Posted: 2/8/2014 5:38 PM
Post subject: Rerecord count definition
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redrum331
Joined: 5/11/2013
Posts: 1
I just read the definition from the glossary but want to make sure I got this right. So this is how many times the user loaded a save state and continued to play from that point? I saw one with almost 200,000 and thought how much time it must have taken. Thanks.
Posted: 2/8/2014 5:39 PM
Post subject: Re: Rerecord count definition
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Noxxa
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redrum331 wrote:
So this is how many times the user loaded a save state and continued to play from that point?
Yes.
http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa <dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects. <Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits <adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.
Posted: 2/8/2014 5:43 PM
Post subject: Re: Rerecord count definition
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Ilari
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redrum331 wrote:
I just read the definition from the glossary but want to make sure I got this right. So this is how many times the user loaded a save state and continued to play from that point? I saw one with almost 200,000 and thought how much time it must have taken. Thanks.
Well, although savestate loads made by Lua and other scripts shouldn't be counted, there are buggy runs that do count those, leading to greatly inflated rerecord count.
Posted: 2/8/2014 5:43 PM
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solarplex
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Piggybacking question. are TASes usually done all in one file? or somehow stitched together with cumulative rerecords added?
Posted: 2/8/2014 8:07 PM
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WST
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solarplex wrote:
Piggybacking question. are TASes usually done all in one file? or somehow stitched together with cumulative rerecords added?
Yep you can copy-paste certain parts of the input when you know what you are doing, but it’s completely up to the player to keep the consistent number of rerecords in such case. And most players do not really care about it, because everyone realizes that it’s not an indicator of the quality of the run. For instance, a TAS consuming 1000 rerecords, done by a very skilled player, can still be much better than a run consuming 10000 rerecords done by a newbie.
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Posted: 2/8/2014 8:09 PM
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Ilari
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solarplex wrote:
Piggybacking question. are TASes usually done all in one file? or somehow stitched together with cumulative rerecords added?
Usually done all in one file, given how nasty it is to stitch segments (for a lot of games it isn't even possible).
Posted: 2/8/2014 8:38 PM
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WST
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I’d also like to add that many TASers use version control. Originally it’s meant to be a tool for programmers, but TASing in many ways is really similar to programming: the player is trying to find the algorithm of beating the game as quickly as possible, and writing the input file just like programmers write source code. From attempt to attempt the player is changing his input. This can often result in mistakes, data loss and other issues. VCS greatly helps to solve all of them, as well as it solves the cooperation problem. When you make your TAS together with another player, usually you have to send him your WIPs many times, and receive tons of WIPs back from him. VCS helps to avoid this mess by directing your cooperation in the straight-forward way.
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2 my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)
Posted: 2/9/2014 10:40 AM
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Spikestuff
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Piggyback question too: What classifies unknown rerecord count?
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Posted: 2/9/2014 7:45 PM
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Duderson
Joined: 1/4/2014
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I saw a Mario 64 run and it had 1 million rerecords.
-Duderson
Posted: 2/9/2014 7:48 PM
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Ilari
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Spikestuff wrote:
Piggyback question too: What classifies unknown rerecord count?
The site shows rerecord count of 0 as unknown. Sometimes rerecord count is zeroed when it is obviously way off and the author doesn't have any idea to even approximate...
Posted: 2/10/2014 12:24 AM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
A thought: might it be worth tracking how many frames are "played" in the process of creating a TAS? Like, if the player plays 100 frames from the start of the movie, then reloads from 5 frames ago and rerecords those 5 frames, then the movie length would be 100 frames but the "total frames played" would be 105. Even more interesting would be tracking how many times each individual frame is played (i.e. the player recorded over frame 2040 a total of 50 times, etc.), so we could readily see which parts of a run caused the author the most trouble.
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Posted: 2/10/2014 3:25 AM
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jlun2
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Derakon wrote:
Even more interesting would be tracking how many times each individual frame is played (i.e. the player recorded over frame 2040 a total of 50 times, etc.), so we could readily see which parts of a run caused the author the most trouble.
That can be a problem if some trick/glitch was found that drastically cuts the movie's length though.
LLCoolDave wrote:
This seems to be competing for the "Worst looking TAS of 2011" Award.
Posted: 2/10/2014 4:47 AM
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Derakon
Joined: 7/2/2007
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Well, sure, it wouldn't be useful in many cases, but it still could be interesting to look at for some movies. Maybe not worth the effort of implementing though.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Posted: 2/10/2014 12:03 PM
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Warp
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Derakon wrote:
A thought: might it be worth tracking how many frames are "played" in the process of creating a TAS? Like, if the player plays 100 frames from the start of the movie, then reloads from 5 frames ago and rerecords those 5 frames, then the movie length would be 100 frames but the "total frames played" would be 105. Even more interesting would be tracking how many times each individual frame is played (i.e. the player recorded over frame 2040 a total of 50 times, etc.), so we could readily see which parts of a run caused the author the most trouble.
A graph of that would be interesting... :)
Posted: 2/10/2014 12:10 PM
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Warp
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Ilari wrote:
Sometimes rerecord count is zeroed when it is obviously way off and the author doesn't have any idea to even approximate...
Speaking of which, some publications might need zeroing...
Posted: 2/10/2014 4:03 PM
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WST
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Warp wrote:
A graph of that would be interesting... :)
…Or even a «heat map» of efforts rendered over the level map :)
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2 my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)