By extra heart piece, do you mean the one that makes it so you can get 4/3 as many pieced-up hearts?
I think Giant's Knife (and other intermediary upgrades) are irrelevant, because once you get the better thing, they are irrelevant.
Yes, you would end up with an extra 1/4 of a heart piece.
I agree, intermediate upgrades are not relevant. I think the end state is what matters in a 100% run. Though, it is debatable that the same is not true in a low% run...
eternal: You know, you don't have to get the Stone or Wallets to get chus, you can just skip talking to people for those prizes...
Anyways, what seemed like a good solution was "If you get one or more tokens, it counts as an item." Most people were fine with this, yet a few think that since the pause menu shows X GSes, you should count it as X items, and that the pause menu reigns supreme (to which I say: Egg+Cucco do not count as items as in the end you'll just have Zelda's Letter in your inventory, and the pause screen reigns supreme!)
Does a 100% run include catching a 21-pound fish?
What about catching the Hylian Loach?
don't you need for gold scale?
You only need a 15 or 16 pound fish to get the scale.
The Hylian Loach is completely optional, gives you a purple rupee if you catch it. The one I caught was about 35-pounds.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day,
Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
I feel like weighing in on this...
OmnipotentEntity wrote:
Does a 100% run include catching a 21-pound fish?
What about catching the Hylian Loach?
The loach isn't kept track of, IIRC, so it can't really count. As for the fish, see below
Does a 100% run include the Cow in Link's House?
I say yes. Others will disagree.
What about filling up the high score list in Link's House?
I suppose you could. I mean, we get 100 skulltulas anyways, and no reason not to go perfect on Gerudo Archery. If we do the cow, there's the horse race, so all that leaves is the fish (which wouldn't exactly be hard for a TAS), and the marathon man. Though, IIRC, you can get a 00:00 time against him with timer manipulation, so I'm not sure how good of an idea that one is. There's certainly a case for this.
Will you be obtaining partial upgrades as part of the 100%?
What about optional partial upgrades (like the Giant's Knife?)
Since they get replaced, it's hard to make a case for them counting.
Will you be obtaining all of the masks?
Considering you need the Mask of Truth to get a Deku Nut upgrade, yes.
Opening all of the chests?
I suppose you could, as the game does keep track of it, but I think we can all agree to forgo this one. Besides, there's no guarantee we even know where all the chests are, though UoT can help with that.
etc.
I do think maps and compasses should be part of 100%, though obviously many disagree. Still, they even show up on the start menu, so why do we neglect them? And before you say "they don't increase Link's abilities", may I remind you that neither do the Stone of Agony or any of the Gold Skulltula Tokens. And yet we require them anyways.
Also, about the 37th heart piece. Surely there is at least 1 Heart Piece that is slower than it. So why not just throw that one out and get the 37th instead? You'd still have 20 Hearts at the end, so no need to worry about
Lastly, I do suggest RBA be banned for 100%, considering you can very well RBA yourself songs and equipment.
The loach isn't kept track of, IIRC, so it can't really count. As for the fish,
I know... LOSE THE FISHERMAN'S HAT should be a requirement. And bomb every hole open, because they stay open, right?
petrie911 wrote:
Will you be obtaining partial upgrades as part of the 100%?
What about optional partial upgrades (like the Giant's Knife?)
Since they get replaced, it's hard to make a case for them counting.
I forget, what happens if you try to get the Giant's Knife when you already have the Biggoron's Sword?
petrie911 wrote:
Opening all of the chests?
I suppose you could, as the game does keep track of it, but I think we can all agree to forgo this one.
In minimalist runs, I like to joke that I'm leaving the treasure boxes unopened "for future adventurers". But if you think about it, leaving behind treasure boxes that contain refills of something makes for a better end state than taking them, because you'll have that many more sources of easy refills if you were to pick up the game and run around exploring again. So maybe you should only open the boxes that freeze you, so future players will never be frozen by them again. But... I guess that's the subtle distinction between "Get everything there is" and "Make the game as easy as possible by the last time you save" when defining 100%.
petrie911 wrote:
I do think maps and compasses should be part of 100%, though obviously many disagree. Still, they even show up on the start menu, so why do we neglect them? And before you say "they don't increase Link's abilities", may I remind you that neither do the Stone of Agony or any of the Gold Skulltula Tokens.
Maps and compasses increase Link's ability to know where he is and where to go next, and the Stone of Agony increases his ability to know where to bomb, of course!
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
37 heart pieces is definitely a must, and I'd guess you'd almost have to call it 101% then (or 100.somehting >_>). It wouldn't feel very 100%ish to get the 37th one and skip an ordinary one. That doesn't feel like completion at all to me, even though the inventory would be completed.
Anyway, a completed inventory isn't something that should determine whether 100% are achieved because you can RBA half of it, you can collect the same skultula a 100 times and other stuff that's just very silly.
I'd say collecting all heart pieces (at 37 different locations), all 100 skultulas, all upgrades, all items and finishing all temples, including Ice Cavern, the Bottom of the Well and the Gerudo Trainng Grounds should be very much required.
I'm kind of unsure about map and compass chests and even more unsure about all the others. Some of them are hidden quite well. I guess there's a difference between 100% just for the overworld and 100% dungeons and overworld. If you'd claim it to achieve 100% in dungeons, I just can't see anybody argueing against having to open all treasure chests.
I'd count Link's cow towards 100% too. Since the Marathon man can't be beaten, I'd wouldn't be necessary, but since a high score pops up after you've tried to beat him at least once, it still seems necessary.
I'd say any changes to your inventory, to the overworld and to the dungeons which normally can't be reversed and were intended by the programmers to be there should count towards 100%.
The 37th heart piece is unintended, but I'd still collect it, making it >100%.
By that definition you'd also have to visit all rooms in all dungeons, because while it's annoying, visiting those rooms still makes irreversible changes to your inventory in some way.
Whether using RBA and BA should be allowed is still a seperate matter. Because with that definition, even if you glitched yourself some items, you'd still have to collect them the ordinary way. I'm more for forbidding those glitches because they would just confuse the audience. Also, it saves the trouble of glitching 3 extra hearts in a very repetive and boring manner.
sry, to interrupt into the 100% discussion, but as I said, I'd start a new all temples TAS.
I'm finished with the rupee route and improved the rupee route of the RBA TAS by 150 frames. Those frames were saved by using a new route and using some quicker strategys at the rupee manipulation.
It would be good, if everybody of you trys to make this m64 synch:
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1696078323/OoT%20All%20Temples%20TAS.m64
It seems, that nobody can play it back succesfully apart from me, so I have to know, if that appears with all of you guys, too.
Joined: 1/16/2008
Posts: 358
Location: The Netherlands
As expected... it didn't synch with 1.2 (U) :P getting 1.0 as I'm typing this
edit: In 1.0 (U) it makes it to the sword and back, then after the crouch-tunnel it desynchs :(
MrGrunz: Same ROM and plugin settings caused it to sync all the way until you paused after getting the kokiri sword. After you left the menu it was no longer synced for me.
Anyway, a completed inventory isn't something that should determine whether 100% are achieved because you can RBA half of it, you can collect the same skultula a 100 times and other stuff that's just very silly.
So why don't you think it's silly to collect a duplicate 37th heart piece that you're not even supposed to be able to reach?
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
So why don't you think it's silly to collect a duplicate 37th heart piece that you're not even supposed to be able to reach?
Kuwaga wrote:
I'd say any changes to your inventory, to the overworld and to the dungeons which normally can't be reversed and were intended by the programmers to be there should count towards 100%.
RBA takes away some of the action we would get in a 100% run, collecting the 37th heart piece enhances it. Getting it is very entertaining imo, it also adds to that.
It isn't silly because it makes an irreversible change into your inventory and to the overworld. The only category of my definition that it doesn't fit is "intended by programmers". So it's of course a matter of taste.
For the sake of entertainment, I'd collect it. Most people don't even know there is an 37th heart piece, so it also adds a huge wtf factor to the average viewer.
RBAing things into your inventory and then claiming you achieved 100% doesn't work with the definition I proposed. By my definition it doesn't achieve 100%, it only makes it seem so if you look at the inventory. That's why I called it silly.
Collecting the 37th one and skipping an ordinary heart piece, is something I'd call 'silly' for similar reasons. Collecting heart pieces the usual way makes an irreversable change to the overworld - you can't pick them up a second time. If you can still collect a heart piece in the game (excluding the 37th one), is that really 100% just because your inventory is full? I don't think so.
It could be nobody is motivated because the goals of the run are so hard to define on a non-arbitrary basis.
Edit: To MrGrunz below me:
But people could already start planning it out.
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
MrGrunz wrote:
believe me one thing
before mupen plus is realased, nobody will ever do a 100% TAS :P
Why wouldn't someone? I would love to see a 100% tas.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
MrGrunz: I tried your all temples tas with the reset-rerecording v2 patch from the mupen64 forum, but it didn't work any better. That was the only patch I could find.
Could you host the version you're using to create the vid, or direct me to a place to get it or the patch?
Got a question for the any% TASers: whats the problem with taking damage on your way to the DoT, so as an adult you use the acute angles glitch to deathwarp out of the room? Is it that much slower? And deathwarps were already used in GuanoBowls run as an alternative to reseting.
