s topic and participate in collaborative making a new TAS. He didn’t, and now we got this… A run, which is faster than a present one, but still slower than Qwerty’s WIPs. Anyway, I have nothing else to say. Again, this was just my opinion. Because if it was my own TAS project, I would not ignore the recent discoveries.
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2 my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)
Posted: 8/10/2013 7:05 PM
(Edited: 8/10/2013 7:09 PM)
Quote
feos
Site Admin, Skilled player (1255)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11495
Location: Lake Char­gogg­a­gogg­man­chaugg­a­gogg­chau­bun­a­gung­a­maugg
NES TAS of 2011
If it loses time to existing public WIPs it can be proven to be suboptimal. Unless the losses are considered insignificant :) Someone should help and post the losses per act.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 8/10/2013 7:08 PM
Quote
supersonicjc
Joined: 5/27/2012
Posts: 70
Location: Wisconsin
26 sec in the run already and for a pacifist run its a solid no since hes already killed 4 badnics im gonna keep trucking on the belief that its just mislabeled but so far its meh leaning no just on that
Posted: 8/10/2013 7:16 PM
Quote
WST
She/Her
Active player (490)
Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1697
Location: RU · ID · AM
feos wrote:
If it loses time to existing public WIPs it can be proven to be suboptimal. Unless the losses are considered insignificant :) Someone should help and post the losses per act.
See this message. The quthor did not share the gmv, yet, but the videos of his WIP are available here: http://ystc.ru/viewtopic.php?id=7 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lyMIKPc1sHg
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2 my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)
Posted: 8/10/2013 7:28 PM
Quote
SmashManiac
Player (13)
Joined: 6/17/2006
Posts: 510
I wasn't aware of the WIPs, but since this one is complete, my vote is to publish this one for now. And yeah, this isn't pacifist - lots of normal enemies killed. Not that it matters to me anyway; the run is pretty good regardless.
The BIG List of Video Game Randomizers
Posted: 8/10/2013 7:33 PM
Quote
supersonicjc
Joined: 5/27/2012
Posts: 70
Location: Wisconsin
I can look past the possibility that it was mislabeled but im going with a meh I got bored with it too quickly it wasn't bad but it wasn't good either.
Posted: 8/10/2013 11:03 PM
Quote
marzojr
He/Him
Experienced player (762)
Joined: 9/29/2008
Posts: 964
Location: 🇫🇷 France
Sega TASer of 2014 Sega TAS of 2014 Sega TASer of 2010 Sega TAS of 2010
MZ1 is clearly suboptimal by more than 2 seconds; LZ3 seems pretty suboptimal at the start (why not just zip through the badniks?); SBZ2 has a level wrap which was not used; the pause trick at FZ was not used to improve in-game time at the expense of real time, violating one of the goals of the tun; too many badniks were killed for this to qualify as a pacifist run. Unless the author addresses these points, I can only vote 'no'. Edit: also:
is a hack of Sonic The Hedgehog which replace the main caracter (Sonic) with a suboptimal one (Knuckles) with new movements and abilities.
(emphasis added) O>o. "Suboptimal" does not mean what you think it means; in Sonic 1, Knuckles is faster than Sonic and has lots of abilities Sonic does not; that is the opposite of "suboptimal".
Marzo Junior
Posted: 8/15/2013 2:45 PM
Quote
TASVideosGrue
They/Them
Joined: 10/1/2008
Posts: 2792
Location: The dark corners of the TASVideos server
om, nom, nom... minty!