SMW (1 Star)SMW small only
SMW any%
I still think that small only is a better visual exhibit of TAS power (as well as being more entertaining IMO), and thus I think it should get the star. The any% run still isn't a bad pick though.
Super Metroid (1 Star)Super Metroid any% glitched
Super Metroid any% real time
Super Metroid any% ingame time
Super Metroid 100%
100% wins by a large margin here. If we can't have two 100% Metroid runs starred then I'd much rather have this 100% run and the MZM any% starred instead. I still prefer both the SM and MZM 100% runs starred though, since I think that they stand out above the rest.
Metroid (1 Star)Metroid Zero Mission 100%Metroid any%
Metroid Fusion 100%
I think that MF has too much downtime without having better gameplay than MZM, so the MZM 100% run wins here. If we can't have two 100% runs then I vote for MZM any%.
Megaman (1 Star)Mega Man 1
Mega Man 2
Both are very good picks, but in the end I think I prefer Mega Man 2, due to being easier to follow (while still being hilariously broken every here and there), as well as having better graphics, music and variation.
Zelda (1 Star)The Legend of ZeldaLinks Awakening DX
I prefer LoZ here, but once tompas new A Link to the Past run is done I'll most likely be voting for that one instead.
Castlevania (2 Stars)CastlevaniaCastlevania: HoD
Castlevania: CotM
Castvlevania and CotM for pretty much the same reason as moozooh. If anyone ever finished a all souls run of Aria of Sorrow I think that one has a good chance to replace one of them (NEW Castlevaina IMO)
Special concept (3 Stars)MMX+MMX2
GradiusKings Bounty
Monopoly
River City Ransom
Lost Vikings
I'd only give this category two stars as it looks now, in which case Gradius wins by a long shot, followed by the dual run.
SNES/Gens games (2 Stars)Biker Mice from MarsSparkster
Donkey Kong Country
Golden Axe
Rocket Knight Adventures
Comix Zone
The Mask
DKC any% and either RKA or Sparkster are those I prefer here.
N64 (1 Star)Majora’s MaskGoldeneye
With Mario 64 0 star being starred already, I'd say neither here. Right now N64 only needs one star.
Quick note on Umihara Kawase -- the sightseeing TAS already does the longest route possible through the game in terms of number of levels. There's a longer route time-wise, but that's just because a different set of levels is used which includes another boss. See the field map for more details.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Arguably MM1 is the most glitched game in the series, which is to say, it's so glitched it's actually incomprehensible. MM2 is also glitched but is noticeably easier on the brain, so I pick it over MM1.
OTOH, it might be a good idea to have at least one starred run with the notion that "when we say we abuse glitches, we really mean it", and the MM1 run is the quintessential example.
There are tons of no or only lightly glitched starred runs, so does it harm to have at least one which really shows off what glitch abuse is all about?
SMW (1 Star)SMW small only
SMW any%
What? 96 exit is the only one I liked. Now I hate this category. :(
Sonic (2 Stars)Sonic 3 & Knuckles
Sonic Advance 2
Sonic The Hedgehog
Sonic The Hedgehog 2
As one of the authors of the currently published Sonic 3 & Knuckles run, I do not believe it warrants a star. I believe Sonic the Hedgehog 2 is currently a better showcase of TASing. And Sonic Advance 2 is better than Sonic 1 for that purpose, as well.
Super Metroid (1 Star)Super Metroid 100%Metroid (1 Star)Metroid Zero Mission 100%Metroid any%
Metroid Fusion 100%
The Metroid Fusion 100% is the most different from the Super Metroid runs, and were it not for that consideration, I would probably prefer the fusion run to it. But even then it would be close.
Megaman (1 Star)Mega Man 1
Mega Man 2
Mega Man 2 has more glitch variety and more level variety. I don't understand why there's any debate on this at all...
Rockman and Forte (1 Star)Rockman and Forte any%
Rockman and Forte “100 CDs”
100 CDs. It shows off more of the game while still being incredibly surprising and optimized.
Zelda (1 Star)The Legend of ZeldaLinks Awakening DX
If we have to have a Zelda star, give it to Awakening DX. That or the glitched LttP run.
Castlevania (2 Stars)CastlevaniaCastlevania: HoD
Castlevania: CotMCircle of the Moon. Harmony of Dissonance is headache inducing from the clashing colors and bad sounds.
Wire TAS (1 Star)Ninja Five-0
Umihara KawaseSpiderman 3
Bionic Commando
Hmm. Maybe I should actually watch Ninja Five-o before coming back and demanding Umihara Kawase be insta-starred.
Special concept (3 Stars)MMX+MMX2
GradiusKings Bounty
Monopoly
River City Ransom
Lost Vikings
I'm going to vote against gradius in favor of Lost Vikings and King's Bounty.
NES games (5 Stars)Super Mario Bros 3 any%
Excitebike
Battle of OlympusNinja Gaiden 2
Darkwing Duck
Mega Man 5
Gimmick!
Super Mario Bros 2
Journey to Silius
Arkanoid “Warpless”
Legend of Zelda 2
Battletoads “2 player warpless”
Gimmick! and Journey to Silius both show off pretty cool TAS moves.
SNES/Gens games (2 Stars)Biker Mice from MarsSparkster
Donkey Kong Country
Golden Axe
Rocket Knight Adventures
Comix Zone
The Mask
See, I think the SMW category should be removed and one more star added here, so I could vote for SNES Sparkster/GENS Rocket Knight Adventures (whichever has more support) and have one to spare for Golden Axe.
N64 (1 Star)Majora’s MaskGoldeneye
Majora's Mask.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
You see, good games to play don't nececessarily make good movies to watch. [/biassed]
Castlevania:
I showed the old COTM "warpless", old COTM "warped" old HOD "maxim warped", JXQ's HOD "less warped", new HOD "any%" and new AOS "any%" to my friends. The results:
Four watched the old COTM "warpless":
* Two unfamiliar with Castlevania at all couldn't sit for it.
* One unfamiliar with Castlevania watched it whole: "It's good, though not very impressive."
* One familiar with it failed to watch the whole: "It feels good, but I have something more important to do now."
Four watched the old COTM "warped":
* Three unfamiliar with Castlevania at all commented "WT*!?"
* One familiar with Castlevania commented "LOL"
Two watched JXQ's HOD "less warped":
* One unfamiliar with Castlevania: "How could he make so many CRITICAL's!? Didn't he really cheat?"
* One familiar with GBA Castlevania: "How could he fly!?"
Three watched the old HOD "maxim warped":
* One unfamiliar with commented "WT*!? That's all!?"
* One only familiar with NES Castlevania demanded seeing more.
* One familiar with GBA Castlevania: "They really broke the game."
Only one watched the new HOD "any%":
* One familiar with GBA Castlevania: "I couldn't follow it very well. However I especially liked the floating".
Three watched the new AOS "any%":
* One unfamiliar with Castlevania at all: "LOL"
* One unfamiliar with Castlevania at all: "What's going on?"
* One familiar with GBA Castlevania: "You really broke it!"
It seemed that people unfamiliar with COTM didn't enjoy COTM "warpless" very well.
<klmz> it reminds me of that people used to keep quoting adelikat's IRC statements in the old good days
<adelikat> no doubt
<adelikat> klmz, they still do
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
The reason why I have picked the following games who should get a star are either a) they are brutally glitched to death or b) entertaining like no other run. Those who I haven't even bothered to comment or erased from Baxter's list is due to I don't feel they deserve a star because they don't fullfil my criteria.
Baxter wrote:
Instant stars (4 Stars)Excitebike
Super Mario 64 "0 star"
I agree with these.
Baxter wrote:
Sonic (2 Stars)Sonic 3 & Knuckles
Sonic Advance 2
Sonic The Hedgehog 2
I think these three should all get a star, especially Sonic 3 & Knuckles. Because that is in my opinion the greatest and most entertaining run of all time.
Baxter wrote:
Metroid (2 Stars)Super Metroid 100%
I would only give a star to the Super Metroid 100% run. The any% doesnt provide anything mind blowing in comparison to the 100% that it deserves its own star.
Baxter wrote:
Megaman (1 Star)Mega Man 1
Mega Man 2
Both of them, especially Mega Man 1.
Baxter wrote:
None of these deserves a star in my opinion, especially Spiderman 3.
NES games (3 Stars)
At the moment, I think Zelda 1 should only get a star.
Baxter wrote:
SNES games (2 Stars)Rockman and Forte "100 CDs"
Biker Mice from Mars
Both of them should get a star.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Joined: 6/5/2006
Posts: 188
Location: Malmö, Sweden
I agree with Aria getting a star. Even though it's the least Castlevania-ey of the Castlevania runs :P.
I just can't see CotM being that entertaining unless you're very familiar with the game. It's a great display of resource management, yes, but it's not fun to watch. The platforming is mediocre, barely any enemies are fought and all bosses are slaughtered with sheer luck(skeleton), which in itself is hilarious sure, but every boss?
The shorter glitched run would be better, but massive leveling after Dracula kills the pacing a bit.
HoD is murder for your eyes, and often save-resets kills it a bit. But it's fast-paced and has some confusing glitching. I'm actually kind of for starring the Maxim any% but King's Bounty takes precedence.
Also, after having watched Ninja Five-0 I can say that Umihara is the only wire TAS worthy of a star.
Even the best player is limited by the speed of his fingers, or his mind's ability to control them. But what happens when speed is not a factor, when theory becomes reality?
I added Aria of Sorrow to the Castlevania group.
@AngerFist: don't know if it changes much... but you seemed to have looked at the list on page 7, while there is an updated list on page 9... might change some things (or not).
Bezman wrote:
I still haven't watched every single run listed, but I'd like to agree with those who suggested a 'puzzle game' category.
Tetris Attack, Kirby's Avalanche, Wetrix or Tetrisphere would be great at showing how ridiculous these games get when being TAS'd.
On where this star should come from: arkiandruski wrote:
I'd take it away from either special concepts or N64 personally.
Do more people feel this group should be created? If yes, which star should it take? If yes, should for instance Arkanoid fall into this category?
It would also be possible to list some of these suggestions by Bezman in the special concept group, and keep the groups as they are. Any ideas?
I agree that CotM is not a very accessible TAS, and that if you're going to star a HoD TAS it should be as short as possible just because the sound and graphics are so horrendous.
I'm almost wondering if we should just wait for some SotN TASes to get published and see if they're star-worthy.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Here we go!
Instant stars (2 Stars)Super Mario 64 "0 star"
Gunstar Heroes "2 player"
Yai! Easy stars!
SMW (1 Star)SMW small only
SMW any%
I'll vote for the any%.
Sonic (2 Stars)Sonic 3 & Knuckles
Sonic Advance 2
Sonic The Hedgehog
Sonic The Hedgehog 2
Here I think we save time by directly starring Nitsuja. If the Sonic Advance 2 run is the one that requires a camera hack to follow Sonic, I guess it's hilarious enough to warrant a star. I still vote for Sonic 3 & Knuckles as my choice for "beat two games with one input", heh.
Super Metroid (1 Star)Super Metroid any% glitched
Super Metroid any% real time
Super Metroid any% ingame time
Super Metroid 100%
I would vote Super Metroid 100%, but only the version made by JXQ as the most recent one makes the mistake of taking away the input animation, which was the sole reason (for me) to watch it. If not, I vote for the any% glitched.
Metroid (1 Star)Metroid Zero Mission 100%Metroid any%
Metroid Fusion 100%The new Metroid Fusion 100% run was added here. At this point, Zero Mission is the most popular, so it's yellow. If you disagree with this, speak up! ;)I don't enjoy the Metroid series, so I haven't watched these, except the NES any%. I'll refrain from voting here.
Megaman (1 Star)Mega Man 1
Mega Man 2
I vote Mega Man 1 again, as it's the most broken game on this site.
Rockman and Forte (1 Star)Rockman and Forte any%
Rockman and Forte “100 CDs”
Not voting here, as I haven't watched these.
Zelda (1 Star)The Legend of ZeldaLinks Awakening DX
The problem with The Legend of Zelda is that the cool glitch is missing from the current run. I'll vote it anyways, but down know if it is a good candidate.
Castlevania (2 Stars)CastlevaniaCastlevania: Harmony of Dissonance
Castlevania: Circle of the Moon
Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow
Circle of the Moon has the best music and giant bones. NES Castlevania will get my vote instead of HoD because I've remembered how popular it was among those that played it, and HoD, hilarious as it is, looks and sounds like the banned episode of Pokemon.
Wire TAS (1 Star)Ninja Five-0
Umihara KawaseSpiderman 3
Bionic Commando
Ninja Five-O, though Bionic Commando kills hitler and aims at the cock.
Special concept (3 Stars)MMX+MMX2
GradiusKings Bounty
Monopoly
River City Ransom
Lost Vikings
Vote for Gradius, Monopoly, and Lost Vikings, and would also add River City Ransom. Vote against MMX+MMX2 because when shown side by side, the input for both games seems different all the time (that's why I said it sounds better than it plays). By the way, Lolo + Defender of the Crown also belongs to this concept. Lolo for the win!
NES games (5 Stars)Super Mario Bros 3 any%
Excitebike
Battle of OlympusNinja Gaiden 2
Darkwing Duck
Mega Man 5
Gimmick!
Super Mario Bros 2
Journey to Silius
Arkanoid “Warpless”
Legend of Zelda 2
Battletoads “2 player warpless”
Here I vote again for NES warpless Rygar for awesome glitches and music, SMB 3 any%, Ninja Gaiden 2 (though Ninja Gaiden has the best music theme ever), Zelda 2, and Excitebike.
SNES/Gens games (2 Stars)Biker Mice from MarsSparkster
Donkey Kong Country
Golden Axe
Rocket Knight Adventures
Comix Zone
The Mask
I vote for Golden Axe and Comix Zone.
N64 (1 Star)Majora’s MaskGoldeneye
None for now. The N64 section of this site is underwhelming. ._.
The problem with The Legend of Zelda is that the cool glitch is missing from the current run. I'll vote it anyways, but down know if it is a good candidate.
The second quest run could be starred also. If NES Zelda gets selected, I guess I will make a group containing first quest and second quest.
DrJones wrote:
By the way, Lolo + Defender of the Crown also belongs to this concept. Lolo for the win!
Yeah, but the fact that this completes more than one game doesn't make it starworthy ;). I bet I could beat over 10 games, while still completing Lolo as fast as possible... but I don't think it would add anything in entertainment.
Joined: 11/27/2004
Posts: 688
Location: WA State, USA
I shuffled some categories around and added a couple stars, thus bringing the total to 26.
Instant stars (2 Stars)
Super Mario 64 "0 star"
Gunstar Heroes
Good choices. I approve.
SMW (1 Star)
SMW small only or SMW any%
Flip a coin. Seriously.
Sonic (2 Stars)
I abstain due to unfamiliarity with the series and their movies.
Metroid (2 Stars)
Metroid II glitched
SM, MF, or MZM 100%
I'm surprised M2 glitched run wasn't nominated. It's one of the more literal examples of "breaking a game open." The 100% runs are likewise some of the best pieces of TASing on this site, but I feel that only one of them should have a star.
Megaman (2 Stars)
Mega Man 1
Mega Man X
MM1 has the best glitching, while MMX is the best non-glitched MM run on the site. I feel that the RM&F runs are too similar to MM1 (lots of zipping) to warrant a star.
Zelda (1 Star)
The Legend of Zelda
No contest.
Castlevania (2 Stars)
Castlevania 1
The most palatable of the GBA glitchfests
CV1 just shows how much of a tank Simon Belmont is. As far as the GBA games are concerned, I feel that one of the glitched runs should get a star, but I don't feel qualified to select one.
Wire TAS (1 Star)
Ninja Five-0 or Bionic Commando
Spiderman 3 is nauseating on several levels. No star for it.
Umihara has the best physics, but require knowledge of the game (which is very obscure) to understand.
Ninja Five-O and Bionic Commando both have a good balance between swinging and action. Both are good, but I'm leaning towards Five-O.
Special concept (3 Stars)
MMX+MMX2
Kings Bounty or Monopoly
Lost Vikings
- The dualrun needs no explanation.
- I'm leaning slightly towards the Monopoly run, mostly because the manipulation is more obvious.
- Lost Vikings is the best example of multiplayer coordination on the site.
Now, the tough decisions:
NES games (5 Stars)
Battle of Olympus
Gradius
Excitebike
Arkanoid “Warpless”
Gimmick! best ending
SMB3 is out because it doesn't collect 99 lives anymore. :(
Most of the rest don't really need any explanation. They are all very visibly obvious examples of tool-assistance, but the real reason I picked Gimmick! is because it's like Kirby, but even cuter. I just want to hug all the characters to death. :D
SNES/SMD games (3 Stars)
Rocket Knight Adventures
Golden Axe or Comix Zone
The Mask or a DKC run
Honestly, this category has given me the most trouble, since most of the runs I would've picked are in the other categories.
N64 (2 Star)
Goldeneye
Tetrisphere
Majoras Mask just feels too long, and we already have a starred Zelda run. Goldeneye is both quite popular and one of the only FPS runs on the site. Tetrisphere is just audiovisual insanity.
Nach wrote:
I also used to wake up every morning, open my curtains, and see the twin towers. And then one day, wasn't able to anymore, I'll never forget that.
I still haven't watched every single run listed, but I'd like to agree with those who suggested a 'puzzle game' category.
Tetris Attack, Kirby's Avalanche, Wetrix or Tetrisphere would be great at showing how ridiculous these games get when being TAS'd.
On where this star should come from: arkiandruski wrote:
I'd take it away from either special concepts or N64 personally.
Do more people feel this group should be created? If yes, which star should it take? If yes, should for instance Arkanoid fall into this category?
I think that if stars from groups should be deleted, it should be done in a way as to promote variety. If anything, Special Concepts deserves one more star imo.
Do Castlevania, Sonic and Metroid really need multiple stars? They may be considered great but the Sonic runs specially seem kinda similar to me. Why not give the star to something different and then just recommend a couple of other runs from that series in the run's description (as is already sometimes done).
P.S. I'd also second the votes for Bomberman. Another game that is significantly altered by being a TAS. Familiar to most players as a game, yet the run is full of surprises.
I'm just some random guy. Don't let my words get you riled - I have my opinions but they're only mine.
I think SMB should be starred, but it might just be because I like the game so much. It's a really popular game though and has some interesting glitches. I just feel a classic like that should be on the list anyway.
Super Mario Bros. console speedrunner
- Andrew Gardikis
I really agree that Mega Man 1 itself deservers a star over my previous Mega Man 2 run. Even Mega Man 2 is a classic itself but the movie is not so good and it lacks new strategies, glitches and such and Mega Man 1 run is technically really interesting and also gives the feeling how much games can be really glitched out. I would bet that many of the visitors will be surprised by that :)
Also thanks for Baxter for reminding me about this thread.
Instant stars (2 Stars)Super Mario 64 "0 star"
Gunstar Heroes "2 player"
They're near enough automatic
SMW (1 Star)SMW small only
SMW any%
I have to admit, I do dispute the right for SMW to have it's own category, but I'll say the any%
Sonic (2 Stars)Sonic 3 & Knuckles
Sonic Advance 2
Sonic The Hedgehog
Sonic The Hedgehog 2
I guess I'm repeating myself I'll say S3+K and Sonic 2
Super Metroid (1 Star)Super Metroid any% glitched
Super Metroid any% real time
Super Metroid any% ingame time
Super Metroid 100%
Glitched any%, it's boring but since it's shorter there is less ZZZZzzzz.
Metroid (1 Star)Metroid Zero Mission 100%Metroid any%
Metroid Fusion 100%
All the Metroids could have been grouped just like any other franchise, I'll say Metroid any% because it does genuinely surprise.
Megaman (1 Star)Mega Man 1
Mega Man 2
Mega Man 1
Rockman and Forte (1 Star)Rockman and Forte any%
Rockman and Forte “100 CDs”
Remove this at once and give it to Mega Man 2
Zelda (1 Star)The Legend of ZeldaLinks Awakening DX
I'm convinced that many people in the thread haven't seen the LADX movie, so I think judgement is getting clouded here. Both runs are actually improvable, but the improvements in LADX and much less obvious. It has really good music cool dungeon items and puzzles plus it's not like NES games don't have enough star treatment already
Castlevania (2 Stars)CastlevaniaCastlevania: Harmony of Dissonance
Castlevania: Circle of the Moon
Castlevania: Aria of Sorrow
Castlevania seems near enough automatic, so you could probably add it to the instant stars. CotM is more truer to the castlevania experience. Superior music and shows exceptional balance of speed, health and magic meter control.
Wire TAS (1 Star)Ninja Five-0
Umihara KawaseSpiderman 3
Bionic Commando
Ninja Five-O
Special concept (3 Stars)MMX+MMX2
GradiusKings Bounty
Monopoly
River City Ransom
Lost Vikings
This is what I was saying earlier, while the category sounds rather niche. Unfourtantly, none of the 4 suggested runs are remotely star material. So limit it the the two which you put in dark orange.
NES games (5 Stars)Super Mario Bros 3 any%
Excitebike
Battle of OlympusNinja Gaiden 2
Darkwing Duck
Mega Man 5
Gimmick!
Super Mario Bros 2
Journey to Silius
Arkanoid “Warpless”
Legend of Zelda 2
Battletoads “2 player warpless”
Darkwing Duck and Gimmick!
SNES/Gens games (2 Stars)Biker Mice from MarsSparkster
Donkey Kong Country
Golden Axe
Rocket Knight Adventures
Comix Zone
The Mask
I would have liked to have seen Ristar being included, so I'll say DKC & Ristar
N64 (1 Star)Majora’s MaskGoldeneye
Majora's Mask, Unfourtantley as much as I like Goldeneye. It has an overwhelming amount of emulation errors and doesn't play the Aztec and Egyptian levels which is bordering on a crime.
EDIT: Why not scrap the special concepts (keep Gradius and Dual run of course) and give one star to an extremely short glitched run.
EDIT_2: Apart from Kings Bounty, say maybe HoD, Pokemon Yellow or LADX
Thanks for all the posts sofar. I'll try to draw some preliminary conclusions and work towards an initial list. If you haven't posted your ideas/opinions yet, and want me to also take them into account, please make a post sometime soon.
Although the list shouldn't constantly be changed (entries on the list are carefully decided upon after all), it is always open for changes/updates. I hope there will be ongoing discussion about it.
