Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 2227
Location: Georgia, USA
I'm glad to see this fixed up. However, I'm a little concerned. You made this really quickly, and with a pretty low rerecord count. Based on what MURPHAGATOR said, it seems this game is fairly complex to optimize...
EDIT: Ok, I watched this. You definitely do a much better job with path planning... the routes look tighter, and you skip more parts of the course. (I especially liked the jungle stages now.) However, it looks like you could still do better in the final stage:
1) At the beginning of the conveyor belt area, you may want to jump earlier, so that you land on the conveyor sooner and ride it more. I'm sure there are one or two more areas where you can ride forward conveyor belts for longer.
2) For the final boss, you can probably end input earlier if you end with a punisher flip instead of with a jump kick.
If you want to just make small changes, you should be able to just ask a judge to replace the submission file instead of canceling and making a new submission.
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically.
Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.)
Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html)
Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature!
Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Thanks, I forgot that. I'll fix it soon :)
Edit: I have problems,
1/ I tried fixed conveyor, but later when I fight with enemies, I have slower because luck control for jump kicks, tried alot way....
2/ with final boss, special skill at the end isn't faster, because it need distance more than jump kick
Ok I have done fixed 2 things mklip2001 said, but I have slower 5 frames. Do I need reupload?
Edit: I think I'll choice fix conveyor only, then I'll faster 19 frames.Here's preview: http://youtu.be/x4dt7PDm7lM
Joined: 6/23/2009
Posts: 2227
Location: Georgia, USA
Alright, I saw the changes on the conveyors. I feel it could still be a little better, but it's hard to say exactly where.
Used to be a frequent submissions commenter. My new computer has had some issues running emulators, so I've been here more sporadically.
Still haven't gotten around to actually TASing yet... I was going to improve Kid Dracula for GB. It seems I was beaten to it, though, with a recent awesome run by Hetfield90 and StarvinStruthers. (http://tasvideos.org/2928M.html.)
Thanks to goofydylan8 for running Gargoyle's Quest 2 because I mentioned the game! (http://tasvideos.org/2001M.html)
Thanks to feos and MESHUGGAH for taking up runs of Duck Tales 2 because of my old signature!
Thanks also to Samsara for finishing a Treasure Master run. From the submission comments:
Shoutouts and thanks to mklip2001 for arguably being the nicest and most supportive person on the forums.
Joined: 8/14/2009
Posts: 4090
Location: The Netherlands
zwataketa wrote:
Ummm .... Didnt this just become gruefood?
The submitter improved his run, cancelled the old one, and submitted again.
http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa
<dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects.
<Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits
<adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.
Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6439
Location: The land down under.
xxNKxx wrote:
Thanks !
Btw, why still this, "Submission status: new"
Sad! Have any wrong from me? :(
I have the roll of the Encoder.
I'm not a judge an Editor or a Publisher.
So I cannot change your tas or edit it if you're wondering...
That's why I'm asking either a future judge or editor to do it.
WebNations/Sabih wrote:
+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.
Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account.Something better for yourself and also others.
http://www.youtube.com/Noxxa
<dwangoAC> This is a TAS (...). Not suitable for all audiences. May cause undesirable side-effects. May contain emulator abuse. Emulator may be abusive. This product contains glitches known to the state of California to cause egg defects.
<Masterjun> I'm just a guy arranging bits in a sequence which could potentially amuse other people looking at these bits
<adelikat> In Oregon Trail, I sacrificed my own family to save time. In Star trek, I killed helpless comrades in escape pods to save time. Here, I kill my allies to save time. I think I need help.
I'm voting yes, but I must ask if there are places where it is faster to take damage. If there are, then this run should be obsoleted by one that does. If there are none, then the "no damage" should be removed, making this the main branch.
I absolutely loved the pause glitch on the waterfalls. It reminds me of the pause glitch in NES Metal Gear, which is also an "Ultra Games". I appreciate this TAS more because I watched MURPHAGATOR speedrun this game.
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11475
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
Ultra Games = Konami.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11475
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
So what about this suggestion:
MURPHAGATOR wrote:
6-2 is also probably the only place in the game where taking damage might save time on the conveyor section. Without the pause thing it would save time during 3-2 since you wouldn't have to wait for the waterfalls. I took damage on purpose several times during the platforming, but those aren't really relevant to a TAS since they were mostly for consistency.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11475
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
I see, then this submission will most likely be accepted with no branch in a few days. I said I would try to find improvements, but after some of them were already applied and now people don't come up with more suggestions, I can try improving the already published movie as well.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11475
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
I guess the action isn't intense enough, and the obstacles aren't so frequent as in Gremlins 2, for example.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Sorry it took me so long to respond to this, I've been out of town for the last several days. After watching the updated run, I'm really happy you decided to watch my run and use it as a reference for some improvements. The movements look a lot cleaner, much more like what a TAS should look like than the last one.
There's a few places where you make minor movements and some frames might be able to be gained, steering around the guy at the end of 3-1 comes to mind, but I don't really know to that much detail. The only other thing I can say is that the helicopter in stage 2 can probably be optimized slightly more. The pattern you get here is just repeating the real time strat, which is still a lot better than the old one you used, but I feel like the helicopter could be manipulated into dropping bonbs even faster by moving in precise ways since it's patterns are based on x/y position to at least some extent. If I had to guess based on my knowledge of the game, the helicopter is where there is most likely any real amount of time to be improved still. At the very least, I know there's a position where it will drop 3 bombs on its first cycle returning right instead of 2, but I couldn't tell you much more than that.
That said, I would probably vote accept instead of reject this time around, this really looks a lot more like what a TAS should look like.
Also, I already knew they would, but the TAS fights make me super jealous. Losing several seconds each fight in real time is painful.
feos wrote:
So what about this suggestion:
MURPHAGATOR wrote:
6-2 is also probably the only place in the game where taking damage might save time on the conveyor section. Without the pause thing it would save time during 3-2 since you wouldn't have to wait for the waterfalls. I took damage on purpose several times during the platforming, but those aren't really relevant to a TAS since they were mostly for consistency.
Yea I wasn't really expecting the damage on the conveyors to save time necessarily, it was just the only place I could think of where it might.
One side thing I thought of, but is probably irrelevant: a lot of the maps wrap horizontally. It's most notable on 5-2, if you jump off the platform you start the room on, you can see the exit to the room. I very much doubt you could make it over that gap, but I'd never tell a TASer that something like that is impossible.
The only other thing I can say is that the helicopter in stage 2 can probably be optimized slightly more. The pattern you get here is just repeating the real time strat, which is still a lot better than the old one you used, but I feel like the helicopter could be manipulated into dropping bonbs even faster by moving in precise ways since it's patterns are based on x/y position to at least some extent. If I had to guess based on my knowledge of the game, the helicopter is where there is most likely any real amount of time to be improved still. At the very least, I know there's a position where it will drop 3 bombs on its first cycle returning right instead of 2, but I couldn't tell you much more than that.
I wish I know how can do that :(
MURPHAGATOR wrote:
One side thing I thought of, but is probably irrelevant: a lot of the maps wrap horizontally. It's most notable on 5-2, if you jump off the platform you start the room on, you can see the exit to the room. I very much doubt you could make it over that gap, but I'd never tell a TASer that something like that is impossible.
huh? I don't understand this. Are you mean make it same my last jump in 6-3? If that, it can't, because it's not same 6-3. Can you help me make a example for me? Maybe I'll remake if it's possible for faster
MURPHAGATOR, did you consider making a TAS for this game yourself? This way you're likely to learn even more about the game (which would help you to improve real-time record as well).
