I don't seeing the Deku Tree cutscene skip as a viable option, considering you have to have bombs and a bottle, which means Link would have already left the forest in the first place and got to Dodongo Caverns. Unless we can use Chus instead or do bottle adventure, but if we did BA/RBA we would have to collect a bottle, which means we left the forest already as well.
But some of the others look promising. Warping to Forest Temple from Fire Temple...interesting
we also figured out, that doing the CS skip in dodongo's cavern warps to gerudo's training, a possible faster route to the spirit temple.
One downside, though. I have tested this on Mupen and the normal cutscene skips work nicely. When you do a cutscene skip, that is linked to a wrong warp (fire temple, deku tree, dodongo's cavern) the game froze for me. This applies to fire temple and dodongo's cavern. deku tree worked nicely, though.
Joined: 7/12/2009
Posts: 181
Location: São Paulo, Brazil
MrGrunz wrote:
we also figured out, that doing the CS skip in dodongo's cavern warps to gerudo's training, a possible faster route to the spirit temple.
One downside, though. I have tested this on Mupen and the normal cutscene skips work nicely. When you do a cutscene skip, that is linked to a wrong warp (fire temple, deku tree, dodongo's cavern) the game froze for me. This applies to fire temple and dodongo's cavern. deku tree worked nicely, though.
MUST FIX MUPEN.
I know that these cutscene skips can be done on console, but people are testing then all on consoles too? These OOT console players never cease to amuse me.
(or does it simply work on another emulator?)
we also figured out, that doing the CS skip in dodongo's cavern warps to gerudo's training, a possible faster route to the spirit temple.
One downside, though. I have tested this on Mupen and the normal cutscene skips work nicely. When you do a cutscene skip, that is linked to a wrong warp (fire temple, deku tree, dodongo's cavern) the game froze for me. This applies to fire temple and dodongo's cavern. deku tree worked nicely, though.
MUST FIX MUPEN.
I know that these cutscene skips can be done on console, but people are testing then all on consoles too? These OOT console players never cease to amuse me.
(or does it simply work on another emulator?)
Could have been tested with project 64.
Dolphin works quite well now though, so there's always the GC version if it doesn't work out on mupen.
I remember reading through a site (can't find the link) a few years back which disassembled an OoT rom proving what was done here is more than possible. However, it was always assumed that it was impossible to be manipulate these addresses.
Does the trick involve using that specific fire warp?
I can see some logistical route planning nightmares coming up. After all, you need to beat the Forest Temple to be able to do BA and you need to do the egg timer glitch to avoid having to sit through one of the longest cutscenes in the game.
EDIT: It turns out using the DC warp is the fastest.
The "Faraoes wind straight to credits skip" reminds me of the glitch recently discovered in Super Mario World for snes that skipped straight to the ending.
I believe the TAS which utilized this glitch in SMW could not replace the run that beat the game normally, justified by the argument that you are not actually beating the game, just skipping to the credits.
for those interested:
you wrongwarp off of blue warps by casting FW on B and teleporting away at a proper timing. blue warps have different results
wrongwarp off of LACS or ToT entrance (using DC warp) both send you to Link putting the sword away and the final part of the credits. that screenshot was mine, done on console. you stay adult link in the end section which is awesome. the part before it has the wrong room loaded so it looks nuts.
FW B off of LACS seems good to me because you need magic anyway to cast FW, and broken sword is one trade item away
problem: KD must be killed and can only be killed via sword, stick, or hammer. stick B (VC / GCN) might be good option here, perhaps after saw but before magic
some wrongwarps are possible via death and ocarina items on the blue warp edge.
note you can also beat forest temple to BA FW on B.
I believe this will end up quite a bit faster than the current any% route. I don't feel it should be a separate category as large parts of it are the same
credits for the current findings with this trick go to: Christianf23, sockfolder, Exodus, Acryte, Cosmo, ZFG, magcius, Pheenoh, MrGrunz, aleckermit, Abahbob, sva16162, RingRush.
THIS IS THE DAY WE ALL WAITED FOR!
6,5 years of glitch hunting and it has finally been done: Light Arrow Skip.
We OoT guys are simply the best, I can't believe it :D
About a new TAS:
I haven't fully investigated this yet, but both fire temple and dodongo's cavern crashed for me on Mupen, when I tried to do the Wrong Warp. Deku Tree worked, though. So let's hope we also find a way to warp to the end credits using Deku Tree.
Deku Tree would be fasted any way, as you need either megaton hammer, a Sword or a Deku Stick to kill King Dodongo (Bombs won't work and we Farore's Wind on B at that point).
Gohma on the other hand can be killed with either Light Arrows or Deku Nuts, so we were good to go with Gohma.
For now we plan to do BA for Farore's Wind on B using the Light Arrow CS, so we would be able to archieve a time of around 40 minutes using Japanese rom.
I still hope, that not doing the trade quest and finishing Forest Temple instead to be able to do BA by getting child and adult again is quicker. We have to time this a bit.
What the...
Well if that makes it into a published run, it'll certainly be in its own Glitched category.
Yeah sure, because RBA is not glitched.
Actually RBA is way more glitched and this will only be slightly faster. I don't see this being a new category. We have MST for a full game run.
Yeah, considering the current any%, and the time difference here, i don't really see this being a new category.
I could be wrong, but I think people would consider this an own category, since you don't ever defeat the last boss. Just like mario world and pokemon yellow, you don't ever actually beat the final guy. I don't mind this taking the place of the rba any% run if everyone else agrees on this, but I think skipping killing gannon deserves it's own category.
Also good job finding this glitch guys!
I would prefer making any real decisions about "is this up-and-coming glitch run, if it's even possible, unique enough to warrant its own category", but when the question comes, it will hinge on this:
To warrant being kept, instead of obsoleted, the RBA run would need to be unique enough to stand out on its own. This is, I feel, the deciding factor here; the closer to the RBA run this glitched run gets, the less unique RBA feels, and the more appealing replacing it becomes.
Unlike the Super Mario World mentioned above, the question is just how much of the game is actually still there. SMW got a new category because the only run the glitch-run could have obsoleted was one that skipped no major sections of the game; a couple levels were bypassed through the Wings and Goal Sphere tricks, but the path was the same; get to the first Star Road and traverse it until the final level.
For the RBA run, this isn't the case. The run already uses so many glitches that every dungeon, save Ganon's Castle, is completely bypassed with a glitch. The route becomes more about setting up the glitch than it is about progressing the game.
And to a run that already skips eight dungeons and a mini-dungeon through glitches... what's one more?
First a movie gets submitted, and ends up accepted despite breaking rules other runs have been rejected for. And when I vote less than spectacularly on this movie, I become the victim of harassment and threats.
Yay, favoritism.
I'm not sure how to react to this new trick. Right now I'm leaning on "blows the mind, but in the end bores it". :\ I just hope it doesn't affect 100% or even MST (which I've heard they've been experimenting with via technicalities), turning them into just warping from one place to the next one one after another. Or even if it just leads to delaying a new run of the game even longer.
It'll be interesting to see where this goes in any case.
We do need to ask ourselves: where does the line of entertainment get drawn? You can only be surprised so many times, then it becomes repetitive. Is the purpose of TAS to prove a point, to see just how many orifices the game can violated in, and which leads to the finish (regardless of how big or how small) the fastest? Or are they here to amuse, said violation being a vessel to show off an impressive way to beat the game?
From what I understand, the force behind this glitch is to be able to warp from place to place, from certain locations. This is cool and the skipping of the Light Arrows is long-awaited, yes, but in a massive run, at what point does it stop being interesting? At what point would it take over a run, and interfere with showing off other aspects, glitches, and crazy gameplay of the game?
On a less dramatic/more serious note, I'd personally view this kind of warp like in Link's Awakening. Like, you can warp to the swamp via the Kennel, but it's unused in the normal run.
I guess what I'm saying is, I'm curious as to how this new trick is going to be viewed in terms of MST and 100%.
This run has more tricks and more of the actual game than the normal run. It also has a smaller cutscene to gameplay ratio.
"At what point does it stop being interesting" - almost objectively, this is more interesting than the current run. You have to do almost everything you did in the any% run before Ganon's Tower just to set up Bottle Adventure, and then you have to do more tricks. And the glitched ending is hilarious lol
It is possible for this to change, but right now the run is so close to the current any% that I think it is foolish to make it a different category.
For MST, there are only a few warps you can do, none of which are very game breaking. The main purpose in MST is to skip cutscenes, not to use the warping effect.
