Maybe, and maybe not... but I assure you there's plenty of us that lurk these forums that got (and will get) really excited by the action in this thread. The way you handled that last enemy was clever, and I hope you're encouraged to continue TASing!
Well, if we're going with "been around for a long time without posting often", I'll toss in a couple notes.
(1) Most people here are rather nice. Don't get discouraged!
(2) The standard of disallowing cheat codes is not a hard-and-fast rule, and while I agree that it will probably apply in this case, that decision would be best made after seeing the finished product.
(3) Years ago, there was a strong sentiment against "pride runs" (or "ego runs"). Ideally, TASes should be made for enjoyment and not just to get published. Whether the "already morphed" basis for this run gets it rejected or not, I wish you the best, and I look forward to seeing your work!
------------
Back on the topic of the WIP shown, it looks quite good! A question, though. At around 3:01, is it definitely faster to kill the final enemy on the right side of the screen before the final enemy on the left side of the screen?
Then it's a game that exists solely for the market of people who already own an SNES in perfect working condition, still play said SNES, and are still willing to pay $70 on a new game that we still don't know if it's any good or not.
Just so you know, the market you described isn't entirely empty. *runs off to order a copy of the game*
Wow, that was really impressive. I particularly like some of those moves with the hammers.
With 101 levels, there were only a handful of levels I saw that didn't say "hey, this path is the best one, you can trust me on that" beyond the miniscule individual frame left vs. right decisions.
It's been a highly requested run for years and years, and it's an amazing run that inspires a feeling of "this run can't be improved by much". It's a Yes vote from me unreservedly.
Wow... four and a half years later, I'm still keeping on eye on this thread and thinking "nah, too daunting a task".
I wish you the best of luck with this run, and I hope you find the will to complete it!
Lookdown has historically not been a concern on SM64 TASes except for in Dire, Dire Docks. Even if this one world is chock full of lookdown, the TAS as a whole won't feel like it is.
But instead, the TAS solution would just go through from one corner snaking through the board marking every square properly on the way until it painstakingly filled in every square correctly since there was unlimited time to figure out the solution beforehand.
Have you considered trying a single head bounce trick before being the tabletop tricks? It might let you eek out another 8 or 20 points.
Also, I'm sure I'm not the only person that years ago tried for a while to do standing tabletops on console, and it looks like you were just barely to complete the trick before landing. How much leeway was there? 1 frame? several?
Man, this game was indeed a highlight to my childhood. Those robots that did the high pitched screech and had vulcan cannons were the worst. Aside from those, it's probably the most fun I've had with a first person shooter ever.
3 button limit? ouch.
Uhh... Kickle Cubicle for the NES?
Pressing A and B simultaneously seems to be a waste, as does pressing three or four directions, and Start and Select don't have a whole lot of use, so it fits the three button limit.
Also, it has part of a test run for comparison done by Blublu, and it's something you can do a single level at a time.
Past that, there's room to improve if you're able to figure out how to choose what paths to take to move optimally. Trial and error works, but there's probably a more efficient way if you're willing to figure out memory addresses.
There's not a whole lot of "easy to TAS games", but this one seems a lot easier than Mega Man.
Some day after you've finished this TAS, you should explain how you are "polishing the RNG". Ultimately, that's the most impressive thing I've seen (though the route is impressive).
I really don't want to be discouraging, but I am concerned, and I'm hoping I'm missing something, I'm mistaken on something, my numbers are wrong, or you know something I don't (all of which are more than a little possible).
E. All of the Above, apparently. I like it. I'll hold any further comment until I've seen the movie you posted, but I'm excited instead of concerned this time!
Oh. Wow. I lack the vocabulary to express how impressed I am with this route.
I must confess, though, that the mere thought of Lux/Lejes being capable of taking down Gorsia at level 25 is hard to accept.
At level 25 with max gear and maximum stats from level up and the seeds you've listed, Lux has potentially 210 HP, 133 Power, 158 Guard, and 115 Speed. Let's assume that you've made it through the set-up phase of the Gorsia battle having managed to use the Runes against him and use B Power and B Prtct.
At this point, you still have only a 17% chance of not missing an attack on Gorsia. Also, you'll have to Defend+Attack since your attacks will otherwise do only 1 damage compared to 59-99 damage with a Defend+Attack. While Lux will be able to survive two physical attacks from Gorsia about half the time (and unless I'm mistaken, all the time if one of them is on a turn Lux is Defending), I am concerned about being able to deplete Gorsia's 2000 HP before running out of Potn 3 and M Water. Also, at level 25, Lejes will have a maximum of 110 MP (okay, a little more because of the Elnard bonuses), but still he'll only be able to use F Shield 6-8 times before running out of MP, and you won't have M Herb to replenish his MP.
I really don't want to be discouraging, but I am concerned, and I'm hoping I'm missing something, I'm mistaken on something, my numbers are wrong, or you know something I don't (all of which are more than a little possible). The "obvious" plan I'm assuming of having Lejes mostly functioning as support through F Shield and Potn 3 while Lux Defend+Attacks might not be what you have in mind.
In short, what is the "if everything goes perfectly in the ideal way" plan to kill Gorsia?
Hmm... what an interesting idea.
Popcorn - Defeat every enemy on a stage using only Fire Bubbles.
Swept Away - Defeat evert enemy on a stage using only Water Bubbles.
Chain Reaction - Pop 7 enemies at the same time.
Wrong Way - Achieve a Bad End.
No Friend to Help You - Defeat the Super Drunk with 2 players without the second player moving.
Spelling Bee Champ - Spell EXTEND twice without using a continue.
Ninja - Evade Baron von Blubba for 20 seconds.
Blame Level 57 - Use 30 continues.
Of course, complete Bubble Bobble (or Super Bubble Bobble) and complete each without a continue would be obvious possibilities, two of them very difficult.
The death screen isn't random, but rather caused by the machine running out of RAM or something like that, if I remember correctly.
Unless I'm mistaken, then, it couldn't be luck-manipulated away.
There's a few of us more than a little annoyed with Kickle Cubicle.
If you're looking for an idea to get your feet wet, TAS-wise, I'd recommend giving that one a look. It's fairly easy to make video that looks darn-impressive, there's easily broken into small chunks that (as far as I know) can be worked on independently, and there's a few unknowns that lead to some optimization questions that leave room for someone to show genius.
That was interesting to watch, indeed. I'm not sure how well that'd keep an entertainment factor for a whole Level 2 playthrough, though.
I say go for it... and make sure those 3 sidekicks are dead quick!
My previous strategy issue was finding an efficient way to level to an unknown level required to beat bosses.
Well, on the overworld, you can fairly quick brute-force manipulate a pretty good start to a battle. If I remember correctly, there was a 4 frame timespan on which you could start pressing a direction to walk wherein if your movements after beginning to move were identical, the corresponding patterns of enemy movement were also identical. Past that, changing the path you walk (particularly easy if you need to move diagonally), led to additional groups of 4 potential battle scenarios. I'm thinking that enough experience can be gained from battles on the overworld to handle Romus, Pison, Red Pison, and the Patrof apprentice without backtracking, standing around, or otherwise sacrificing many frames outside of battle.
Kirkq wrote:
The most efficient way to level would be with a single character so experience doesn't get split in half.
I agree. As such, my theory has been that we should use Lux solo until after the Star Rune and after a significant level grinding session outside Luze. We then should recruit Olvan, who can use some really good equipment (that we won't spend money on for Lux), has Fire 1 (for that uhh... "Dogun" I think in Gariso's castle), and has some healing spells (which for all we know, may be necessary for Gorsia). In addition, waiting until a higher level to recruit Olvan will mean he comes equipped with better armor.
Kirkq wrote:
Is there a character we could recruit that is good for killing Red Pison at a low level?
That's a good question, but to the best of my knowledge, no.
Kirkq wrote:
What character can beat S Brains at the lowest level? This will almost surely be our method of grinding levels for most of the run.
I would say almost definitely Lux, then Wilme second.
Kirkq wrote:
Can we get to S Brains and start killing them without having to level up at all after Red Pison? The castle boss for the Third Rune is actually supposed to be easier if you are at a low level.
I'm thinking "yes, we can". There are three reasons I can come up for why the Patrof apprentice is more easily defeated at a lower level, and I think we may be able to make use of them all:
(1) The Elnard -> 7th Saga leveling stat bonus was removed for "The 7th Saga", but the stat calculations for an opposing apprentice include this bonus. This bonus doesn't really come into play until level 10, but it becomes an increasingly large discrepancy that becomes increasingly larger faster every additional 10 levels. Low levels would minimize this severe disadvantage.
(2) Depending on the apprentice and the level, some offensive spells might not yet be learned. A Wilme or Kamil battle is significantly easier if they cannot use Fire 2 on you.
(3) The Water Rune heals a greater percentage of your HP when you have lower maximum HP, so in a fight between lower levels, the Water Rune advantage will be greater.
Regardless, we will hopefully be able to go: B Power, Attack, Defend, Attack and win in 4 rounds.
Kirkq wrote:
What character combination would be best for beating all bosses thereafter including the final boss?
In my console experience: Lux and Olvan. This does have a lot to do with Olvan's raw power, equipment use, and as assumption that he will reach a high enough level that he gets his final spells (including Heal 3 and Revive1). Additionally, Metal Pison and the dragon-clone (Dogun?) is Gariso's castle that has high defense and resists except for Fire are concerns that Lux and Olvan would be better equipped to handle as a duo than any others I can think of (I'm discounting Wilme here since I find him too fragile and his fire magic too weak to be really useful).
Nitrodon wrote:
The Patrof apprentice's level is actually set as soon as the sage in Eygus moves out of the way
Are we absolutely certain about this? I don't think this is true, but I would be glad to be wrong.
Unfortunately, grad school has been keeping me from toying with 7th Saga, but I think Animand has been working with it somewhat. Maybe he'll drop in with anything he's found.
Wow, that's a lot of published runs in the past few days.
Thanks and cheers to the encoders and others who worked to publish those good runs in the queue!