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Kid Icarus is a classic NES platformer where the player is Pit the angel who is on a quest to defeat Medusa. There have been several past TASes of this game. The current run incorporates recently discovered glitches which allow zips and screen wraps which save over a minute over the previous run.
Game objectives
  • Emulator used: FCEUX 2.2.2
  • Beats the game as fast as possible
  • Manipulates Luck
  • Glitch Abuse
Comments
The RTA version of the current run has been around for some months. That run already incorporates all of the major glitches used here, the primary difference being TAS precision. The overall route is mostly identical to Randil's previous run aside from the new zips and screen wraps, as well as slightly better optimization.
Stage by stage comments
1-1: 6 frames saved
Nothing Special here, slightly more optimized.
1-2: 45 frames saved
Better optimization as well as jumping at the right moment to load a platform earlier saves a bit of time here.
1-3: 17 frames saved
Again slightly better platforming here saves some frames.
1-4: 267 frames saved
The first big zip of the game. I also saved 2 frames on the boss fight : )
2-1: 21 frames lost
Unfortunately RNG comes back to bite me in this level. I lose a damage boost as well as have a slightly higher score.
2-2: 86 frames saved
The first of the screen wraps that comes from the RTA run.
2-3: 240 frames saved
Another screen wrap that saves a few seconds.
2-4: 3438 frames saved
Most of the savings comes from this level. A zip skips most of it right near the beginning!
3-1: 0 frames saved
I couldn't do better then Randil here.
3-2: 11 frames saved
This time the RNG helps me as I get 2 free damage boosts.
3-3: 1 frame lost
I am quite honestly not entirely sure how.
3-4: 217 frames saved
2 zips right near the end of the game (not done in the RTA run)
4-1: 0 frames saved
I couldn't really improve Randil's autoscroller, there really isn't that much to work with.
Other comments
As is turns out, this run came down to the level 3 boss. While I don't know the specifics, his pattern seems to be decided by a rather large frame rule. When I first implemented the 2 zips in 3-4, it completely ruined the pattern. It was only by chance that when I went back to optimize it more the better pattern emerged. Then I went back to try to save a few frames in previous levels, only to have the pattern ruined again by a mere 12 frame savings elsewhere. So I'm unsure to what extent this run can be further improved, had I gotten unlucky its possible I would even have needed to ADD frames, as the bad pattern for that boss is quite significantly slower then the good one.
Thanks to Randil for pointing this game out to me
feos: Accepting this improvement.
fsvgm777: Processing.
adelikat: This run was made on a bad dump:
Kid Icarus (UE) [b1].nes,
SHA1: 11713A9514934B60724960DB9FD1F367ABCC8D07
MD5: D464E3E3877A759B8053210BAAEBC890
But this run syncs on the good dump, so I cataloged it as the good dump instead.

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Posted: 1/30/2015 2:59 AM
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TASVideoAgent
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This topic is for the purpose of discussing #4576: Randil & Alyosha's NES Kid Icarus in 21:05.75
Posted: 1/30/2015 4:37 AM
(Edited: 1/30/2015 1:58 PM)
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scrimpeh
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Excitement! Will watch later, but I've been waiting for a new Kid Icarus movie. //Watched it, was very impressed. Yes vote.
Posted: 1/30/2015 7:55 AM
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CoolKirby
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Nicely done! I liked the new zips. Voting Yes!
Posted: 1/30/2015 8:28 PM
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Techokami
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The ROM "Kid Icarus (UE).nes" desynced for me after the start of 1-3. I switched to "Kid Icarus (UE) [!].nes" which, despite FCEUX 2.2.2 bickering about a checksum mismatch, synced properly. Very well done! Yes vote from me.
Posted: 1/30/2015 8:51 PM
(Edited: 2/1/2015 9:56 PM)
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Samsara
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Casually going to edit a temp encode into this post in a couple hours. EDIT: 60fps processed (only on the actual Youtube page, as usual now available in the player module with recent bbcobe updates!). Link to video
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Posted: 1/30/2015 9:24 PM
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mklip2001
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You work really quickly, Alyosha! I definitely appreciate your zeal for picking up these runs in development and pushing them to completion. I'm not in a location where I can view this movie at the moment, but I do plan to get to this later tonight. EDIT: I've seen the run. Nicely done. The new glitches are the best kind, where you largely cut out boring repetitive parts (especially in boss levels) and still have good action. Yes vote.
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically. Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.) Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html) Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature! Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Posted: 1/31/2015 10:08 AM
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Radiant
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Question. Is this the kind of game where shooting the enemies just slows the run down? Because I thought the movie would look cooler if you'd kill more of the common mooks.
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Posted: 1/31/2015 11:08 AM
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Alyosha
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Radiant wrote:
Question. Is this the kind of game where shooting the enemies just slows the run down? Because I thought the movie would look cooler if you'd kill more of the common mooks.
Indeed it is. Each enemy you shoot costs you 1-5 frames (depending on enemy value) when the score counts down at the end of the level. So only 1-2 and 2-1 shoot a lot of enemies to farm skill points to gain arrow upgrades, the other levels avoid them as much as possible.
Posted: 1/31/2015 7:24 PM
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Grincevent
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It was more entertaining than I expected (because of the scrolling and stuff), you did great with this movie. Same thing on the technical level, good job with the RNG, 3rd boss pattern, zips, etc... You've won another YES vote :)
Posted: 1/31/2015 11:12 PM
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thommy3
Joined: 12/10/2006
Posts: 118
As you don't kill much enemies and bossfights are pretty fast, would it be possible to complete the game with no bow upgrades?
Posted: 2/1/2015 12:18 AM
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Alyosha
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thommy3 wrote:
As you don't kill much enemies and bossfights are pretty fast, would it be possible to complete the game with no bow upgrades?
Interesting question, I admit I hadn't considered it before. It takes roughly 20 seconds to get the 2 bow upgrades. I did a back of the envelope calculation of how much longer the bosses would take with no upgrades, and it comes out to about 17 seconds longer. So it seems plausible on the surface. There are two difficulties I could see right away, health management and normal enemies in your way. It is important in later levels to be able to kill stronger enemies in 1 hit to not lose time. Not being able to do so will cost several seconds I would guess. In order to beat bosses quickly you have to be able to take more damage from them, meaning farming enough hearts to buy the health drinks in the dungeons. This would cost several more seconds, especially in world 3. So the short answer is no, you can't get by without arrow upgrades. I would say there is a slim but unlikely chance that 1 arrow upgrade is possible. I won't be the one to find out though : )
Posted: 2/1/2015 8:30 AM
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Randil
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Great job! You work very fast but manage to keep a good quality throughout the run. And thanks Samsara for the encode. Some thoughts that popped up in my head while watching this (I will refer to the timings in the youtube video since I watched the encoded video). Some of this is nitpicking, but I thought I'd raise the points anyway: *I think you can make a wall zip at the end of 1-3, zipping through the block on the left and wrapping to the right side of the screen and reaching the door a little bit faster. *Maybe you can zip through the wall on the left on 2-1 at around 06:54 in the youtube video? I'm thinking that you turn around at this point, zip through the wall and pop out on the far right side of the screen. Might save a few frames maybe? I seem to remember testing this a while back, but I don't remember exactly... *I think you can zip through the left wall at the store at 12:26, saving a few frames. At 18:13 you zip through the wall at the store (with the same layout), which is a little bit inconsistent. *Same thought on the room around 12:31, I think you can zip through the left wall here too. *13:47, aah, the platform pause trick :) It still makes me smile! *This is a crazy idea, but at 17:52, would it be faster to drop down the pit in the middle of the room, zip through the wall here and pop out right on the door? Just a thought. *Maybe a possible wall zip around 17:56? If you drop down to the lava and zip through the blocks to your left to reach the door. Anyway, I will vote yes since this is a very nice improvement to the published run (and most of my points are nitpickings that don't account for much potential time lost). Awesome job, I think you are becoming a very competent TASer :) Maybe Little Nemo next? I think SDA has found some nice wall zipping glitches for that game that are absent in the published TAS.
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Posted: 2/1/2015 11:10 AM
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Ragnarokia
Joined: 9/1/2014
Posts: 58
It does the job with a few glitches. Sadly the game itself is just dull though with the levels going on for far too long and with a limit to how much it allows the scrolling which really hampers speedrunning this game. Levels like the ice one around the 9 minute mark just got really boring. Having to vote meh since the rather tiring and laborious length of the levels makes this feel like vault material. The game actively acts against speedrunning with its design.
Enjoys speedruns but hasn't actually tried making any yet.
Posted: 2/1/2015 11:57 AM
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Alyosha
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Randil wrote:
Great job! You work very fast but manage to keep a good quality throughout the run. And thanks Samsara for the encode. Some thoughts that popped up in my head while watching this (I will refer to the timings in the youtube video since I watched the encoded video). Some of this is nitpicking, but I thought I'd raise the points anyway: *I think you can make a wall zip at the end of 1-3, zipping through the block on the left and wrapping to the right side of the screen and reaching the door a little bit faster. *Maybe you can zip through the wall on the left on 2-1 at around 06:54 in the youtube video? I'm thinking that you turn around at this point, zip through the wall and pop out on the far right side of the screen. Might save a few frames maybe? I seem to remember testing this a while back, but I don't remember exactly... *I think you can zip through the left wall at the store at 12:26, saving a few frames. At 18:13 you zip through the wall at the store (with the same layout), which is a little bit inconsistent. *Same thought on the room around 12:31, I think you can zip through the left wall here too. *13:47, aah, the platform pause trick :) It still makes me smile! *This is a crazy idea, but at 17:52, would it be faster to drop down the pit in the middle of the room, zip through the wall here and pop out right on the door? Just a thought. *Maybe a possible wall zip around 17:56? If you drop down to the lava and zip through the blocks to your left to reach the door. Anyway, I will vote yes since this is a very nice improvement to the published run (and most of my points are nitpickings that don't account for much potential time lost). Awesome job, I think you are becoming a very competent TASer :) Maybe Little Nemo next? I think SDA has found some nice wall zipping glitches for that game that are absent in the published TAS.
I had tested some of these, as well as other little time savers. Unfortunately they seem to throw off 3-4 quite badly. The 2-4 zips I thought would save time but things didn't work out. The swords in the later rooms end up in a different pattern and I throw away the time saved waiting for them since I can't take any additional hits. Thanks for your comments, I think a V2 of this TAS might be possible, but first someone would need to figure out exactly how the level 3 boss works. And next will be umihara kawase, expanding into snes should be fun.
Posted: 2/12/2015 8:56 PM
Post subject: Movie published
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TASVideoAgent
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This movie has been published. The posts before this message apply to the submission, and posts after this message apply to the published movie. ---- [2786] NES Kid Icarus by Randil & Alyosha in 21:05.75
Posted: 2/17/2015 9:30 PM
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AndiHoffi
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I am wondering about a detail in the medusa-fight: AFAIK, you shoot as quickly as possible. Shouldn't it help the to shoot the first shot from a longer distance and the last one from the shortest distance possible? Since the first shot can be released sooner and the last shot takes shorter to reach the target, this should gain some time.
Posted: 2/20/2015 12:14 PM
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EgixBacon
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Would it actually save input time? I can see how it would save real time, but when you consider how TAS timing works, only the placement of the first shot has any chance of saving movie time. If you'd managed to post that question while this run was still on the bench, it would have been a simple case of replacing the movie file. But it's too late now, I guess...
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Posted: 2/20/2015 10:21 PM
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Alyosha
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AndiHoffi wrote:
I am wondering about a detail in the medusa-fight: AFAIK, you shoot as quickly as possible. Shouldn't it help the to shoot the first shot from a longer distance and the last one from the shortest distance possible? Since the first shot can be released sooner and the last shot takes shorter to reach the target, this should gain some time.
I vaguely remember testing this and I'm pretty sure she takes damage on the first possible frame for every hit, so shooting earlier would have no impact.
Posted: 2/20/2015 10:50 PM
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Tangent
Joined: 3/9/2009
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Alyosha wrote:
AndiHoffi wrote:
I am wondering about a detail in the medusa-fight: AFAIK, you shoot as quickly as possible. Shouldn't it help the to shoot the first shot from a longer distance and the last one from the shortest distance possible? Since the first shot can be released sooner and the last shot takes shorter to reach the target, this should gain some time.
I vaguely remember testing this and I'm pretty sure she takes damage on the first possible frame for every hit, so shooting earlier would have no impact.
That's not what he meant, but it wouldn't help anyway. He's assuming that the only limiting factor is Pit's firing rate, in which case, starting further back to get the first shot off soonest (in addition to hitting her on the first possible frame) would be fastest because you'd get the second shot (and all subsequent shots) off sooner. However, all shots on the screen are erased when Medusa takes damage. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WyuS0NfqEkA&#t=30 So you're limited by both Pit's fire rate AND only allowing one shot at a time on screen.