Post by Sonikkustar

Posted: 9/8/2010 10:32 PM

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arkiandruski

Reviewer, Active player (287)

Joined: 12/14/2006
Posts: 717

I'd be more inclined to agree with OOT's star if the user didn't constantly shuffle in and out of z targeting, which I found annoying; and if there were a subtitle track explaining what the author was doing (how the bottle trick works, why he decided to die in the temple of time, bomb glitches, objects and tasks that are being skipped, etc.). The other problem besides that is the long unskippable cutscenes.

My favorite movies

Posted: 1/16/2011 3:29 PM

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adelikat

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[1600] Arcade Teenage Mutant Ninja Turtles "4 players" by DarkKobold in 12:14.85 [1613] Arcade The Simpsons "4 players" by adelikat & DarkKobold in 13:37.73 As I tried to bring up some time ago, both of these movies are very similar in terms of entertainment value. Both are 4-player and popular arcade titles and both deserving of a star. Interestingly, at the time of this posting, they both have the exact same ratings. However, I think Simpsons has the edge in this battle, and I'm not the only one as evidenced by the audience. Simpsons was shown to be way more popular in the award votes, not to mention in the submsision votes. I gave the TMNT star to Simpsons. Feel free to discuss thoughts on this matter.

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Posted: 1/26/2011 10:56 PM

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Sonikkustar

Skilled player (1326)

Joined: 9/7/2007
Posts: 1354
Location: U.S.

I think that the Gimmick star should go to the best ending run instead of the any%. It has a better flow and shows off more of the game while still being intensively fast.

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Posted: 1/27/2011 2:39 AM

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adelikat

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I think I agree with this. Not to mention that the full run is still a short movie.

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Posted: 2/16/2011 6:13 PM

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sgrunt

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The awesomeness that is [1736] GBA Wario Land 4 "Hard" by andymac in 40:04.88 should be considered for a star.

Posted: 2/16/2011 7:26 PM

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

For my part I found that run to be rather tedious, but then I've never really been a fan of the Wario games. What was so particularly awesome about it that someone who hasn't played the game would appreciate? Mostly I just saw some wall glitching, but there are plenty of runs that provide that.

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Posted: 2/16/2011 7:42 PM

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Zeupar

Joined: 5/14/2007
Posts: 525
Location: Pisces-Cetus filament

Derakon wrote:

What was so particularly awesome about it that someone who hasn't played the game would appreciate?

It is an optimized TAS of an awesome varied fast-paced game which features clever solutions and awesome tricks which, in my opinion, would be noticed and appreciated by people who have not played the game. It looks like you didn't, though. :/

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Posted: 2/16/2011 7:47 PM

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Baxter

Skilled player (1410)

Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821

Should this be considered as a new star, or as replacing a present one? If it should replace one, which one? If it would be a new star, are there TASes similar to it that should also be considered?

http://tasvideos.org/Baxter.html

Posted: 2/17/2011 7:01 AM

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Pointless_Boy

Banned User

Joined: 6/18/2010
Posts: 183

sgrunt wrote:

The awesomeness that is [1736] GBA Wario Land 4 "Hard" by andymac in 40:04.88 should be considered for a star.

I found this run to be quite boring. There are plenty of platformers I've never played that I thoroughly enjoyed runs of, for example Kirby, Gimmick!, SMB64, Metroid, Super Metroid, Circle of the Moon ... most of which have stars. Wario Land comes nowhere close to those movies, at least in one person's opinion.

Posted: 2/17/2011 8:55 AM

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Warp

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Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

One thing I think should be considered is the length of the movie. As a reminder, starred movies are not a list of the best movies. They form a list of suggestions of where to start looking if you are a newcomer and want to get a feeling of the awesomeness of TASes. (Sometimes, and in fact very often, the two definitions may overlap. However, this is not necessarily always so, and I think the longer the movie is, the more disparity between the two goals.) Not that we already don't have starred movies which are even longer than this (currently the longest seems to be 1 hour 22 minutes long; perhaps it should be reconsidered if that's a bit too much for a first-time viewer). Perhaps there's nothing wrong in having two or three long starred TASes, but I'd say that the majority should be relatively short.

Posted: 2/25/2011 11:01 PM

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Baxter

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Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821

Hmm, I don't think there currently is enough support for giving Wario Land 4 a star. In the warpless Super Mario Bros 2 submission thread, it was suggested that this run should get a star. Any opinions on this? (And if so, would Mario become too dominant again in the starlist? Should another star go?)

http://tasvideos.org/Baxter.html

Posted: 2/26/2011 1:24 AM

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

For reference, currently-starred Mario games: Mario 64 0 stars Super Mario World any% Super Mario Brothers 3 warped These all have an excellent pedigree. If one had to go, I guess I'd take SMW's star, but it's not exactly an easy choice. I do think that the new SMB2 warpless run is on par with all of these, though.

Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.

Posted: 2/26/2011 2:04 AM

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Mukki

Skilled player (1098)

Joined: 8/26/2006
Posts: 1139
Location: United Kingdom

I think that the new SMB2U warpless run is certainly star-worthy. It's relatively short, it's quick, it's clever and it's a good game. However, I do think that 2D Mario would be over represented should it be given a star. The most appropriate stars for it to take would be SMW or SMB3. I believe that both SMB2U and SMB3 are star-worthy for different reasons. As long as a purpose of the star list is to introduce newcomers to the art of TASing it is difficult to justify the removal of the SMB3 'Warped' star as it is probably the run that brought most of us here. Though SMB2U is now more entertaining the game is underplayed in some parts of the world, in comparison with SMB3, and not played at all in others (in its original form at least). So, yeah, I agree with it taking the SMW star. As they are both somewhat similar games and, more importantly, would hold their respective stars for similar reasons (i.e. distinction in entertainment, rather than being of particular value to a newcomer).

http://tasvideos.org/Mukki.html

Posted: 2/26/2011 7:47 AM

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moozooh

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Posts: 5777
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I keep feeling that SMB3's star has grown to be the most senile and pointless recommendation in the history of TASVideos. Most of the movie time is dedicated to autoscrollers (which don't really change for the better over time), and there are nearly no new tricks compared to Genisto's 6 year old version that would be obvious to newcomers. All the improvements that have happened since then are marginal and esoteric enough to need particular explanation on why and how they're faster. Read this submission text if you don't believe me, and note the amount of frames saved by subpixel management, bankable savings, luck manipulation, lag reduction, and so on. At the same time, pretty much everybody who takes interest in TASes has either watched one of the SMB3 TASes prior to browsing the site, or watches it among the first movies. If they don't like, or haven't played, SMB3 in the first place, I don't think it goes too far to make the experience appreciable. SMB2 is a much better candidate in my opinion, no matter warped or warpless. It's no less optimized, but the glitches feel more fresh and unusual than anything seen in SMB3.

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Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 2/26/2011 10:06 AM

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Noxxa

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Joined: 8/14/2009
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I second the opinion of SMB2 warpless taking SMB3's star.

http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa <dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects. <Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits <adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.

Posted: 2/26/2011 10:51 AM

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scrimpeh

Editor, Skilled player (1439)

Joined: 3/31/2010
Posts: 2108

I wouldn't mind giving another Mario star to SMB2, really, so, by all means, go ahead.

Posted: 3/1/2011 7:37 AM

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DarkKobold

Skilled player (1651)

Joined: 11/15/2004
Posts: 2202
Location: Killjoy

moozooh wrote:

I keep feeling that SMB3's star has grown to be the most senile...

Pretty much this. So many more crazy things happen in SMB2U Warpless, comparatively.

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Posted: 3/1/2011 9:11 AM

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klmz

Editor, Emulator Coder, Expert player (2156)

Joined: 5/22/2007
Posts: 1134
Location: Glitchvania

moozooh wrote:

I keep feeling that SMB3's star has grown to be the most senile and pointless recommendation in the history of TASVideos. Most of the movie time is dedicated to autoscrollers (which don't really change for the better over time), and there are nearly no new tricks compared to Genisto's 6 year old version that would be obvious to newcomers. All the improvements that have happened since then are marginal and esoteric enough to need particular explanation on why and how they're faster. Read this submission text if you don't believe me, and note the amount of frames saved by subpixel management, bankable savings, luck manipulation, lag reduction, and so on. At the same time, pretty much everybody who takes interest in TASes has either watched one of the SMB3 TASes prior to browsing the site, or watches it among the first movies. If they don't like, or haven't played, SMB3 in the first place, I don't think it goes too far to make the experience appreciable. SMB2 is a much better candidate in my opinion, no matter warped or warpless. It's no less optimized, but the glitches feel more fresh and unusual than anything seen in SMB3.

We have the same idea this time.

<klmz> it reminds me of that people used to keep quoting adelikat's IRC statements in the old good days <adelikat> no doubt <adelikat> klmz, they still do

Posted: 3/1/2011 9:07 PM

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Sonikkustar

Skilled player (1326)

Joined: 9/7/2007
Posts: 1354
Location: U.S.

I do support the idea for SMB2U warpless getting a star, but I also fear that there is soon going to be too much Author/TASer favoritism. We already have authors having more than 4 stars now. So I think that a variety of authors should be considered when deciding for big runs like this. Just my thoughts.

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Posted: 3/1/2011 9:11 PM

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moozooh

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Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5777
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Curiously enough, that idea would actually introduce author favoritism. As it stands currently, the person in charge of star distribution (Baxter in this case) is impartial to the authorship of the TASes in question, only bearing in mind the actual characteristics of the TASes. If he were to pick which authors can't have any more stars, that would be negative favoritism. :)

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 3/1/2011 11:15 PM

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Baxter

Skilled player (1410)

Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821

Super Mario Bros 2 "Warpless" got Super Mario Bros 3's star. Read the above posts for an explanation how this came about.

Sonikkustar wrote:

I do support the idea for SMB2U warpless getting a star, but I also fear that there is soon going to be too much Author/TASer favoritism. We already have authors having more than 4 stars now. So I think that a variety of authors should be considered when deciding for big runs like this. Just my thoughts.

I think you could only speak of favoritism if the author was a factor in which run got a star, which is not the case. In any case... I decided to check who this person with more than 4 stars was. I'm quite glad that I checked, since given your post, the results are quite surprising. There are 7 authors with 2 star runs, and 35 people with 1 star run (notice that quite a lot of runs had multiple authors). Not a single TASer currently has more than 2 TASes with a star.

http://tasvideos.org/Baxter.html

Posted: 3/2/2011 7:34 AM

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moozooh

Senior Moderator

Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5777
Location: Away

Did you check Sonikkustar? He has a "star" right there in his name, I think we should factor that in the star distribution the next time. :) (Baxtar, lol)

Warp wrote:

Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.

Posted: 3/2/2011 8:05 AM

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Warp

Banned User

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

Sonikkustar wrote:

I do support the idea for SMB2U warpless getting a star, but I also fear that there is soon going to be too much Author/TASer favoritism. We already have authors having more than 4 stars now. So I think that a variety of authors should be considered when deciding for big runs like this.

I don't think autorship is in any way relevant in deciding which runs deserve a star. The contents matter, not who made it. Not giving too many stars to the same game franchise (read: Mario) might, on the other hand, be more relevant, as we should offer the first-time viewers not only variety in types of TAS but also variety in types of game.

Posted: 4/21/2011 7:12 AM

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Brandon

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Joined: 11/21/2010
Posts: 914
Location: Tennessee

Sonikkustar wrote:

Also, I think that [380] SNES Mega Man X & X2 by DeHackEd in 41:41.43 should lose it's star. I dont really know how to explain it, but something about it just bothers me.

Disagree completely. It was groundbreaking and inspired several other runs.

All the best, Brandon Evans

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