This tas took me a good 3 (5 if you include previous versions) months of TASing, really the only improvements over my last one is some faster strats such as fatser powerup grabs, bowser kills, and just better movement overall.
Stage-by-stage comments
(Most levels dont have anything special other than a FPG (or fast bowser kills in the case of castles) so I wont be commenting on those)
1-1
Ground clip for full FPG (from HappyLee's TAS)
2-4
Corner clip, just like my previous TAS.
3-2
Clip saves some time over falling between the coral.
4-4
Quick L tap gives good sub pixels for blazit, nothing new here.
5-2
Devils spell at the end saves some time.
6-4
Slight slow downs in order to jump through the bars, faster maze movement compared to previous TAS
7-1
Backward corner clip saves lots of time over the previous TAS.
7-4
Added a new blazit clip, nothing else.
Nach: This run is a small improvement over the previous one. However this run still is far from the quality we typically accept. Please see the discussion thread for more details. Rejecting.
Are you going to respond to the accusations of plagiarism that took place in your last submission?
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't
12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!"
Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet
MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish
[Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person
MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol
Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing
Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6435
Location: The land down under.
DMTASpeedruns wrote:
I am confused as to what youre talkin about
Are you?
Also to bleed that comment I'm linking into this one.
Guess whose 1-1's input this belongs to.
I'll let the Mario experts go through this with their comments, since they always know a ton more about the game about optimality and whatnot, but that author credit is missing again.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account.Something better for yourself and also others.
Are you?
Also to bleed that comment I'm linking into this one.
Guess whose 1-1's input this belongs to.
I'll let the Mario experts go through this with their comments, since they always know a ton more about the game about optimality and whatnot, but that author credit is missing again.
I didnt think to credit in the last one, however i did mention in the desc of this one that i used the 1-1 of happylee’s tas.
If you copy an author’s inputs and put it into your movie, especially when it is a major amount of inputs, you should always include the original author in the author list, a description mention isnt going to cut it.
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't
12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!"
Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet
MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish
[Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person
MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol
Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing
If you copy an author’s inputs and put it into your movie, especially when it is a major amount of inputs, you should always include the original author in the author list, a description mention isnt going to cut it.
Its one level, not that big of a chunk, i said i used his tas, i really dont see any issue.
It is fine if you want to use other people's work as part of your TASes, but you must include them as a co-author at the very least, as they have directly played a role in making your movie as fast as it is. I would understand only mentioning HappyLee in the description if he had simply suggested or discovered a new strategy which you then optimised, but given that he has worked on a decent chunk of input in the final movie you should list him as a co-author.
If you copy an author’s inputs and put it into your movie, especially when it is a major amount of inputs, you should always include the original author in the author list, a description mention isnt going to cut it.
Its one level, not that big of a chunk, i said i used his tas, i really dont see any issue.
your point?
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't
12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!"
Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet
MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish
[Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person
MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol
Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing
Let's not get too carried away here.
As per the Movie Rules page, "When optimal gameplay results in little to no variation in input sequences, matching others' work becomes unavoidable, so co-authorship is not required. However, when you copy someone else's artistic choices, the original author should be duly credited."
The only real issues I could see are with optimization. Since this is a Mario game it is expected to have a high level of optimal play. But since I'm not familiar with all the tricks available for use (especially in the FDS version), I'll second Spikestuff and let the real Mario fans chime in on that.
Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6435
Location: The land down under.
Given permission from, and citing Maru.
Maru wrote:
I took it upon myself to watch that SMB2J submission. Here is my feedback:
For all levels, I noticed that he did not correctly implement the subspeed manipulation to save half of a pixel at the start of every level. I did not check for whether he manipulated subspeed to shorten the walk to the castle by a frame.
1-1: Optimization looks fine, but it was copied from HappyLee's TAS.
1-2: The beginning of the level was copied from HappyLee's TAS. I did not notice any optimization issues here.
1-3: A framerule can be saved here with better optimization on the mushroom grab.
1-4: Fast acceleration at the start of the level is suboptimal; unoptimized fire flower grab; suboptimal movement around first firebar; suboptimal movement around pillars; still has minor slowdowns during Bowser fight that needs to be corrected. The left-right movement for extended durations may have cost a couple of frames or even a framerule starting here because it slows Mario down to 39.5 subpixels per frame. If I see it, I will refer to it as L+R.
2-1: There is a slowdown at frame ~10060 that is unnecessary; L+R.
2-2: There is a lag frame at the ~12660 frame mark that can be avoided. The wall jump is suboptimal.
2-3: I'm not sure if you can spawn a late cheep-cheep here to glitch through the floor, but if it can be done, it would save seconds; L+R.
2-4: Fast acceleration at the start of the level is suboptimal; duck jump to the platform with the koopa is suboptimal; did not use the ground left+right acceleration after performing the clip; unnecessary slowdown after exiting the wall; L+R; still has minor slowdowns during Bowser fight that needs to be corrected.
Based on what I've found here, I wouldn't be surprised if you could cut off 1.5 to two seconds in the first two Worlds alone.
3-1: There is a slowdown around the ~18900 frame mark that was unnecessary.
3-2: No fast acceleration at the start of the level. That clip around frame 21,700 does not save time.
3-3: Always use flagpole glitch; L+R.
3-4: There was an unnecessary slowdown around frame 25,930; suboptimal movement through the one block gaps; L+R; still has minor slowdowns during Bowser fight that needs to be corrected.
4-1: There is an unnecessary slowdown around frame 29,080.
4-2: Nothing pops straight out at me in this level. There are a few micro optimizations that I would have if I made my own TAS, but they wouldn't save time.
4-3: Nothing pops straight out at me in this level. There are a few micro optimizations that I would have if I made my own TAS, but they wouldn't save time.
4-4: Fast acceleration at the start of the level is suboptimal; there is no fast acceleration after clipping into the wall; the Bowser fight was clearly suboptimal and can be done without slowing down.
I've seen enough.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account.Something better for yourself and also others.
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11469
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
I recently updated the co-authorship section of the rules to reflect what we've been doing for years in that regard:
http://tasvideos.org/MovieRules.html#CreditingOtherUsersContribution
tl;dr: We distribute the movies under CC-BY, but we have extra requirements to be accepted. For example, if one uses parts of a movie distributed without any license and outside of tasvideos (therefore not regulated by Creative Commons), we still require proper attribution as a site policy.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
I'd like to point out that the primary author of this movie did credit HappyLee with authorship of 1-1 in the submission notes, even though the language wasn't the clearest.
As HappyLee's contributions make up less than 5% of the run itself, we may want to consider the opposite approach where crediting HappyLee directly on the movie wouldn't be wanted by HappyLee. If HappyLee feels this movie is really sub-par, listing him as co-author wherever it's posted might be taken as an insult by him. Only the submission notes make it clear his only input was at the beginning. If this run gets published, we can get input from HappyLee first if he wants his name mentioned more prominently or not.
Now can we get back to actually discussing this movie itself? I'd like to know what you guys think about it.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Pretty much all the issues I would find in this movie as far as the actual run, was already highlighted by Maru’s comment (er, Maru’s comment which was copy and pasted from the discord by Spikestuff).
My biggest issue is some slowdowns that occur when the player approaches each bowser fight. There should be no reason to slow down to shoot fireballs at bowser unless there isn’t much room to shoot them, but there are still plenty of time to kill bowser because the game gives you plenty of space to shoot from. For this I have to vote no.
[14:15] <feos> WinDOES what DOSn't
12:33:44 PM <Mothrayas> "I got an oof with my game!"
Mothrayas Today at 12:22: <Colin> thank you for supporting noble causes such as my feet
MemoryTAS Today at 11:55 AM: you wouldn't know beauty if it slapped you in the face with a giant fish
[Today at 4:51 PM] Mothrayas: although if you like your own tweets that's the online equivalent of sniffing your own farts and probably tells a lot about you as a person
MemoryTAS Today at 7:01 PM: But I exert big staff energy honestly lol
Samsara Today at 1:20 PM: wouldn't ACE in a real life TAS just stand for Actually Cease Existing
My biggest issue is some slowdowns that occur when the player approaches each bowser fight. There should be no reason to slow down to shoot fireballs at bowser unless there isn’t much room to shoot them, but there are still plenty of time to kill bowser because the game gives you plenty of space to shoot from. For this I have to vote no.
Well, even if Level 4-4 has that limit for example, I would still say it is possible to kill Bowser without the need to slowdowns, I don't even know how HappyLee does that but meh, I know it is possible.
That 7-4 was absolutely great, even if nobody will read this comment, I hope that good enough TAS of this category will be done. I think, at least some fast accels can be better.
