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Post subject: Advance Wars 2: Black Hole Rising
Player (109)
Joined: 8/24/2006
Posts: 61
Location: Brazil
Any special strategies for this game? I guess we should use the "rush-and-destroy" strategy, aiming for fast completion. I've seen a walkthrough at GameFAQs that specified minimum S-rank times (envolving a bit of luck manipulation). Can anyone beat the strategies there or they're optimal? EDIT: The latest WIPs are at the end of the thread.
AW2 v2 progress: Two-Week Test (mission 17/25)
Joined: 5/9/2005
Posts: 752
http://www.awrevival.netfirms.com/aw2index_baek.htm I know next to nothing about the game, but thats another indepth walkthrough, that should help. No idea if its better than Gamefaqs though.
Former player
Joined: 5/24/2005
Posts: 405
Location: France
Be careful about the walkthrough, as it allows to complete the missions (and the AI of the game is still random) but not necessarily in the fastest way... Anyway, I'd be glad to see a run for this game... I know it a bit so I can maybe help...
Not dead yet... still very busy... damn...
Active player (256)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
Not to mention the walthroughs don't take into consideration perfect luck (I'm not sure how much luck manipulation is in this game, but I'm sure there's at least a fair amount). I'd also like to see a run of this. It'd be interesting to say the least.
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Player (109)
Joined: 8/24/2006
Posts: 61
Location: Brazil
atro city wrote:
Not to mention the walthroughs don't take into consideration perfect luck (I'm not sure how much luck manipulation is in this game, but I'm sure there's at least a fair amount). I'd also like to see a run of this. It'd be interesting to say the least.
When I played, I would reset every time a unit didn't move where I wanted it to, but I doubt there are other things decided by luck (damage is a set formula). Now my Cleanup video doesn't desync! Yay!
AW2 v2 progress: Two-Week Test (mission 17/25)
Active player (256)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
Of course, versus Flak, you can take advantage of his slight unluckiness which results in less damage sometimes.
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Player (109)
Joined: 8/24/2006
Posts: 61
Location: Brazil
atro city wrote:
Of course, versus Flak, you can take advantage of his slight unluckiness which results in less damage sometimes.
Sure, when I need to rush in. That's why I posted this topic anyway ;) BTW, my first stage (which can't be improved, really, unless improving my bad keystrokes by a few frames) is at http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1735/1060%20-%20Advance%20Wars%202%20-%20Black%20Hole%20Rising%20%28U%29%20%28Mode7%29.vbm
AW2 v2 progress: Two-Week Test (mission 17/25)
Active player (256)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
Desyncs on day 2. I know I've got the (U) version of the ROM, but I don't know anything about the (Mode 7) at the end of the run name.
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Player (109)
Joined: 8/24/2006
Posts: 61
Location: Brazil
atro city wrote:
Desyncs on day 2. I know I've got the (U) version of the ROM, but I don't know anything about the (Mode 7) at the end of the run name.
The (Mode7) means that the rom has got that yellow intro. It desyncs on Sami's day 2 here too. I'll get to fixing it. If it desyncs on Andy's day 2, I don't know what to do. EDIT: Try this movie. It completes the first two missions without any noticed desynchs on my VBA. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1737/1060%20-%20Advance%20Wars%202%20-%20Black%20Hole%20Rising%20%28U%29%20%28Mode7%29.vbm
AW2 v2 progress: Two-Week Test (mission 17/25)
Active player (256)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
Oh, I see. Well, that may pose a problem when it comes to submit, since that's a hacked ROM if I'm not mistaken. Also, I could've sworn that you could skip the screens telling you what day it is... Other than that, looks good.
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Active player (287)
Joined: 3/4/2006
Posts: 341
Here's a short run of the beginning I put together with that improvement and a few more. I used the same intro hack ROM since I haven't found a good (U) ROM yet. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1739/Advance%20Wars%202%20-%20Black%20Hole%20Rising%20%28U%29%20%28Intro%20Hack%29%20%28Mode7%29%20%5B1060%5D.vbm I've beaten the game several times, so I'm sure I could help with this run.
Joined: 8/1/2006
Posts: 428
Here's the quickest way I know of to complete a (hypothetical) map of infinite size: Choose Colin. Until your cash hits $200000, use only your regular power, and build only the units you need to expand at the beginning, then hold your opponent at any bottleneck. Once you have the necessery cash, start building a bomber/fighter/T-copter/Mech/Neotank army, but continue to use your normal power for a net profit. Once your cash maxes out, your bomber's and fighters are A)Unstoppable and B) disposable, and with your Super power only AA units and Bombers will try to attack your mechs. Compund interest is your friend. Of course, this takes so long to set up it's only worth it to set up on a very large map.
Trying 127.0.0.1... telnet: connect to address 127.0.0.1: Connection refused telnet: Unable to connect to remote host
Tompa
Any
Editor, Expert player (2216)
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1942
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
Why do you have the battle scenes on...? It will be a lot faster without. I really suck at this game so I am for no use. But my brother is quite good and it sounded like he wanted to see this one. So good luck =).
Active player (256)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
Why do you have the battle scenes on...? Because it'd be so damn boring if they weren't. It would be like watching chess.
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Tompa
Any
Editor, Expert player (2216)
Joined: 8/15/2005
Posts: 1942
Location: Mullsjö, Sweden
Then it isn't aiming for fastest time.
Active player (256)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
Fastest time isn't the only thing that matters.
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Joined: 3/16/2006
Posts: 289
Queing the speed vs entertainment argument....
I am just a silhouette, a silhouette of a memory of a solitary night .. nothing more.
Emulator Coder, Skilled player (1310)
Joined: 12/21/2004
Posts: 2687
But in this case there's still something concrete to go by when fastest time isn't a goal: number of turns. I don't know if I agree it'd be boring without animations, though. I remember thinking that about the Fire Emblem run, but seeing a run with animations off convinced me it's really not so bad.
Active player (256)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
Of course. Some people think watching chess is fun, and good for them. All in different tastes I guess.
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Player (109)
Joined: 8/24/2006
Posts: 61
Location: Brazil
Nitrodon wrote:
Here's a short run of the beginning I put together with that improvement and a few more. I used the same intro hack ROM since I haven't found a good (U) ROM yet. http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1739/Advance%20Wars%202%20-%20Black%20Hole%20Rising%20%28U%29%20%28Intro%20Hack%29%20%28Mode7%29%20%5B1060%5D.vbm I've beaten the game several times, so I'm sure I could help with this run.
You can press End by typing ^ A, instead of vvvvv A. You don't do that in your first ending, at least. I see you wait three frames at each CO conversation. I assume you lose time on it... The improvements, especially on moving speed, were pretty nice.
AW2 v2 progress: Two-Week Test (mission 17/25)
Joined: 11/15/2004
Posts: 804
Location: Canada
I played the heck out of the orginal Advanced Wars, but AW2 I thought the storyline was corny and the graphics seemed ugly by comparison. The new, more powerful tank didn't make the game more fun, but it did add complexity. I loved the original because it reminded me of chess: there were just a few units for each aspect of warfare, and the number of possible positions is enormous. Despite have relatively few pieces, chess and go are two of my favorite games. Their complexity may make them unsolvable, so I assumed that AW/AW2 would also be unsolvable, meaning that you could never be sure if you had played a perfect game. Despite my dislike for AW2, I think they're both great candidates for TAS because they may always be improvable, leading to innovation for years to come (much like chess and go). The only problem is that the campaigns are so long. Do you have an estimate of how long the run is going to be? It may be necessary to watch on fast forward.
TASing or playing back a DOS game? Make sure your files match the archive at RGB Classic Games.
Player (109)
Joined: 8/24/2006
Posts: 61
Location: Brazil
hopper wrote:
I played the heck out of the orginal Advanced Wars, but AW2 I thought the storyline was corny and the graphics seemed ugly by comparison. The new, more powerful tank didn't make the game more fun, but it did add complexity. I loved the original because it reminded me of chess: there were just a few units for each aspect of warfare, and the number of possible positions is enormous. Despite have relatively few pieces, chess and go are two of my favorite games. Their complexity may make them unsolvable, so I assumed that AW/AW2 would also be unsolvable, meaning that you could never be sure if you had played a perfect game. Despite my dislike for AW2, I think they're both great candidates for TAS because they may always be improvable, leading to innovation for years to come (much like chess and go). The only problem is that the campaigns are so long. Do you have an estimate of how long the run is going to be? It may be necessary to watch on fast forward.
It will be long, for sure. There are 30 missions. If we assume 5 minutes per mission, we already have 2.5 hours. I know that estimate is off, though. BTW, I'm working on Andy's Time. Proceeding in the fastest manner possible through a 7-day level is harder than I thought it would be.
AW2 v2 progress: Two-Week Test (mission 17/25)
Active player (256)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 476
If people can watch the Chrono Trigger run, they can certainly watch this.
[URL=http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IcuV2JdaBYY]Streets of Rage 3 (2 players)[/url]
Player (109)
Joined: 8/24/2006
Posts: 61
Location: Brazil
fetofs wrote:
BTW, I'm working on Andy's Time. Proceeding in the fastest manner possible through a 7-day level is harder than I thought it would be.
It's even harder than harder, because my luck manipulation attempts are leading me to nothing. I'm close to assuming the AI calculates it's "randomness" for the next move while it's moving, and that would mean that I have to luck manipulate 2 days before the actual fact happens.
AW2 v2 progress: Two-Week Test (mission 17/25)
Active player (287)
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Posts: 341
The RNG is at 03001fd4-03001fd7. It seems to advance 3 times each frame whenever you can press A to select a target for an attack (and at no other convenient times from what I see). You can also advance the RNG by drawing paths as in my Fire Emblem run. I don't see what needs manipulating in Andy's Time, but perhaps your strategy is better than mine for a TAS. My strategy involves blocking the enemy base on day 4 after building two recons.
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