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Thanks!
Ideally yes.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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If we remove any kind of waiting from the frame loop of an emulator, then there's no definitive framerate to aim for because it will run as fast as the host CPU will allow. Even if we set it to maximum values that are available to libTAS and/or scummvm, that won't really mean anything, because we're just doing arbitrary tweaks to the environment.
If the game lags and we overclock the CPU, it theoretically makes sense to only overclock it until there's no more lag that can be removed that way, or until there are significant glitches. If lag ends at 1000fps and significant glitches appear on 2000fps, then using an arbitrary value between those 2 feels acceptable, since there is a concrete goal we're achieving by overclocking that CPU - no lag and no bugs.
But if the goal is shorter final time itself, and we minimize it by maxing out framerate of the environment, I can't consider that a valid TAS goal. Because it's not related to gameplay.
I'm explaining this because there's still Wiki: Playground that can host a big variety of unconventional goals. But for this movie, the goal is similar to "run bizhawk at 2x speed because otherwise the movie desyncs". Not even at maximum speed, because that maximum would be different for everyone. But just at some arbitrary multiple of normal speed because it won't sync on any other. I can't consider that a valid Playground goal either.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
run500.exe!ADRIFT.frmRunner.SubmitCommand() Line 1626 C#
run500.exe!ADRIFT.frmRunner.txtInput_KeyDown(object sender = {Text = "Ø 6utfuyk"}, System.Windows.Forms.KeyEventArgs e = {KeyData = Enter}) Line 1549 C#
System.Windows.Forms.dll!System.Windows.Forms.Control.OnKeyDown(System.Windows.Forms.KeyEventArgs e) Line 12223 C#
System.Windows.Forms.dll!System.Windows.Forms.Control.ProcessKeyEventArgs(ref System.Windows.Forms.Message m = {System.Windows.Forms.Message}) Line 13238 C#
System.Windows.Forms.dll!System.Windows.Forms.Control.WndProc(ref System.Windows.Forms.Message m = {System.Windows.Forms.Message}) Line 16006 C#
System.Windows.Forms.dll!System.Windows.Forms.RichTextBox.WndProc(ref System.Windows.Forms.Message m) Line 3867 C#
System.Windows.Forms.dll!System.Windows.Forms.NativeWindow.DebuggableCallback(System.IntPtr hWnd, int msg = 256, System.IntPtr wparam, System.IntPtr lparam) Line 761 C#
[Native to Managed Transition]
[Managed to Native Transition]
System.Windows.Forms.dll!System.Windows.Forms.Application.ComponentManager.System.Windows.Forms.UnsafeNativeMethods.IMsoComponentManager.FPushMessageLoop(System.IntPtr dwComponentID, int reason = -1, int pvLoopData = 0) Line 305 C#
System.Windows.Forms.dll!System.Windows.Forms.Application.ThreadContext.RunMessageLoopInner(int reason = -1, System.Windows.Forms.ApplicationContext context = {System.Windows.Forms.ApplicationContext}) Line 1236 C#
System.Windows.Forms.dll!System.Windows.Forms.Application.ThreadContext.RunMessageLoop(int reason, System.Windows.Forms.ApplicationContext context) Line 1152 C#
run500.exe!ADRIFT.frmRunner.Main() Line 552 C#
Just like with Flash, this implies that input rate is not tied to rendering rate, and input polling happens as usual when the OS decides to do it inside the message loop. So technically entering commands to ADRIFT at high framerate is legitimate. However that does not solve the problem of when it makes sense to do so. I still believe that if there's no gameplay advantage, one should stick to default rate.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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DOS games can't have that option, they can only render at one of the available video modes (tho they can change them). Only later PC games can.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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I tried the EGA version in DOS on our 2 configs for the '90s, and the game runs normally on both, without speeding up on a faster machine. To make it run faster it would probably need to be hacked. Official Reference Card lists available launch options and in-game controls, and there's no option to uncap the framerate there. For that reason I don't think this submission can even be classified as a DOS one. It could have been if the same setup was used in scummvm as is available to the game in DOS.
This leads us to an interesting question though. Is this submission at least true to the "updated" official release, available for example on Steam and GOG? I only got the GOG one, and it uses scummvm and what looks like the VGA version of the game. Ctrl+G works there and it just makes the game run at uncappedframerate. Which in turn makes it care about libTAS framerate.
If we treat scummvm as an emulator that is meant to make this old game run on modern systems, then unpcapping its framerate is identical to running, say, BizHawk on turbo speed. It doesn't affect gameplay, there's just no waiting between frames.
Here lies an important distinction.
Let's take some emulator that runs on Linux, for example lsnes. We load a SNES game into it, then we set emulation speed to turbo. And then we run it that way in libTAS - at uncapped speed and some really high framerate set inside libtas, let's say 9999fps. Would such a movie be acceptable? What if the copyright owner of said game released it on Steam bundled with lsnes?
To me, it'd be impossible to claim that said SNES game is now a Linux game and all features of lsnes can now be used on it in a TASing session. Target device that we're emulating here is still SNES itself, and it has very specific specs that we need to match. Speeding up the emulator is not an optimization technique inside the game.
With this submission, the only difference from my hypothetical example above is that IBM PC has a little bit of variation in its configuration. There's no definitive device that was THE IBM PC. But even that difference does not play a role in how an IBM PC would run that game natively. As long as it runs in DOS, CPU speed would not matter, the game would not run faster on its own.
This is very different from PC games that allow you to switch vsync on and off as an existingoption. There it's perfectly valid to say that once vsync is off, high framerate is accurate and legitimate. DOS games though, just render at whatever rate they're coded to, and refresh the screen at that rate. If this game had this option, high FPS in libTAS would technically be justified. But the scummvm fast mode option is not a special thing for this game either - it's universal. It doesn't expose something hidden in the game. It just emulates it at turbo speed.
I tried setting libTAS to 60, 100, and 500 fps for this movie, and they all desynced.
As for how to configure this game in scummvm - before the movie or during it - I couldn't find specific instruction for that on Wiki: EmulatorResources/ScummVM, and if it was the only question with this movie I would not consider it fair to reject based on that. We never banned in-movie configs for other games, even though here it's technically an environment level and not in-game tweak. I tried disabling vsync for this game in scummvm before running this movie, but it resulted in several hundreds frames of scummvm logo, so I can't say it's any better than launching into the game on frame 119 like this movie does. Maybe it's skippable?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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I think that it makes the most sense for "pacifist" to use the version that allows for the fewest kills, especially if it showcases a unique glitch. SaveRAM makes it shorter and less repetitive so it's a plus. The "low level" restriction is safe to ignore IMO.
2 pacifist branches co-existing would be something that hasn't happen yet IIRC. So for it to happen there would need to be really big difference between the 2. Hard to tell if it's possible with this game. I wouldn't worry about it for now.
Nymashock is more sync stable.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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A judge doesn't have to be the uploader, anyone can send it to archive.org.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Can the fixed patch be uploaded to smbarena too?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Yes.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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If a new glitch is found that allows to collect fewer stars without tunneling, how would it be handled by the community relative to the "3 stars" category? Would it be avoided like tunneling is, just to keep "3 stars" alive? Or would it depend on how much time it saves and how many stars it skips?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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It looks like the "low level" part of the current pub is just the result of its pacifism. I wasn't very mindful during judging back in 2014 so I didn't change the submitted label, but now it looks like it's just "pacifist". Extra labels are only needed if they affect the goal, usually by making the run slower without the extra restrictions.
If switching to clear saveram loses time while increasing repetitiveness, I'd advocate for using dirty sram also, because "pacifist" is still not a Standard goal, so it can't get all the variations of standard goals published.
As for using a different version, I think unique glitches make it worthwhile, but since it's not a standard goal either, it boils down to differences between the 2 "pacifist" movies when deciding whether to obsolete or let them co-exist.
Can you explain the differences more extensively between 2 saveram pacifist movies if they were done on different versions of the game? Also dropping saveram anchor from the new one would make them more or less different?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Efficiency is not the goal of the rules, we embrace variety these days. It's just that 10% of extra content after 90% of identical content is yet another edge case that no rule can resolve nicely while not setting the opposite precedent too, like "okay from now on, 10% difference is officially enough for a new branch".
In short games 10 minutes could be majority of the run, and it'd be clear that a given branch is transformative enough to co-exist. But actual videogames never limited themselves to concepts that our rules try to rely on, so there will never be satiable match between them.
If they are turned into the same category, indeed obsoletion becomes a problem because rejecting a run without round 2 after "both rounds" was published would be bad. And rejecting the latter would be bad. Sending both rounds to Playground would technically fit its purpose but nobody likes it anymore because it was never fully developed.
Maybe it could just be sent to Alternative and be done with. But again I would feel weird infinitely pushing the difference borderline effectively towards 0. If 10% is now enough, soon 1% will be enough, if all other options are as bad as the ones I listed above. Then 0.1% would be enough, etc. And then we wonder why even have rules or any kind of publication system at all, if all that system does is limiting things?
Also technically, for things that are only 1% different or less, we have secondary publication files. I don't know if it'd be enough for a "both rounds" movie.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Since the goal of the current publication is "maximum items" (I fixed the branch to say that, it was wrongly renamed to 100% after publication), it can't be obsoleted by collecting fewer items, only more. Or the same amount but in shorter time.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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For just a dozen minutes in a 3 hour movie, I think nobody will complain if it's just included in the main run. If it was like an extra hour we could have it as a separate branch and call it something like "both rounds". but for such a short addition I think it's fine to include.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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What's the total duration of the final movie that includes round 2, from power on and without sram?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Thanks. What about non-jumpless ones?
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Voting for the TAS of 2024 is now open!
Please vote for the choices in the poll above. If an eligible option is missing from this list, please let us know and we will correct it as soon as possible.
Voting will be open for exactly 7 days, so until 09:59 UTC on January 25th, 2025.
The winner is [6012] NES Super Mario Bros. "arbitrary code execution" by OnehundredthCoin in 04:52.65
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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It's done using these keys once you've made an xml with the multidisk bundler
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Is there a ticket for this feature in the bizhawk repo? If not, makes sense to create one, so there's incentive, because at least one game is not tasable without it (likely more).
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
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Does it work in standalone Citra?
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That doesn't answer the question of which emulator you're using.
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I accepted #9090: Natetheman223's GC Spider-Man 2 "swingless" in 52:01.68 despite a missing ending because normally the game plays fine in Dolphin, and we don't even know if what happened was an emulation glitch or a glitch in the game itself, and checking that would be very hard. But when the game can't be completed at all, it's easier to know which side the problem is on, and yeah you're even saying that it's an emulation issue, and it dramatically affects gameplay.
Which game is it anyway? We allowed custom builds of some emulators or modified games that overcome emulation issues if authors can't currently fix them. Or maybe it's possible to push for a proper fix.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.