Megaman 2 Power Fighters

  • This arcade fighting game supports two players. It has 3 routes each with 7 unique robot bosses. The route this tas takes is Rescue Roll.

Main Tricks / Glitches

  • Damage Stacking – On a frame they are vulnerable you can stack as much damage as you can hit them with. Note that you can only switch to another weapon once the previous weapon is off the screen or after a set cooldown. This can be tricky since after stunning the enemy robots will have an area that nullifies all projectiles with a couple exceptions like Stoneman or Slashman's ability.
  • Weakness Avoidance – In this game weakness for robots have an incredibly long animation that lasts for several seconds, and on top of that they get knocked up into the air afterward. On the same frame you hit the enemy with a weapon it is weak to you need to hit it with a different weapon or pellets.
  • Air Knockup Avoidance – Similar to the above trick but you need to use a “weak” weapon. This means 4 damage or less. This is the preferred strategy unless it is the finishing blow on an enemy.
  • Jumping on Landing Gives More Distance – On landing from a jump the player's horizontal movement is massively reduced. Jump on the landing frame to avoid this.
  • Orb Despawning - At the end of the battle if you can hide the character and move him off screen then the orbs will despawn and the bonus section will start asap. Results in a total of 200 frames of improvement. It is not always faster or possible to use this.
  • Danger Zone Next Action Vulnerability - So regardless of difficulty once the boss's health is reduced past the halfway mark it will be available to take damage again more quickly than usual. Usually attack the frame before the cutscene and then shortly after it ends they are usually vulnerable again. This seems to carry over to bosses that do not have the Danger Zone cutscene even active.

Players

  • Bass and Protoman are chosen for this run.
  • Protoman is chosen because he a very fast ground dash, his powerful charge move that only knocks enemies slightly up, and his normal charge attacks are fast and seem placed more forward on his character so he can attack faster.
  • Bass is chosen for his speed and airborne utility which comes in handy in the final Wily stages with the big bosses where their weaknesses are high up in the air. It allows for slightly faster wins. He is challenging to use however since his dash is quite unique with a lot of caveats. His dash is in a slight parabolic arc and unless you cancel the dash by pressing in the opposite direction he will easily dash into enemies. He can also use the dash twice if you do it on the ground since if you cancel it he can then immediately use it again. When you cancel it he has several frames where he is airborne and you will need to wait for him to land to jump again. Also the arc of the dash can make getting orbs on the ground difficult, but it is also possible to use the arc to get falling orbs over a wider area. Bass's shots are slightly slower than Megaman, but he makes up for it with the fast dash. His special move, which is done by charging up, then holding up and releasing the attack button is a somersault attack which does decent damage. Protoman's special is used to reduce the height of the knock back. That attack is only used on the first stage. Bass would normally get a terrible companion from the little helper robot in the form of a wolf type robot that only allows you to use the normal attack, but the enemies are defeated so fast it does not appear.

The Route “Rescue Roll”

  • As you defeat robots they get more health and are more aggressive. After the first three robots are defeated they get a Danger mode where they can get some additional moves. In this Route Roll will give allow your special moves to have double the amount of energy and thus double the usage. Roll will appear randomly, but we only need her to appear near the end of the list in time for Shademan. She appears the earliest possible after Stoneman is defeated. The cutscene only lasts for a couple frames since it is skipped.
  • After defeating a robot each stage has these orbs that drop down randomly. Getting a good pattern is important to save time since the round only truly ends once they are gone.

Elecman

  • Elecman has lots of jumps but he dies in three rounds of attacks so none are seen. Here Bass and Protoman's power attack are used to stack damage as well as to make sure the last hit is stacked to prevent a high airborne knock back from Bass's somersault.
  • The biggest reason for this route is Elecman which has a power that shoots three shots out at once that can each hit. Furthermore it can fire rapidly and this comes into play on several robots that have some moves that allow for rapid hitting. Elecman's attack his also considered a “weak” attack that will not knock up an enemy into the air unlike Stoneman or Slashman's abilities. In casual play this ability would not be the best since unless you are extremely close and all three shots hit the enemy you cannot use the ability until all shots travel out of the screen area. In addition, Wily 1 and Wily 3 are weak to Elecman. Weaknesses all do double damage.

Stoneman

  • Stoneman would have been a good choice as the first robot to beat since Elecman is weak to his ability, but he ends up being about 20-30 frames slower due to just how useful Elecman's ability is. Stoneman has some moves that shield himself so those are manipulated to not appear. Ideally Stoneman walks towards you which saves a couple frames, but it ended up being slower to manipulate that to come out.
  • Stoneman's ability is great second only to Elecman's. It is a persistent attack that travels along the ground. It is considered a “strong” attack type so it would cause airborne knock back, but when used to attack on the same frame as Elecman's ability the enemy will only do a normal short ground knock back.

Slashman

  • Slashman is chosen third since he does not have any really exploitable weaknesses. His weakness is to Diveman's ability and there is always a better option then using that garbage ability. Slashman later on has lots of jumping attacks and jumping attacks are all removed here since hitting a robot in the air always causes the airborne knockback not the quick ground knockback.
  • Slashman's ability is an close range ability that does decent damage (6) but is considered strong so it does airborne knockback. However the move has some strange momentum preservation characteristics that make is hard to jump and then get back to the ground quickly since if you use it while increasing height the slash will continue to propel you upwards up to your max jump height. The slash also lasts a long time and has a long cooldown as well.

Cutman

  • Cutman is weak to Slashman and this is used to destroy this guy quickly. He normally can be very time consuming since he can jump into some kind of alternate dimension or something. He has an abusable attack where he jumps into a cut in reality (wow) and then will not flinch, but it costs more time for it to start up. It also only appears after his danger mode activated and by then he only needs two rounds of hitting to be defeated. Jump attacks are all manipulated out. Cutman is manipulated to the left side of the screen for the orb respawn trick and it is 23 frames faster since the orbs will fall sooner.
  • Cutman's boomerang-like ability is difficult to use due to it being fairly slow and the arcs it travels in can be sluggish in coming back to you. However this aspect is used in Wily 1 Yellow Devil to stack damage.

Shademan

  • He is manipulated to use a move where he will retreat to the back then start using his blaster. He is vulnerable every 8 frames and is weak to Cutman's ability. Getting in extremely close allows the player to avoid the attack and attack at point blank range.
  • Shademan's ability fires a shot that can bounce off the walls of the arena, and when once collides with your character the next Shademan shot will do double damage. It is fun to use but it does not get much use in the run since it is fairly slow and weak. Also the later bosses usually do not allow your character to be right near the wall to allow stacking. Also the powered up version of the shot is considered strong so it would do a airborne knock back.

Diveman

  • This robot has one water bomb attack where he does not flinch and is vulnerable every 8 frames. Placed him last because he has max health of the robots and is weak to Elecman. He has 128 health, but he dies quick since once the attacks start doubling he takes 36 damage every 8 frames.
  • Diveman's ability is the worst. Extremely slow to start, only two shots are allowed on screen, and the homing does not activate if you use it when the enemy is stunned. Also the ability only does 3 damage and when the homing is active it sometimes will decide to go in strange directions. It is possible to damage stack this but any other “weak” ability is a better choice.

Wily 1 – Yellow Devil

  • It has a lot of different attacks and most of them hide his weakpoint so he becomes invulnerable so lots of manipulation here. He has jumps, but like other robots if you can strike him a frame before he jumps he will do a ground stagger. Here Cutman gets a lot of use to stack a couple hits on the same frame. Use Shademan's ability to bounce a shot off a wall to stack an additional hit since at that position Cutman's ability was too difficult to stack. End up using Slashman's ability right at the end since the positioning was not letting me stack other hits and was short a couple hp points. Yellow Devil is weak to Elecman so each attack using that does 24 damage (4*3*2) which stacks up quickly.

Wily 2 – Wily Machine

  • The main manipulation here is to prevent an attack where his weakpoint moves up. Here I delay an attack from Bass using Slash right before the Danger mode which allows me to stack an additional attack.

Wily 3

  • Here the main point is to avoid any air knockback so weaker weapons are used in addition to Elecman. Elecman is strong to this Wily and it takes two rounds to defeat him. For those curious the IGT on the credit screen is 42"36. Before the orb despawn trick the IGT was 41"76.
  • Note: I am finishing this input on the last frame right before Wily dies as personal preference.

nymx: Claiming for judging.
nymx: Replacing movie file with an updated version.
nymx: Ok...I understand this game a lot better now. I have cleared up some of the confusion by changing the submission for [2117] Arcade Mega Man 2: The Power Fighters "Search for Wily!, 2 players" by Marx in 04:48.05, to reflect the branch that it completes.
This run looks really optimized and seems to be an excellent piece of work.
Accepting to "Standard" for publication as a new branch to reflect a 2nd challenge offered by this game.

despoa: Processing...


TASVideoAgent
They/Them
Moderator
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 15577
Location: 127.0.0.1
Experienced player (704)
Joined: 2/5/2012
Posts: 1795
Location: Brasil
this run is insane, very optimized! I hope we have all routes TASed here in tasvideos, each one has a different set of weapons and bosses.
I want all good TAS inside TASvideos, it's my motto. TAS i'm interested: Megaman series, specially the RPGs! Where is the mmbn1 all chips TAS we deserve? Where is the Command Mission TAS? i'm slowly moving away from TASing fighting games for speed, maybe it's time to start finding some entertainment value in TASing.
Challenger
He/Him
Skilled player (1689)
Joined: 2/23/2016
Posts: 1061
Nice to see another TAS of this game after several years, when the NGP version was submitted in 2017 :) Getting orbs allows you to finish every stage as soon as possible, but it's also possible to force these orbs to start falling down immediately if you move the camera far enough away that the boss is fully offscreen - you can still control both players during the boss death animation. Btw, great job with the optimization and knownledge. Yes vote.
My homepage --Currently not much motived for TASing as before...-- But I'm still working.
CoolHandMike
He/Him
Editor, Judge, Experienced player (895)
Joined: 3/9/2019
Posts: 695
Challenger wrote:
Nice to see another TAS of this game after several years, when the NGP version was submitted in 2017 :) Getting orbs allows you to finish every stage as soon as possible, but it's also possible to force these orbs to start falling down immediately if you move the camera far enough away that the boss is fully offscreen - you can still control both players during the boss death animation. Btw, great job with the optimization and knownledge. Yes vote.
Just did a quick test and looks like you are right Challenger. It will be probably a couple days until I can come back and test properly and probably over a week until I can submit a new file.
discord: CoolHandMike#0352
CoolHandMike
He/Him
Editor, Judge, Experienced player (895)
Joined: 3/9/2019
Posts: 695
Challenger wrote:
Nice to see another TAS of this game after several years, when the NGP version was submitted in 2017 :) Getting orbs allows you to finish every stage as soon as possible, but it's also possible to force these orbs to start falling down immediately if you move the camera far enough away that the boss is fully offscreen - you can still control both players during the boss death animation. Btw, great job with the optimization and knownledge. Yes vote.
So going through the game again using that tech of hiding the boss and causing the orbs to fall fast. Found a problem boss though, Cutman, where the stage's width is not enough to cause the camera to fully hide Cutman. Anyone have a way to avoid waiting for the orbs to go offscreen here? Annoyingly they only start falling once all of the orbs are offscreen so even hiding part of him is ineffectual.
discord: CoolHandMike#0352
GJTASer2018
He/Him
Joined: 1/24/2018
Posts: 303
Location: Stafford, NY
The stage isn't wide enough to knock Cutman completely offscreen with your final blow?
c-square wrote:
Yes, standard runs are needed and very appreciated here too
Dylon Stejakoski wrote:
Me and the boys starting over our games of choice for the infinityieth time in a row because of just-found optimizations
^ Why I don't have any submissions despite being on the forums for years now...
CoolHandMike
He/Him
Editor, Judge, Experienced player (895)
Joined: 3/9/2019
Posts: 695
GJTASer2018 wrote:
The stage isn't wide enough to knock Cutman completely offscreen with your final blow?
So before I replied to you I tried one more time this time on the far LEFT side and that worked. Not sure why that would be the case but it is. Although it will defeat him later than usual, but the overall end of the bonus stage should be shorter overall I guess?
discord: CoolHandMike#0352
Post subject: File Needs Replacement
CoolHandMike
He/Him
Editor, Judge, Experienced player (895)
Joined: 3/9/2019
Posts: 695
Made an improvement using Challenger's hint. About 200 frames better. Please replace with this new one. Link to video Link to New Userfile 11293 https://tasvideos.org/UserFiles/Info/638249845754440441 Link to Old Userfile 11502 https://tasvideos.org/UserFiles/Info/638249843093230614
discord: CoolHandMike#0352
nymx
He/Him
Editor, Judge, Expert player (2234)
Joined: 11/14/2014
Posts: 932
Location: South Pole, True Land Down Under
I need some information here. Obviously this run is good to go for my judgement; however, the previous, https://tasvideos.org/3718S, was not so descriptive and doesn't help me understand the difference between the two. My initial thought is to obsolete, but the previous submission has a category that is not mentioned in this submission. The encodes are different, but is that because of the routes? So my question is...does your run intend to obsolete or is this another category?
I recently discovered that if you haven't reached a level of frustration with TASing any game, then you haven't done your due diligence. ---- SOYZA: Are you playing a game? NYMX: I'm not playing a game, I'm TASing. SOYZA: Oh...so its not a game...Its for real? ---- Anybody got a Quantum computer I can borrow for 20 minutes? Nevermind...eien's 64 core machine will do. :) ---- BOTing will be the end of all games. --NYMX
CoolHandMike
He/Him
Editor, Judge, Experienced player (895)
Joined: 3/9/2019
Posts: 695
nymx wrote:
I need some information here. Obviously this run is good to go for my judgement; however, the previous, https://tasvideos.org/3718S, was not so descriptive and doesn't help me understand the difference between the two. My initial thought is to obsolete, but the previous submission has a category that is not mentioned in this submission. The encodes are different, but is that because of the routes? So my question is...does your run intend to obsolete or is this another category?
I think you should leave that one be and not have this obsolete it instead accept this to a different category. There are some differences to take into consideration and both of these pages might need updating. 1. There are three main paths in this game and each offers different abilities with 7 unique bosses, different side powerups, and routing opportunities. I intend to in the future at least go through that tas with the route "Search For Wily" you linked since I think there are some good time saves to be found there. 2. My submission is on Normal while in the linked submission it was stated to be on the hardest (Very Hard I guess). In Bizhawk I noticed there are no dipswitches for the difficulties so I left it be. In the piano roll there is a button "S" I believe which brings you to a select menu to manually select the difficulty. I found the menu to be kind of slow and jarring and once you finish the game restarts, this felt like a waste of time since I by the time I was done with changing the difficulty a boss would already have been defeated with no real differences. 3. There is one difference with the difficulties "4 Very Hard - Phase 2 Animation Trigger in Round 1" and that is with the "Phase 2" Danger mode or whatever activation cutscene. On normal it just activated two rounds later. So...that would be like 4 extra seconds about between Normal and Very Hard? Other than that I am not completely convinced there would be any significant differences between the difficulties for a TAS considering you can through delays or through position changes manipulate the enemy AI to select moves in any case. As far I could tell casually playing the game the enemies seem slightly more aggressive on higher difficulties, but that is all I noticed. When they die in seconds it does not really matter that much probably. At this point in time I am not going to go through and give it an exhaustive comparison. But...while saying that it might be worthwhile to tag these with the difficulties? I do not know. If you want to look at the different routes look at the current leaderboards here: https://www.speedrun.com/mega_man_2_the_power_fighters?h=Solo-Search_for_Wily-2_Normal&x=zd38oynk-38djwk08.zqo3wp4q-ql6r6x7l.ln84g86l
discord: CoolHandMike#0352
nymx
He/Him
Editor, Judge, Expert player (2234)
Joined: 11/14/2014
Posts: 932
Location: South Pole, True Land Down Under
CoolHandMike wrote:
nymx wrote:
I need some information here. Obviously this run is good to go for my judgement; however, the previous, https://tasvideos.org/3718S, was not so descriptive and doesn't help me understand the difference between the two. My initial thought is to obsolete, but the previous submission has a category that is not mentioned in this submission. The encodes are different, but is that because of the routes? So my question is...does your run intend to obsolete or is this another category?
I think you should leave that one be and not have this obsolete it instead accept this to a different category. There are some differences to take into consideration and both of these pages might need updating. 1. There are three main paths in this game and each offers different abilities with 7 unique bosses, different side powerups, and routing opportunities. I intend to in the future at least go through that tas with the route "Search For Wily" you linked since I think there are some good time saves to be found there. 2. My submission is on Normal while in the linked submission it was stated to be on the hardest (Very Hard I guess). In Bizhawk I noticed there are no dipswitches for the difficulties so I left it be. In the piano roll there is a button "S" I believe which brings you to a select menu to manually select the difficulty. I found the menu to be kind of slow and jarring and once you finish the game restarts, this felt like a waste of time since I by the time I was done with changing the difficulty a boss would already have been defeated with no real differences. 3. There is one difference with the difficulties "4 Very Hard - Phase 2 Animation Trigger in Round 1" and that is with the "Phase 2" Danger mode or whatever activation cutscene. On normal it just activated two rounds later. So...that would be like 4 extra seconds about between Normal and Very Hard? Other than that I am not completely convinced there would be any significant differences between the difficulties for a TAS considering you can through delays or through position changes manipulate the enemy AI to select moves in any case. As far I could tell casually playing the game the enemies seem slightly more aggressive on higher difficulties, but that is all I noticed. When they die in seconds it does not really matter that much probably. At this point in time I am not going to go through and give it an exhaustive comparison. But...while saying that it might be worthwhile to tag these with the difficulties? I do not know. If you want to look at the different routes look at the current leaderboards here: https://www.speedrun.com/mega_man_2_the_power_fighters?h=Solo-Search_for_Wily-2_Normal&x=zd38oynk-38djwk08.zqo3wp4q-ql6r6x7l.ln84g86l
Thanks.
I recently discovered that if you haven't reached a level of frustration with TASing any game, then you haven't done your due diligence. ---- SOYZA: Are you playing a game? NYMX: I'm not playing a game, I'm TASing. SOYZA: Oh...so its not a game...Its for real? ---- Anybody got a Quantum computer I can borrow for 20 minutes? Nevermind...eien's 64 core machine will do. :) ---- BOTing will be the end of all games. --NYMX
Experienced player (704)
Joined: 2/5/2012
Posts: 1795
Location: Brasil
different challenges in each path, shouldnt obsolete at all.
I want all good TAS inside TASvideos, it's my motto. TAS i'm interested: Megaman series, specially the RPGs! Where is the mmbn1 all chips TAS we deserve? Where is the Command Mission TAS? i'm slowly moving away from TASing fighting games for speed, maybe it's time to start finding some entertainment value in TASing.
Post subject: Movie published
TASVideoAgent
They/Them
Moderator
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 15577
Location: 127.0.0.1
This movie has been published. The posts before this message apply to the submission, and posts after this message apply to the published movie. ---- [5427] Arcade Mega Man 2: The Power Fighters "Rescue Roll!, 2 players" by CoolHandMike in 03:09.36