Submission Text Full Submission Page Publication Page

Movie Information

Jetpack is freeware and can be downloaded here: http://www.adeptsoftware.com/jetpack/
The game runs at 70 frames per second. Floating point module must NOT be loaded for the game to work properly. The default BIOS and floppy drive images are used. The input ends after a name is entered in the high score table.
  • Emulator: JPC-RR r11.8 rc1 (syncs on r11.7)
  • Aims for fastest time
  • Uses death to save time
  • Heavy luck manipulation
  • Genre: Platform
Image info (some useless files were removed from the freeware installation, it is unknown if this has an effect on the sync):
NOTE: This image uses a volume label. When you import the image, check the "Volume label" box and name it jetpack. 
Type: HDD
Tracks: 16
Sides: 16
Sectors: 63
Total Sectors: 16128
MD5: e4287f2e7f9d079de869be13eeb18642

Entry: N/A            N/A                                      20 /)
Vname: 19900101000000 N/A                                       0 jetpack)
Entry: 19900101000000 ec918833fd1032a59cda01d8d5eac55f       2306 /JETDEMO.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 2fb5d8421b228975b622162be33a6b4d      50602 /JETLEV.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 351d5f7893180e2925901c10b29dc1b6     141152 /JETPACK.EXE)
Entry: 19900101000000 1d1d658ed7e42225be4af6ad69afca7c      43559 /JETPACK0.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 a8f4cc17364adf2c51de655508d59eb8      30487 /JETPACK1.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 8f0b6d6797346fffd3a3c49782787508      33739 /JETPACK2.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 1d9472cea0da9bb049f40a27d71d9c25      38840 /JETPACK3.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 5944201eb8e997db20f57d7c3137710b      21048 /JETPACK4.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 70d1ab65d2807e59f76ba4cbcedd3447      17686 /JETPACK5.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 a958ca5da57a325119d3cbac70b116e5        785 /JETPAL.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 8a70bb766a132bed263ebb7df53ccaf0      72273 /JETSOUND.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 4b753c31504703a90bf1bfc737f1a4fb      11182 /JSWITCH.EXE)
Entry: 19900101000000 eee0c3907ac09624f7546ddd1464b266      40235 /SCLM.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 93b885adfe0da089cdf634904fd59f71          1 /_JETP_.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 3effbc43f424e28b2df650830ef05f9a         15 /_JETP_A.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 1d1d658ed7e42225be4af6ad69afca7c      43559 /_JETP_A0.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 50ae15f8c01a635f9de9e8c2a0a1c8fe         17 /_JETP_B.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 2f17ff3db151a0bae81b0902491ca5e7      43704 /_JETP_B0.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 0bf84430538b172a7d32530361209e4d         15 /_JETP_C.DAT)
Entry: 19900101000000 4c310670bdab05b99b77de2a9b8331fd      42811 /_JETP_C0.DAT)
After months of intense routing, the Jetpack TAS is finally completed! There are 100 levels in the full version of this game where the objective is to collect all green gems and then reach the exit.

Game Mechanics

The Jetpack

The jetpack can hold 10000 units of fuel, with 10 units being consumed for every frame of flight. Flying is necessary in most levels, as some places are unreachable by jumping, and it is almost always faster because the terminal flying velocity is higher than walking speed. Some levels introduce fuel chargers and drainers. In levels where fuel chargers are the only source of fuel, numerous tests must be done to determine if it is more time-efficient to charge and fly through certain sections or to not charge and walk instead.

Phaser

Phasing is a crucial mechanic for a few reasons. For one, it allows you to burn through certain blocks. The phaseable blocks are light and dark brick, pink blocks, and crates. The blocks return after a certain amount of time, except for crates, which are gone permanently. Phasing may also correct the player's position into the center of the nearest block, which can be used to shift momentum rapidly.

Teleporters

Teleport pads send you to another teleporter of the same color. There is a brief period of near invincibility before and after teleportation. In the delay before teleportation, gems can still be collected.

Barriers

Barriers are turned on and off by switches of the same color. There are two types of switches - buttons and floor switches. Buttons must be activated manually by the player, while floor switches toggle if they are walked over, either by the player or an enemy.

False Walls

Some blocks can be passed through and are indistingushable from regular blocks. Hidden passages are navigated with an extension of Ilari's Lua script which displays the player's position.

Exits

The exit opens up after all green gems in the level are collected. Contact with the bottom of the exit door will finish the level, even if the player is dead on arrival!

Movement

Understanding the physics in Jetpack is important in optimizing each level, and the movement in this game can be broken up into two major components: with and without fuel.

With Fuel

Flying velocity increases at a fixed rate per frame, eventually reaching a terminal velocity. When beginning to fly, velocity is built upon your initial velocity rather than being reset - starting your flying from a dead stop is slow, but getting a running start is much faster. Any mechanic that instantaneously increases velocity and ignores momentum can therefore be used to gain a significant speed boost when flying is initiated. These mechanics include:
  • Walking
  • Climbing ladders
  • Phasing position correction

Without Fuel

Moving around without fuel simply consists of jumping and falling. The jumping height and speed curve are fixed, for all intents and purposes. The speed curve starts off quite high but ends very low, so care must be taken to stop the jump as soon as possible, either by landing or attaching to a ladder. A jumping trick called "wiggling" is important in optimizing jumps, with the main mechanic being that your horizontal velocity can instantly be reversed in midair while jumping. The velocity continues to follow the speed curve but simply changes its sign when the direction is reversed. Hitting a wall resets the horizontal velocity to zero, but careful wiggling through narrow passages can maintain the speed curve and allow for quick entry and exit of narrow corridors. Falling off ledges is also an extremely useful fuelless mechanic because terminal velocity is instantly achieved when doing so. Flying is often stopped when approaching ledges simply to take advantage of this mechanic.

RNG

Randomness takes a large role in Jetpack, but is thankfully straightforward to manipulate. Anything that calls for a random number advances the RNG - the phasing animation is randomly chosen, so phasing is used as a simple RNG advancer than doesn't waste any time to execute. The relevant random mechanics in Jetpack include:
  • Powerups. These are extremely rare occurences that can make a serious impact on the time it takes to complete levels. Random fuel drops can turn levels that are intended to be fuelless into a joke, and stunners and invincibility allow you to bypass any enemy or hazard that is blocking a convenient path. Because of the extreme rarity of these powerups and the inability to advance the RNG quickly and accurately enough to cause them to appear, powerups are not manipulated in this TAS. Powerups may still appear by coincidence, and they are picked up if they save time.
  • Teleporters. If there is more than one possible destination, a random pad is chosen from the remaining teleporters of the same color. The destination can be manipulated not only for the player, but for enemies entering teleporters as well.
  • Trackbots. These are the enemies with treads that can climb ladders. At certain floor/ladder intersections, trackbots make a random decision about which path to take based on the player's position. Their behavior is still not fully understood, but their decisions are manipulated when possible.
  • Flitzers. These enemies are blue with a red dot pointing towards their current direction. Every 8 frames, or any time they hit a wall, one of 8 directions is randomly chosen. Flitzers typically take several manipulations to move out of the way due to their low speed.
  • Spinners. These are the spinning blades that move diagonally. At the beginning of each stage, their direction is randomly chosen out of the 4 diagonals. In order to manipulate them, you have to advance the RNG before exiting the previous level.

Advanced Jetpacking

I've covered all the basic mechanics for the purpose of watching this TAS, but for those who are looking for more in-depth information, we have assembled a comprehensive resources page for Jetpack that includes numerous tricks, enemy behavior, velocity and frame data, complete maps of all 100 levels, plus the programs and scripts used in the making of this project. I think I can say without a doubt it's the most complete technical resource for Jetpack on the web. Go here:
GameResources/DOS/Jetpack

Improvements

  • Powerup manipulation. Full control of powerups would be the largest time saver in the run, on the order of a few minutes. Fuel powerups would trivialize "jumping" levels, and invincibility would remove the danger of enemies and hazards.
  • New tricks. As the TAS continued, more and more tricks were discovered for optimizing movement, so there are some slight further optimizations that can be made in early levels.
  • Routes. All the levels in the TAS have multiple ways of completing them, whether it's major route changes or just minor room optimizations. Every level was thoroughly tested, but there may be even better routes available that were overlooked.

Special Thanks

This project was definitely not a solo effort, and here are the major contributors:
  • Nach. He has been a huge driving force, always interested in the progress and always pushing me to do better when the level WIPs had room for improvement. We've had tons of crazy (and fun) routing sessions together, making inane looking route maps and tweaking each other's routes - and the end result has been quite good! He also got the resources page set up and contributed lots to it, including separating Jetpack's map file into individual levels for easy mapping. How's Popcorn, you ask? It's fast. :)
  • Ilari. Without him this TAS would actually have been impossible, since he created JPC-RR in the first place! He also coded the Lua script for Jetpack, which provides some really useful information and was an invaluable resource. Ilari provided a lot of technical support to get the game and sound working properly - in fact, he's actually responsible for all input up until the beginning of the first level. He's always been interested in the run's progress and even released a new version of JPC-RR to make Lua scripts more stable. Big thanks!
  • Svimmer. A major trick finder and resources page contributor. He's always on my case to add new tricks I find to the page, and sometimes I got lax on it, but the project has been better off for his persistence!
  • creaothceann. Created really nice maps of all 100 levels for the resources page. Also uploaded a couple of the WIPs at half-speed.
  • hegyak. Created the level editor view maps of each level, which show false walls. Some levels would be an immense pain without these - just look at level 72!
  • Anyone who posted in the Jetpack thread, talked to me about the run on IRC, or even just watched some of the level WIPs on Youtube. Knowing that there are people out there that are interested in this definitely kept me going.
That's it! Enjoy the TAS, and perhaps look out for a second version at some point...
Nach: Even though I helped a lot early on in this run, much of it still surprised me, and the solutions and entertainment level of many of the later levels was not anticipated. Time and again, this TAS shows off some of the greatest heights in TASing, what with extreme route planning, having just enough fuel, pixel precision maneuvering, luck manipulation, and more.
Watching the run in slow motion, it's clear the run isn't perfect, there are slight mistakes here and there, and some of the tricks are not applied to the earlier levels. Despite that, the run really appears to be quite solid, and to the average person, this is far far beyond ordinary ability.
The responses to this run have for the most part been very positive, and I find this run to be our best TAS for the combination of action + puzzle platformer. Levels like It's not raining rain demonstrate luck manipulation and precision rarely even seen in a TAS. Many of the enemy packed levels are completed with an I control reality attitude which is only seen in our best TASs. Therefore, I am accepting for stars. Accepting.
Ilari: Processing...

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Posted: 10/25/2013 1:41 PM
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mklip2001
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Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 2227
Location: Georgia, USA
I'd forgotten I played this game a lot as a kid. My memory of the stages was fairly scattered. I feel like I usually played the game on a slower speed than 70FPS as well. I'm amazed how easy this makes some of the stages look. The action is frantic, especially when the player warps around a lot on the colored teleporters. Some very close calls are done with enemies. I would've liked to see the effects of more powerup manipulation, but this is quite a good "pure" run as it is. I agree with Bisqwit that the game gets repetitive, but in pieces the run is great. I'm voting a weak Yes in terms of entertainment, but I'm very impressed with the technical level. Good job!
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically. Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.) Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html) Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature! Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Posted: 10/26/2013 6:18 PM
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feos
Site Admin, Skilled player (1255)
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NES TAS of 2011
Voted No, extremely repetitive. EDIT: I documented how the starring process works for submissions currently. http://tasvideos.org/StarmanGuidelines.html#Submissions I don't see any of those checked for this submission. Which means it was accepted for stars by personal taste alone.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 10/26/2013 7:34 PM
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Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
feos wrote:
I documented how the starring process works for submissions currently. http://tasvideos.org/StarmanGuidelines.html#Submissions I don't see any of those checked for this submission. Which means it was accepted for stars by personal taste alone.
Unfortunately, you're confusing stars with the Wiki: NewcomerCorner. What was once stars is now recommended for newcomers. Wiki: Stars is now a tier. If you want to go over some key rule points:
The aim of this tier is to be approximately 5-10% of size of the Moon tier.
As ridiculous as the point is, to achieve it, we need to ensure 5-10% of each platform has enough stars. This game is in an under represented platform.
Aims to fulfill the site's goal of exposing as many people as possible to Tool-assisted Speedrun/Superplay movies as an art form.
In order to accomplish that, we need to ensure that genres are well represented too. Different people have different tastes in genres, and most of our stars are typical platformers. Other games need stars too to mix things up a bit.
Audience engagement is the largest factor (large number of voters, viewers, comments).
I agree that in this thread, there hasn't been too many responses yet. However the game's thread is the largest in the DOS forum, and there's only been this submission. Which shows a lot of comments. There's been a ton of talk on IRC too. Surprisingly enough, many people in that thread or who showed interest in IRC never even commented here. They probably figured they said all they needed to say.
Also requires approval of one or more admin dedicated to maintaining the Star list (starman role).
It has that.
Shining example of entertaining the audience, being impressive, showing a mastery of TAS techniques, using unexpected/seemingly impossible ideas, expertise of the game.
Most of the audience was entertained. It shows mastery of some of our top techniques which I already detailed in the acceptance. Fuel Shortage, Donkey Pack, It's not raining rain, and several other levels are all unexpected, seemingly impossible, and show real mastery of the game.
Game choice is a very large factor. The game must be one that engages the audience easily, and does not depend on prior knowledge of Tool-assisted literature; easily grabs attention. (A natural consequence is that game popularity will play a role here, since familiarity of the game increases audience engagement).
Some of those who never played the game and commented said they were well enganged. Those who did play DOS games (Why the heck are there so few DOS gamers on this site???) mentioned how much they loved it. At the very least, I'd say DOS gamers have showed tremendous support for the game, and it was popular in the 90s.
Game choice must be one that allows for a variety of TAS techniques, strategies, and ideas. In other words, it must be difficult to make an optimized TAS.
It is extremely difficult to optimize to this level. Just see how much data was collected, and how much route planned went into this.
Goal choice must be one that is easily understood and clear to the audience. Goal choices must not be too esoteric. It must cater to the average user rather than the TAS experts of the given game.
Normal goal choice, and average players of this game loved it.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 10/26/2013 7:39 PM
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feos
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NES TAS of 2011
Did I try to base my objection on the starman guidelines that existed earlier? I based it on the order the new movies are starred now. If you think the order is untrue, discuss it. I was (and am) acting star-wise based on the old guidelines + some vocal tips from adelikat + what I wrote there an hour ago.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 10/26/2013 7:44 PM
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Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
feos wrote:
Did I try to base my objection on the starman guidelines that existed earlier?
You linked to the page for it, so it certainly seems that way. And in any case, this run hits practically every applicable point in "Qualities of starred movies" on that page. Let me also stress this quote from the page there: "The starred movies should consist of many different genres, not just platform games. Ensure that there's some puzzles and RPGs on the list as well." Based on that, I weighed less negativity regarding the genre, or how the game isn't as flashy as modern games.
feos wrote:
I based it on the order the new movies are starred now. If you think the order is untrue, discuss it.
I have no idea what this means.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 10/26/2013 7:50 PM
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feos
Site Admin, Skilled player (1255)
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NES TAS of 2011
Nach wrote:
feos wrote:
Did I try to base my objection on the starman guidelines that existed earlier?
You linked to the page for it, so it certainly seems that way.
You seem to have missed the #Submissions part, linking to what I have added.
Nach wrote:
feos wrote:
I based it on the order the new movies are starred now. If you think the order is untrue, discuss it.
I have no idea what this means.
Once new movie is submitted/published, there are several ways to figure out whether it should be starred or not.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 10/26/2013 7:53 PM
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Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
feos wrote:
I documented how the starring process works for submissions currently. http://tasvideos.org/StarmanGuidelines.html#Submissions
I see you just added that new section today. I take issue with you using your brand new section to enforce your opinion. I also take issue that you decided to blur the line between recommended for newcomers and the star tier in that paragraph. The rest of the page speaks about the old idea of a star, which is now the newcomer corner. You new paragraph is the only one to mention a tier. Rereading your paragraph there, it ties extremely poorly into the rest of the page. You're shoehorning a whole new concept into the old one and misapplying it. I recommend deleting the paragraph, or rewriting it to fit the older terminology, or rewriting the entire page to fit the new terminology.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 10/26/2013 8:00 PM
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feos
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NES TAS of 2011
Are you deliberately ignoring the point about the order a new movie is currently starred by? There are things that help the starman know it needs a star. Having ~100 votes was mentioned by adelikat in IRC many times, and it does work. Needing SOME requests from users to star it also is the necessary reason to star something. And the guidelines you're now quotting are a year old, they were written before tier system was introduced. Being guidelines means they are no rules, you don't star all movies that meet the criteria. Because ther is the 10% quota, and some feedback threshold (comments/votes/ratings).
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 10/26/2013 8:03 PM
Quote
Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
feos wrote:
Are you deliberately ignoring the point about the order a new movie is currently starred by? There are things that help the starman know it needs a star. Having ~100 votes was mentioned by adelikat in IRC many times, and it does work. Needing SOME requests from users to star it also is the necessary reason to star something.
You seem to be deliberately combining newcomer corner and star tier.
feos wrote:
And the guidelines you're now quotting are a year old, they were written before tier system was introduced.
My quotes from above are not from the Starman page (which I wrote), but from the Star Tier page. Are you saying the tier system is now also out of date, and we have a new system? I did not accept this for newcomer corner (which was the former concept of a star), I accepted it for the star tier (the new concept).
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 10/26/2013 8:07 PM
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feos
Site Admin, Skilled player (1255)
Joined: 4/17/2010
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NES TAS of 2011
Your refuse to discuss what starman worked out in collaboration with the audience. Do whatever you like. I'm tuning out of this movie's fate.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 10/26/2013 11:49 PM
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Niamek
Joined: 10/23/2009
Posts: 545
Location: Where?
I loved the run, the begenning tas a little bit boring, but the middle of the run was very fun to Watch! you got a yes from me. I also think this run should get a star. I think thelevel achieved bu this run is a notch over the current moon runs.
Posted: 10/27/2013 12:58 AM
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Radiant
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Joined: 8/29/2011
Posts: 1206
Location: Amsterdam
feos wrote:
Are you deliberately ignoring the point about the order a new movie is currently starred by? There are things that help the starman know it needs a star. Having ~100 votes was mentioned by adelikat in IRC many times, and it does work. Needing SOME requests from users to star it also is the necessary reason to star something.
In that case, I request to star it. So now the game has, in fact, "some requests from users" to that extent :) Now I fully admit I'm not one of the rules-makers on this site, but it strikes me that unilaterally adding a new "guideline" to a wiki page and then using it in this thread the very next day is not a proper method. Is there any agreement to your four points? Because they strike me as contradictory to the rest of the page, as well as unworkable. In particular, your second point is redundant to the fourth, and "requesting star tier" is just not something people do in threads like these. Your third point of asking 100 votes is completely impractical for anything that's not an SNES or Genesis platform game. So by your new guideline, no new games can be starred ever. So it strikes me that this Jetpack run does meet the normal (older, agreed-upon) criteria for star tier, so I think the star here is fitting, and those four new points that were added to the star page yesterday should be stricken.
Indie game developer
Posted: 10/27/2013 1:01 AM
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Niamek
Joined: 10/23/2009
Posts: 545
Location: Where?
Radiant wrote:
"requesting star tier" is just not something people do in threads like these. Your third point of asking 100 votes is completely impractical for anything that's not an SNES or Genesis platform game. So by your new guideline, no new games can be starred ever.
Let's not forget that only Ocarina of time, super mario world Majora mask, or Super mario 64 achieve such high votes.(I guess)
Posted: 10/27/2013 7:24 AM
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feos
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NES TAS of 2011
Radiant wrote:
Now I fully admit I'm not one of the rules-makers on this site, but it strikes me that unilaterally adding a new "guideline" to a wiki page and then using it in this thread the very next day is not a proper method. Is there any agreement to your four points? Because they strike me as contradictory to the rest of the page, as well as unworkable. In particular, your second point is redundant to the fourth, and "requesting star tier" is just not something people do in threads like these. Your third point of asking 100 votes is completely impractical for anything that's not an SNES or Genesis platform game. So by your new guideline, no new games can be starred ever. So it strikes me that this Jetpack run does meet the normal (older, agreed-upon) criteria for star tier, so I think the star here is fitting, and those four new points that were added to the star page yesterday should be stricken.
It should not strike you, because while guidelines show what kind of movie is generally star worthy, one can't star all movies that satisfy the criteria. I always refer to the 10% quota made by adelikat. I once started to star all runs that satisfied the criteria in my eyes. It ended with adelikat telling me to destar the ones with the lowest entertainment rating to fit in the quota. I spent some hard hours figuring out what would then really mean a movie must be starred. And there you go, it must be starred if: - It is an obsoletion of an already starred movie. - There is huge audience support of starring it. - If the votes are around 100, it will be considered for starring. But there are exceptions. Most sonic runs get that much votes. But we can't star all of them, only the ones that are on different platforms or represent basically different type of star worthy content. - If there are just some requests to star a movie, it will be considered for starring. But if it gets low ratings after publication, it will not be starred, because support needs to be consistent between submission voters and publication raters to really rely on. The problem always seems to be with borderline cases. And with such, one really needs something more than personal opinion of a starman/admin to really star a movie.
Your third point of asking 100 votes is completely impractical for anything that's not an SNES or Genesis platform game. So by your new guideline, no new games can be starred ever.
No wonder you feel stroke. You misinterpret the sense of the points. This one does not say "if there is no 100 votes it will not be starred". It says, 100 votes is the easiest way to prove a movie must be considered for starring.
"requesting star tier" is just not something people do in threads like these.
Really? [2464] GC Sonic Adventure DX: Director's Cut "Sonic" by THC98 in 30:12.02 Post #356253 83 Yes votes. Huge support. Shouting gameplay. Rating: 8.9. [2436] SNES Super Metroid "100%" by Cpadolf in 1:08:15.74 Post #352061 Post #352110 Post #352274 Post #352297 Post #352304 Rating: 9.4. In the end it takes the star of the any% run. [2427] DS Super Scribblenauts "playaround" by Chef_Stef & Kiwisauce in 1:01:52.63 Post #351960 Rating: 8.6. Support in posts. [2341] GBC Pokémon: Yellow Version "arbitrary code execution" by FractalFusion in 03:14.15 Post #342016 Post #342268 Post #342116 113 Yes votes. Rating: 9.0 (24 votes) [2421] NES Battle City "2 players" by NhatNM in 13:00.35 Pretty much like this submission, it looks like a clear star to an admin/starman. But I didn't star it until it got clear ratings of 7.9, with 14.5 votes, as in after publication. [2368] Windows VVVVVV by Masterjun in 13:30.25 Huge support. 102 Yes votes. Rating: 8.0 (12 votes) [2430] PSX Warcraft II: The Dark Saga "Orc Campaign" by Flip in 1:32:51.75 Post #351534 Post #351960 Rating: 7.7 (6 votes) Too few raters to star right away, but it was considered for starring once it gets enough support.
it strikes me that unilaterally adding a new "guideline" to a wiki page and then using it in this thread the very next day is not a proper method.
There is also IRC where important discussions about orders occur between staff and users. And there are some orders that are still not documented on wiki. It doesn't mean those are invalid, or they only become valid in some time after they are documented. It is about practices and how staff does them. And yeah, it is in no way "unilateral" if it has adelikat's approval (who is too shy to post about it in threads like this).
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Posted: 10/27/2013 9:07 AM
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FractalFusion
Editor, Expert player (2080)
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 3284
Glitchy TAS of 2013 Gameboy TAS of 2013 PSX TASer of 2010
I request that this run would remain as a Moon-tier publication for at least a few days after publication. The movie ratings system is by far the surest indicator of a TAS's quality, and we'd better be sure of a Star-tier publication's quality, as mentioned the Starman Guidelines page:
Starred movies should above all else have very high entertainment ratings from many people, with little to none negative entertainment ratings.
In view of this, I'd say the only runs that should be permitted immediate star status are those that obsolete a star publication. Please also note that star statuses change over time. Personally, I think that this TAS, while well done, is not on the level of a star publication, for the following reasons: - This TAS (or at least the resulting encode), runs too fast for a viewer not accustomed to this game. It is difficult to follow especially when there are many enemies moving on the screen at once and the player uses the portals to warp around the screen. - A lot of levels require a thinking mind to comprehend the strategies used in this TAS and makes it hard to appreciate the work that has been put into this. I'm OK with thinking games, but not everyone is. The sheer amount of objects in some levels is partly a reason for this. - There are a lot of levels. A hundred of them, in fact. This game is decently entertaining for a game that is a hundred-level compilation, but most TASes of hundred-level games are boring for a reason. In addition, the maze design is worked to death in this game, and form the longest levels just because of how many orbs the developers threw into them. This contributes to the overall length of the TAS (half an hour, for a TAS where the player moves insanely fast).
Posted: 10/27/2013 10:10 AM
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Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
FractalFusion: You have several good points, I'll leave it as moon for now.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 10/27/2013 12:21 PM
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got4n
Experienced player (589)
Joined: 2/5/2011
Posts: 1417
Location: France
TAS of 2017 First edition TAS of 2017 PSX TAS of 2017 Rookie of 2013
Know the movie has been accepted, but for entertain I have to vote NO, did not find this fun.
Current: Rayman 3 maybe? idk xD Paused: N64 Rayman 2 (with Funnyhair) GBA SMA 4 : E Reader (With TehSeven) TASVideos is like a quicksand, you get in, but you cannot quit the sand
Posted: 10/27/2013 2:09 PM
Post subject: Movie published
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TASVideoAgent
They/Them
Moderator
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 15628
Location: 127.0.0.1
This movie has been published. The posts before this message apply to the submission, and posts after this message apply to the published movie. ---- [2473] DOS Jetpack by slamo in 32:22.55
Posted: 10/27/2013 3:25 PM
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Niamek
Joined: 10/23/2009
Posts: 545
Location: Where?
Glitch abuse? which one? I didn't see a single glitch in the run.
Posted: 10/27/2013 6:10 PM
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hopper
Joined: 11/15/2004
Posts: 804
Location: Canada
I've been waiting for this run, but the YouTube video definitely looks too fast. I would never have gotten very far if gameplay was that fast.
TASing or playing back a DOS game? Make sure your files match the archive at RGB Classic Games.
Posted: 10/27/2013 6:47 PM
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Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
Don't forget to rate the movie: http://tasvideos.org/rating.exe/my/2473 There are slow motion encode on YouTube. Link to video
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 10/27/2013 9:42 PM
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Patashu
He/Him
Joined: 10/2/2005
Posts: 4045
niamek wrote:
Glitch abuse? which one? I didn't see a single glitch in the run.
Is using the phaser to align you with the nearest tile to move faster a glitch, or just clever?
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
Posted: 10/27/2013 10:31 PM
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Radiant
Player (26)
Joined: 8/29/2011
Posts: 1206
Location: Amsterdam
niamek wrote:
Glitch abuse? which one? I didn't see a single glitch in the run.
How about exiting the level while already dead?
Indie game developer
Posted: 10/28/2013 9:18 PM
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FractalFusion
Editor, Expert player (2080)
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 3284
Glitchy TAS of 2013 Gameboy TAS of 2013 PSX TASer of 2010
There are a few glitches around (exiting while dead, teleport invulnerability/picking up items, clipping glitches like Level 33 - Donkey Pack) as well as some general physics exploits. None of them are what I would call major though (no zips, levels skipped over, or breaking of the game). I'll remove the "heavy glitch abuse" tag.
Posted: 10/29/2013 2:33 AM
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JoLiKMC
Joined: 11/20/2004
Posts: 236
Location: United States
Bisqwit wrote:
I can honestly not see what makes this such an anticipated TAS. Sure this game presents an optimization problem -- how to navigate a maze in the fastest manner... But it gets boring after some manner of time. Undoubtedly the movie presents a style of play that is really difficult for an unassisted speedrunner -- things often go a little too fast in this run to even think --, which may appeal to people who have played this game though.
1. You can adjust the gameplay speed manually. (Not sure if you knew that or not... ^_^;) However, this game was played at one of the higher speeds (if not the highest possible speed), likely to make things go faster than they would if a person were playing. Surprisingly, it works well enough for this kind of game. You lose track of the player once or twice, but you don't really lose focus on the actions for too long! 2. I personally got really excited when I saw this was posted -- so excited, in fact, I immediately shared it with the folks over at the Jetpack HQ, home if the up-and-coming game Jetpack 2! I just hope they'll appreciate it as much as I do... I know not everyone sees a TAS and understands it's not "a cheater movie". (I actually put a header on my forum post pointing this out and linking to this site's "About" section for that reason, in fact.) I'll give this a watch soon. I'm already watching something right now, but man! I'm super excited about this! X3
I'm not that hard to find... if you know where to look. -=( http://jolikmc.tumblr.com )=-
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