Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 757
Phil wrote:
I don't know if it might be helpful http://fr.youtube.com/watch?v=HY7XO53GoqY&mode=related&search=
o.O That looks like what was in the current published video... except that ends up leading to suicide?! WTF? Mr. Kelly R. Flewin
Mr. Kelly R. Flewin Just another random gamer ---- <OmnipotentEntity> How do you people get bored in the span of 10 seconds? Worst ADD ever.
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Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1276
Location: Uppsala, Sweden
The water is there because the screen hasn't scrolled down entirely yet. That video shows nothing new.
/Walker Boh
Joined: 1/13/2006
Posts: 109
A bunch more from the chat room, cleaned up, about a few possible glitches to go from the start of Dracula's castle to his room faster...if anybody can get any of them to work...will need major testing. METHOD 1-saves a frame or 2? As is shown in the cv2blockglitch video, simply do 2 normal jumps through the block instead of taking the stairs. This is a minor improvement in case the major improvement doesn’t work, which appears it won’t. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1953088325/cv2blockglitch.fcm METHOD 2-try to get over that tall wall... I had planned possibly doing the fall-through-floor glitch from the first platform, jumping off to the right, and somehow clearing the wall. Knowing he wasn’t going to make it quite on his own, I was hoping the Simon would fall off the screen before the wall scrolled off the top, so that he would screen-wrap above it and land on it. From basic tests, I can’t seem to get him to go off the bottom before the wall’s top scrolls out of sight, and double-jumping before actually seems to make it worse (due to the camera’s descent during his second jump). You guys can have these save states and play with it in detail, trying it from different camera heights with FADV if you care, but it doesn’t look like it will work. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1940492776/cvcastle.fcm METHOD 3-make glitch world link to Drac's sacrificial room somehow... I also hoped, that with some warping in the glitch world, that maybe some route through there might be faster than going through the castle, but I have yet to warp into Dracula’s room, or get the castle itself to glitch in any way, so it appears only the minor improvement is going to work. I have videos of going through the glitch world a bit. Have fun playing with it yourselves. You'll find the glitch world can spit you out in many areas near the end-game, but for this to save any time, a connection would likely have to be found on the 1st glitch screen. cv2glitch http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/256247930/cv2glitch.fcm cv2glitch2 http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1807719895/cv2glitch2.fcm cv2glitch3 http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/940277443/cv2glitch3.fcm
Life is like a box of chocolates-when you want peanut butter, all you get is coconut.
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Joined: 5/4/2005
Posts: 502
Location: Onett, Eagleland
I think.....therefore I am not Barry Burton
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 757
Well, whilst watching Zombietraine [ www.twitch.tv/zombietraine ] practice on CV2 while doing books in my office, ZT has now developed a new tactic that will save a fair chunk of time off a run. It involves proper placement of a Holy Water versus Death. Get it in the right spot on what appears to be the correct frame ]and ground like level], and it can freaking 1 hit kill him! He was starting to get continuously better and better as he kept grinding the fight. He is speculating the potential of this being possible on Dracula as well, due to how Dracula hovers around above and below ground. Could be something to look into more detail for a future TAS. Mr. Kelly R. Flewin
Mr. Kelly R. Flewin Just another random gamer ---- <OmnipotentEntity> How do you people get bored in the span of 10 seconds? Worst ADD ever.
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Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 7469
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This belongs here, I believe. The scrolling is here inhibited by the precisely timed jumps. When Simon is moving up, the screen won't scroll down, and when he's moving down, there is a limit to the speed at which it can scroll. The horizontal scene change is initiated before the screen has completely scrolled to the expected vertical level, and Simon ends in the wrong screen. Additional places where you can do this (most of them involve the falling-through-floor glitch): -- The other lake. It gets you exactly where without the trick. If you manage to completely avoid scrolling though and end up on the other shore (only possible with cheats), you will get to Veros. -- The left exit of Aljiba. leads under the ground of Aljiba woods, instant death. -- The left exit of Jova. Leads under the ground of Belasco swamp, instant death. -- The left exit of Ondol. Untested. Probably leads under the ground of Deborah Cliff for instant death, though. -- The left exit of Alba. Untested. Probably leads under the ground of Sadam Woods for instant death, though. -- The entrance to Aljiba tunnel. Leads under the ground of Aljiba woods, instant death. (As demonstrated by the video posted by Phil in 2007, a few comments above.) -- The entrance to Strigoi graveyard. Leads under the ground of Sadam woods, instant death. -- The left exit of Uta Lower Road. Leads under the ground of Devious woods, instant death. -- Possibly Laruba mansion. Untested. -- Many ways to do when exiting Castle ruins, as demonstrated by kolechovski above.) Leads to ??
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Very nice find dude. Welcome back to where we grew fond of you!
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 757
http://www.twitch.tv/jc583/c/5125755 About 9:20, whilst going for the heart, JC shows off an interesting spin on the block glitch that works a bit faster... then later shows a different exit via the same glitch concept. Not sure if either of these could save time in a TAS, but if so, might be time to pull this one from the closet and give it some new life. Mr. Kelly R. Flewin
Mr. Kelly R. Flewin Just another random gamer ---- <OmnipotentEntity> How do you people get bored in the span of 10 seconds? Worst ADD ever.
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I'm cross-posting this from the SDA forums; I apologize if this information is already known or common knowledge, but I couldn't readily learn anything about it while doing a quick search a few days ago. Anyway, RE: the fall-through-floors glitch "kareshi, JC583, et al.: Floor drops still require extremely precise timing, you have to whip when falling off a 2-block high ledge at JUST the right frame, and then you'll fall through the floor, assuming you started falling with the correct y-subpixel value. Getting the y-subpixel value to be one of the correct values was what was causing floor drops to appear to be random. However, thanks to zbrannigan @ JC583's twitch stream, a lot of the mysteries have been unraveled. Here is what I have just figured out, with help from him. Y subpixel memory address = 0336 This value only changes by multiples of 8, and once it hits 256, it wraps around to 0. So, in essence, 256=0. You can use an emulator like FCEUX to monitor this value and use it to determine if you can floor drop or not. This address changes with any action Simon preforms that moves him along the y-axis. So, jumping, falling, using stairs, etc. Floor drops will only work if and only if 0336=00, 08, or 16. No other values will work. So, it needs to be one of 3 of the 32 possible values in order to work. Once you've determined that you have a subpixel value of 00, 08, or 16, then you must walk off a ledge of 2 blocks high, and whip IMMEDIATELY after walking off the edge. There is only 1 frame that this will work. If you get the frame right, you will see Simon's sprite glitch for 4 frames while falling (he reaches his arm back to whip, then ducks because he starts falling, but his arm is still floating behind him, readying his whip). Now, how do we force a subpixel value that we want? Well, this is where the fun happens. You begin the game at a subpixel value of 0. Jumping straight up and down increments it by 128. Jumping up a ledge of 2 blocks increments it by 200. Whip jumping increments it by a different amount depending on which frame you whipped (jump, wait 1 frame, then whip results in +184; jump, wait 2 frames, then whip results in +240, etc). Using any staircase resets it to 0. Jumping up a ledge of 2 blocks AND whipping increments it by a different amount depending on which frame you whipped (jump up a ledge, wait 1 frame, then whip results in +8; jump up a ledge, wait 2 frames, then whip results in +64, etc). Now, for example, if you want to drop of the ledge immediately to the left of Simon when you start the game, you have a few options to force a subpixel value that you need: You can jump up that ledge, wait 1 frame, then whip, and you'll land at the top of the ledge with a subpixel value of 8, allowing you to drop through the floor (this is what JC does in his latest WR run). You can also jump up the ledge (+200), then jump off the ledge (+128), then jump back on the ledge (+200), giving you a value of 16 ( (0+200+128+200) = 528 - 256 - 256 = 16) (subtracting 256 because the address simply rolls over at 256). Using this information, you can set yourself up to have the proper subpixel address at any given ledge that you need to drop through. Granted, you still need to be able to whip immediately after dropping off the ledge in order to actually execute the floor drop, but this removes any randomness from the glitch. Some floor drops have more complicated setups than others, because the only thing I know of that will guarantee your subpixel value to be at 0 is using stairs, so after using any stairs, if there is a floor drop you need to execute before the next staircase, you must plan every jump/fall carefully in order to set it up properly. Feel free to ask anymore questions about this trick. I feel I've got a decent understanding of how it works now, after playing and monitoring the memory address for a while, so I'll try to answer whatever else I can." Also, I'll add in a copy/paste of my notes I took while researching this glitch:
0336=0   yes drop/1 frame window         0336 = ram address for y subpixel
8   yes 1 frame
16  yes 1 frame
24  no
32  no
40  no
48  no
56  no
64  no
72  no
80  no
88  no
96  no
104 no
112 no
120 no
128 no
136 no
144 no
152 no
160 no
168 no
176 no
184 no
192 no
200 no
208 no
216 no
224 no
232 no
240 no
248 no

jump straight up = +128
whip jump straight up = varies, depending on when you whip
jump while walking = +128
whip jump while walking = varies, depending on when you whip
jump while throwing holy water = varies, depending on when you throw
jump up 2 blocks = +200
walk off 2 blocks = +232
jump off 2 blocks = +128
using stairs = reset to 0 

jump + whip 1 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +8
jump + whip 2 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +64
jump + whip 3 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +120
jump + whip 4 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +176
jump + whip 5 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +232
jump + whip 6 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +0
jump + whip 7 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +56
jump + whip 8 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +112
jump + whip 9 frame after jumping up 2 blocks  = +168
jump + whip 10 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +224
jump + whip 11 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +24
jump + whip 12 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +80
jump + whip 13 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +136
jump + whip 14 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +192
jump + whip 15 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +16
jump + whip 16 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +72
jump + whip 17 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +128
jump + whip 18 frame after jumping up 2 blocks = +184

jump + whip 1 frame after jumping straight up=  +184
jump + whip 2 frames after jumping=  +240
jump + whip 3 frames after jumping=  +40
jump + whip 4 frames after jumping=  +96
jump + whip 5 frames after jumping=  +152
jump + whip 6 frames after jumping=  +208
jump + whip 7 frames after jumping=  +8
jump + whip 8 frames after jumping=  +64
jump + whip 9 frames after jumping=  +120
jump + whip 10 frames after jumping= +176
jump + whip 11 frames after jumping= +232
jump + whip 12 frames after jumping= +32
jump + whip 13 frames after jumping= +88
jump + whip 14 frames after jumping= +144
jump + whip 15 frames after jumping= +200
jump + whip 16 frames after jumping= +0
jump + whip 17 frames after jumping= +56
jump + whip 18 frames after jumping= +112
jump + whip 19 frames after jumping= +168
jump + whip 20 frames after jumping= +224
jump + whip 21 frames after jumping= +24
jump + whip 22 frames after jumping= +80
jump + whip 23 frames after jumping= +136
jump + whip 24 frames after jumping= +192
jump + whip 25 frames after jumping= +248
jump + whip 26 frames after jumping= +48
jump + whip 27 frames after jumping= +104
jump + whip 28 frames after jumping= +160
jump + whip 29 frames after jumping= +216
jump + whip 30 frames after jumping= +16
jump + whip 31 frames after jumping= +72
jump + whip 32 frames after jumping= +128
jump + whip 33 frames after jumping= +128
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 757
So development continues hard on this title with floor drops becoming very easy to set up apparently. http://www.twitch.tv/jc583/c/5249504 This is just a simple Concept TAS in 31m40s, so no insane luck manipulation... but it shows how far things have gone.. and brings forth ideas for someone to potentially obsolete the current TAS. No Morning Star needed anymore... as a matter of fact, this is a bit faster in the end. http://www.twitch.tv/kissmyafrocard/c/5250360 This is a 33m30s speedrun as well to show off the more human aspect. Hopefully this will inspire someone to take it up. Mr. Kelly R. Flewin
Mr. Kelly R. Flewin Just another random gamer ---- <OmnipotentEntity> How do you people get bored in the span of 10 seconds? Worst ADD ever.
Fortranm
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http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=6956&highlight= Are there any further discoveries about this glitch in the past 6 years? I wonder if it's possible to walk off this staircase. According to Bisqwit, the other shore leads to Veros. A warp to Veros from this lake can change the routine a lot.
Fortranm
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Since Contra Advance keeps demotivating me, I started a Catlevania II run. Link to video LUA(modified version of Pasky13's): http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/20668133504444791 BK2: http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/20668153341021391 I don't know how to keep the LUA GUI in avi dump. Sorry. The routine from the test run posted by Mr. Kelly R. Flewin will be followed in general. As you can see in the video, I decided to grind from the zombies in the town after level up because the enemies on the left of Castle 1 and Veros stop giving EXP after Simon enters LV1. I plan to make him enter LV3 in the center of the lake on the right of Castle 5 so laurels won't be needed any more. I found a new(?) trick about skipping level up sequence. As you can see around 2:28 in the video, Simon jumps to the next screen while getting the last heart he needs for leveling up (this could be better seen with LUA GUI). The only drawback of this trick is that you can't open menu until Simon dies for once or day/night cycle happens so there is no negative consequence in this case.
Fortranm
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Link to video http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/20837508579033771 Second level up animation is skipped around 3:35. Sadly, Simon won't gain EXP from hearts any more until he gets back to the left of the first town. This run is 20 seconds faster than the concept TAS by the end of Rover Mansion. We will see how much faster it is than the currently published run by the entrance of Bodley Mansion. I hope it will be 1 minute faster than the current run and thus 10 minutes faster than Bisqwit's run.
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 757
Fortranm wrote:
Second level up animation is skipped around 3:35. Sadly, Simon won't gain EXP from hearts any more until he gets back to the left of the first town. This run is 20 seconds faster than the concept TAS by the end of Rover Mansion. We will see how much faster it is than the currently published run by the entrance of Bodley Mansion. I hope it will be 1 minute faster than the current run and thus 10 minutes faster than Bisqwit's run.
Looking good. The only thing that was lacklustre was Zombie farming, but then again, considering this is a TAS and you had way more hearts then a normal speedrun has, it's not too unexpected. Kinda woulda been nice to see more varied patterns though. Everything else looks really good, including that drop all the way to the bottom after the stake. Smooooooth Operator! Keep up the great work! Mr. Kelly R. Flewin
Mr. Kelly R. Flewin Just another random gamer ---- <OmnipotentEntity> How do you people get bored in the span of 10 seconds? Worst ADD ever.
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Fortranm wrote:
I don't know how to keep the LUA GUI in avi dump. Sorry.
File -> AVI/WAV -> Capture OSD Otherwise, looking good.
Fortranm
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To be honest, most part of zombie farming was not done with frame-precision, but enough hearts and EXP were collected for sure. Link to video http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/20982840121409946 Thanks. The texts are not captured though. I have started to wonder if it's really a good idea to get to Lv3. As you can see, most of the enemies in the latter part of the game won't be killed in one hit. However, it's often faster to kill the enemies anyway due to the brutal lagging in this game. Simon dies around 5:07. Dying takes a little more than 5 seconds. Leveling up in the poisonous pond right before the HP hits 0 is not necessarily faster, and that also means I wouldn't collect any hearts after zombie farming.
Fortranm
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Link to video http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21140677526230610 WIP4 is here! It includes Death fight, walking off staircase, and blob boost. Not long, but sort of intensive. Hopefully Golden Knife will make the run more entertaining from now on.
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Fortranm wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1FT61lBu4k http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21140677526230610 WIP4 is here! It includes Death fight, walking off staircase, and blob boost. Not long, but sort of intensive. Hopefully Golden Knife will make the run more entertaining from now on.
Very good! Just one question, why do you need to go so far up the stairs to do the stair disalignment glitch? Wouldn't it be faster to do it lower on the stairs so you don't need to travel up and back down as far?
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 757
scrimpeh wrote:
Fortranm wrote:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K1FT61lBu4k http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21140677526230610 WIP4 is here! It includes Death fight, walking off staircase, and blob boost. Not long, but sort of intensive. Hopefully Golden Knife will make the run more entertaining from now on.
Very good! Just one question, why do you need to go so far up the stairs to do the stair disalignment glitch? Wouldn't it be faster to do it lower on the stairs so you don't need to travel up and back down as far?
More so to this query, Is this genuinely faster then the speedrunning strats that involve going up, bumping through the ceiling and carrying on? This seemed to take an awful lot of time and the speedrunning strat almost faster.. but then I don't have a stop watch to verify. Mr. Kelly R. Flewin
Mr. Kelly R. Flewin Just another random gamer ---- <OmnipotentEntity> How do you people get bored in the span of 10 seconds? Worst ADD ever.
Fortranm
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scrimpeh wrote:
Just one question, why do you need to go so far up the stairs to do the stair disalignment glitch? Wouldn't it be faster to do it lower on the stairs so you don't need to travel up and back down as far?
This is a very good question. I didn't think about this before I did the glitch! Though now I'm sure that section of the staircase is the only one able to trigger the glitch because it moves the camera both vertically and horizontally. That's also the reason why Simon needs to go up the stairs a little bit every 7 or 8 rounds since the initial section eventually loses the ability to move the camera horizontally.
Mr. Kelly R. Flewin wrote:
More so to this query, Is this genuinely faster then the speedrunning strats that involve going up, bumping through the ceiling and carrying on? This seemed to take an awful lot of time and the speedrunning strat almost faster.. but then I don't have a stop watch to verify.
My version is about 20 seconds faster than the test-run even if the time spent to buy the oak stake is not counted in the test-run. The test-run should be faster than zggzdydp's run because the latter backtracked a lot to buy the oak stake, but I decide to leave the oak stake purchase to the next mansion so there is no backtracking.
Fortranm
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Link to video http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21277978366628529 Bad news. Although a little more than 1 minutes faster than the test-run, my run is 20 seconds slower than the published run by the entrance of Bodley Mansion. I don't think there are significant lag timing differences between FCEU and Bizhawk. Maybe I should try the route with laurels instead of my route, or maybe this route is screwed since the beginning? There are some new discoveries as well. I encountered two abnormalities: 1. around 1:20, a skeleton is skilled before his HP becomes zero; 2. around 2:50, a temporary invisible platform appears above the skeleton. I don't know why, but they happened. It's good to record them here even if they don't seem to be too useful.
Fortranm
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I roughly timed the length of each route. My route without laurel is actually not slower than the route with laurel from the test-run. The true problem is that beating Carmilla with golden knifes is about 18 seconds slower than beating her with Morning Star. This disadvantage itself is probably enough to undo most other advantages of this route. I really hope most of the 20 more seconds my run takes is caused by Bizhawk's better accuracy, but this is probably not the case. I'll finish the last part of the game regardless since I've gone too far to leave it like this. Hopefully this run can be used for comparison in the future.
Fortranm
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Link to video http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21426224780853263 Oh, great! I can't get on West Bridge! Anyone knows the reason? My guess is that the game checks if you have all the items in the first line, which includes the red orb, which I skipped. I guess this project is legitly wasted, just like my first one.
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Thanks for working on this, Fortranm! It was fun to watch, even if it didn't work out in the end (yet). Seems like it could become a pretty important test for future improvements.
--Graywords
ventuz
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Fortranm wrote:
Anyone knows the reason? My guess is that the game checks if you have all the items in the first line, which includes the red orb, which I skipped.
I don't know game well, but look like you might be right.