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RTA timing ends at Frame 11134, the last necessary input. I've been going too easy on the Judges and Encoders with my last two submissions being for actual emulators, so here's a return to form with my very first Hourglass submission, brought to you by Windows XP!
ENCODE/PLAYBACK INSTRUCTIONS:
  • You need a copy of the updated version of Mighty Jill Off (dated 10/19/2008 by the file modification date), which is freely available on itch.io here. The SHA-1 hash of the zip file and executable is below:
    • "Mighty Jill Off.zip" - SHA-1: 092D141DFBC2AB46B62C89201373862A33D2C2D8
    • "jilloff.exe" - SHA-1: 7EF390AB6CB722025A76C18507AE914565AD4DC1
  • The following settings set for Hourglass:
    • Graphics -> Allow Fullscreen / Display Mode Changes CHECKED
    • Graphics -> Allow Hardware Acceleration UNCHECKED
    • Input -> Frame Advance Skips "Lag" Frames UNCHECKED (possibly unneeded for playback?)
  • When playing back/encoding the recording, start it PAUSED and use frame advance to get past the initial loading splash, or else you will immediately desync. If the game crashes during your playback, close Hourglass, relaunch it and make sure you have the right settings checked, and try again. You can do it, I believe in you.
  • This was recorded on Windows XP Professional Service Pack 3, Version 2002.
SOUND?
  • The encode I linked does not have in-game music or sound effects, only sound in the cutscenes. However, I am absolutely certain that this is only because of my VM's cursed and broken audio drivers, because I don't actually get/hear sound for anything on my VM, and the brief crackle audible at the very beginning of the temporary encode is symptomatic of my particular difficulties. I do not believe that any Judge or Encoder should have issues with sound on their non-cursed VMs or systems.
GAMEPLAY/NOTES: This is the type of game that is challenging for human players, but is extremely easy for a TAS. There is no momentum or acceleration, so the sole factors in speedy completion are the precision with which you cancel your jumps, and the speed with which you are able to spam the jump button in order to glide distances. You may notice that I am constantly making what appears to be arbitrary pauses between jumps; this is actually because the game won't let you jump in most cases until the frame before the automatic scrolling kicks in, and a universal delay between repeated jumps besides (the latter of which being relevant in the penultimate 'survival' section). There are two precise but human usable skips made possible by permissive hitboxes of obstacles; and finally, there's ONE tech in this game, which allows you to jump higher if you canceled your last jump precisely before landing, avoiding going into the gliding animation. This is trivial, as I cancel jumps early as a matter of course, and to scroll the screen as quickly as possible.
There is ONE note to be made about the goal: namely, there is a Second Tower. This was, I am lead to believe, not a part of the game's very first release, and is in all aspects a second, harder campaign. However, it is NOT accessible by SRAM as this game makes no save data, and thus can only be accessed by either beating the First Tower in under 12 minutes or by entering the cheat code "QUEEN" at the title screen. I am also lead to believe that, at least at one point, it was possible to obtain the Second Tower (Jill Off Harder) by paying anna anthropy 1 dollar on itch.io to receive it as a second executable. This is very relevant, because Hourglass became increasingly unstable as I recorded further into this game, crashing more frequently with fewer separate savestates the longer the recording length got; while this was perfectly manageable for the length of this first playthrough, I suspect it would become very problematic for completing both towers back to back. I will attempt to see if the alleged standalone executable is still obtainable, and ask a Judge if use of the "QUEEN" cheatcode to skip to the Second Tower is acceptable; however, failing both, it is very likely that this movie will be obsoleted if I eventually make a single followup movie containing the run for both towers consecutively.
POTENTIAL IMPROVEMENTS: Nothing concrete that I am aware of. It is possible that a few frames can be shaved by micro-optimizing the movement, but otherwise, the only potential major save would come from the section where you have to lead away a spider that blocks your path upward. There are no trivial timesaves or mistakes to remedy, however, thus fulfilling the optimization requirement.

feos: Claiming for judging.


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This topic is for the purpose of discussing #8636: Technoturnovers's Windows Mighty Jill Off in 06:01.06
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This was recorded on Windows XP Professional Service Pack 3, Version 2002.
And this is why I was hoping we could've ditched hourglass a decade ago. Anyhow, this is a game I'm actually fairly partial to. Obviously the movement is quite simple, and even in six minutes, it kinda begins to drag on, but it's not too bad. I only wish there were more skips. Is it impossible to stand on the edge of the spikes at 4:52 in the encode? Anyhow, I enjoyed this enough to vote yes. Keep it up, and huge props for actually having the patience to deal with hourglass.
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scrimpeh wrote:
This was recorded on Windows XP Professional Service Pack 3, Version 2002.
And this is why I was hoping we could've ditched hourglass a decade ago. Anyhow, this is a game I'm actually fairly partial to. Obviously the movement is quite simple, and even in six minutes, it kinda begins to drag on, but it's not too bad. I only wish there were more skips. Is it impossible to stand on the edge of the spikes at 4:52 in the encode? Anyhow, I enjoyed this enough to vote yes. Keep it up, and huge props for actually having the patience to deal with hourglass.
It really wasn't that bad, it only crashed like a dozen times! As for that bit with the spikes, I was following along with harry9397's absolutely herculean 6:23 time recorded on SDA (https://speeddemosarchive.com/demo.pl?MightyJillOff_623), which is still the world record by a huge margin despite being 10 years old. That thought occurred to me too, but I'm certain that I wouldn't actually be able to jump high enough to get anywhere from that point so I decided not to try that. Thanks for watching
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Hourglass allows the game to produce audio, but it fails to capture it to AVI. Default Hourglass settings without initial frame advancing synced the movie fine for me every time. I saved 72 frames on the first minute of gameplay with only 270 rerecords (Hourglass is much less pleasant than something with input editor, but it only crashed a few times!) Hard to tell what the biggest issue is, looks like it's just not optimized throughout. User movie #638330846111038659 Link to video
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....how were you able to jump that early? I tried to start input as early as possible, what you see in my recording was as fast as I was able to get it. Plus, besides that, I can't even tell what form your optimization is supposed to be taking just in general from watching the video; I would appreciate a hint, because I can't tell if you somehow managed to cut your jumps earlier or something. Plus, while patching other recordings is easy enough in BizHawk or libTAS, Hourglass is going to be a serious problem as far as I can tell, I would probably need to redo the entire movie. Making a 1-minute demo is easy enough, especially when the bulk of the timesave is immediate upon starting the game, but this recording took me many many hours to make. I'm not sure that "Movie Must Be Technically Sound" requires me to do that all over again, especially with the crashing, but I'll give it a try like everything else.
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Forgot to tell, you can view my inputs using https://github.com/Scepheo/Yaife/releases/tag/v0.8.0
Technoturnovers wrote:
Plus, besides that, I can't even tell what form your optimization is supposed to be taking just in general from watching the video; I would appreciate a hint, because I can't tell if you somehow managed to cut your jumps earlier or something.
I don't know, I was just trying earliest frame everywhere. Maybe this game is inconsistent, or maybe there are some less known aspects of the physics.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Alright, in that case that makes fixing this a lot easier- although there was no way I could have known that that existed when I was making this, as a note. No idea if it will be an edit or a full redo, depends on if there's actual movement optimizations at large or if it's just that one timesave at the beginning. EDIT: also, I was trying earliest frame everywhere too, that's where all the rerecords come from- I even took framedata on earlier possible jumping, and it's always one frame before scroll starts as far as I can tell.
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The difference in the beginning is only about 10 frames. I provided a video to make the frame differences easier to measure.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Ahhh, I think I see it, there's ONE skip that I didn't take, that plus the earlier beginning looks like it should be everything as far as I can tell.
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Which skip?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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feos wrote:
Which skip?
23 seconds in, you were able to skip an unnecessary jump; that should be the only mistake like that I made, in which case basically all of my inputs should still be good with some resyncing to account for different timing.
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Checked the last thousand frames and saved about 70 frames again, also ended input earlier which resulted in total 137 frames on that final segment. User movie #638336909747562432 I tried applying this common tech to jump cancellation, and interestingly, if you press Space to jump and then Ctrl on the next frame, the jump continues. But if you press Ctrl to jump and Space on the next frame, the jump cancels instantly, allowing you to jump more rapidly in that section where you have to jump 50 times. Somehow I also didn't have to wait on the yoku block before jumping from it. I don't think this submission is acceptable as is.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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feos wrote:
Checked the last thousand frames and saved about 70 frames again, also ended input earlier which resulted in total 137 frames on that final segment. User movie #638336909747562432 I tried applying this common tech to jump cancellation, and interestingly, if you press Space to jump and then Ctrl on the next frame, the jump continues. But if you press Ctrl to jump and Space on the next frame, the jump cancels instantly, allowing you to jump more rapidly in that section where you have to jump 50 times. Somehow I also didn't have to wait on the yoku block before jumping from it. I don't think this submission is acceptable as is.
Damn, well, at least I didn't miss any known tech at the very least. Gonna have to cancel this too, I guess, since that makes a total redo necessary- or at least, an intensive enough overhaul that leaving this submission in the queue would take too long
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BTW this time Hourglass did crash a ton. I thought of the upcoming xp-pcem-libtas thing which is ALMOST ready, tho its only limitation is it's locked at 100fps, which may not map perfectly onto all games compared to environments which allow you to control framerate. But IMO it's still worth it lol, because no crashes and a cool input editor.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.