Alright then, 100% includes more than just what subscreens show. but then the washing machine is not needed for 100% because the game does not save that you've done it after a reset. Just like it doesn't save what extra life statues you've picked up or feathers. So I guess 100% means all mumbo tokens and all moves and all cauldrons activated?
Anyway GUESS WHAT http://tas.monotoli.org/mov/bk/OMGFINALLY-bkDJ.mkv (less than 1 MB) the backflip alone probably took 150 rerecords :(
Here's a trick that I'm pretty sure is the fastest form of grounded movement
Description:in any area with a slippery floor and a flight pad (i.e.only in Freezeezy Peak), beak bomb and land at a low angle the moment the beak bomb ends. You will slide for a good distance at beak bomb speeds.
[Quote="AKA"I tried doing it earlier but the fence seems to push banjo back off the cliff.[/quote]
That's not the case and I can prove it. Just enter the high area the normal way, and jump onto the fence. It'll push you off the fence but not the platform. You can walk between the platform and the ledge.
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Alright then, 100% includes more than just what subscreens show. but then the washing machine is not needed for 100% because the game does not save that you've done it after a reset. Just like it doesn't save what extra life statues you've picked up or feathers. So I guess 100% means all mumbo tokens and all moves and all cauldrons activated?
Anyway GUESS WHAT http://tas.monotoli.org/mov/bk/OMGFINALLY-bkDJ.mkv (less than 1 MB) the backflip alone probably took 150 rerecords :(
Awesome!!!!
Is that your movement faster as my roll+kump+fly movement ?
Awesome!!!!
Is that your movement faster as my roll+kump+fly movement ?
Same speed per cycle, but like that I can do many more in a given timespan.
Also I discovered a text skip! When you reach the top of spiral mountain find the area that activates bottles, and roll sideways (i.e. straight out) right before you touch it. then jump forward (90 degrees to banjo's left if you did it properly) once you are far enough that that won't take you over the land (because then you will auto-land and talk to mole) jump as high as you can keeping just right of the platform (i.e. hold control stick at around 30 degrees left, or alternate 0 and 45) and flap at the peak of the jump. then you will be glitching on the fence edge near the post, if you can get your feet to touch the land without creating a shadow, make a frame-perfect jump (difficult since you only see half the frames in the game) (you can jump over the land if you are touching the post, but you don't need to jump over the land anyway) and land on the bridge after another flap. then enter the lair :D
Demo: http://tas.monotoli.org/mov/bk/SpiralBottlesSkip-bkDJ.mkv
Anyway, have we dicided what the quickest order to collect and scale the mountain would be? I'm thinking colliwobble, rocks, water, stump, tree, waterfall...
Awesome awesome awesome!!! ;)
I checked my latest complete SM and my time when I get final honeycomb is 1.45. If I use that cauliflower shortcut I get under 1.40 ;)
I continue using that roll+jump+fly because its looks better :) and its same speed as your movement
Hmm, when coming from the piece under the bridge, you can use a tall stump on the way to jump to the high one with the honeycomb piece. that way you don't have to do the slow backflip.
Nice, Nice! Spiral mountain's route will be complete soon!
So in terms of route planning, it seems that the overworld may have some strange movement because of the locations of puzzles, entrances, and of course witch switch jiggies. Then we can factor in the warp cauldrons... It seems quite daunting, much more than the Mario 64 overworld route. Maybe even more than an optimal Majora's Mask route.
Anyways, good luck!
Ooh, ooh! PLZ ENCODE!!!!!!!11!!11
now that I've got that out of my system, I think we can draw the following conclusions from bkDJ's movement test:
1)When you jump across something you can save time by rolling first and flapping before you hit the ground.
2)All the speed benefit of a roll happens in the first 10 frames. All the speed benefit of a flap happens in the first 16 frames.
3)The speed loss in a rolljump happens when you land and takes 4 frames.
Hypothesis: Ending a roll in midair and flapping right before hitting the ground saves 8(!!) frames versus walking off the platform.
Hypothesis: Roll-jump-beakbuster is 4 frames faster than run-jump-beakbuster.
Hypothesis: Rolling right before each flipflap jump saves 4 frames. However, it appears to save more than 4 frames if you jump in the first 10 frames of rolling.
Trying 127.0.0.1...
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Ooh, ooh! PLZ ENCODE!!!!!!!11!!11
now that I've got that out of my system, I think we can draw the following conclusions from bkDJ's movement test:
1)When you jump across something you can save time by rolling first and flapping before you hit the ground.
2)All the speed benefit of a roll happens in the first 10 frames. All the speed benefit of a flap happens in the first 16 frames.
3)The speed loss in a rolljump happens when you land and takes 4 frames.
Hypothesis: Ending a roll in midair and flapping right before hitting the ground saves 8(!!) frames versus walking off the platform.
Hypothesis: Roll-jump-beakbuster is 4 frames faster than run-jump-beakbuster.
Hypothesis: Rolling right before each flipflap jump saves 4 frames. However, it appears to save more than 4 frames if you jump in the first 10 frames of rolling.
1) correct
2) first sentence correct. it might even be 8 but I was sick of testing and so I say 10 to play it safe. second sentence incorrect. you get the boost within maybe 4 to 8 frames. the rest is waiting before you actually land and can roll again on prefectly flat ground it will be maybe 6 frames on hills going up, or a full second or more on hills going down.
3) rolljump is 0 loss and is pointless if the alternative is plain running.
hypothesis 1: true. in my run I will jump off the final honeycomb platform rather than rollflap because it takes longer than 8 frames for banjo to turn around so the roll is in the correct direction and get to where he was, but a jump allows you to change direction immediately. In my run I also do some edge boosting. for example again final honeycomb piece I will fall at the edge and it will push me where I want to go, and I still flap before hitting the water. andother example is when I exit the colliwobble garden I jump in such a way that the fence boosts me and then the edge boosts me and then I flap. (you have to watch it frame by frame to even see the boosts but they are there and they help) short version: correct assuming you are going in a straight line. on the platform.
hypothesis 2: yeah basically if you have to jump and there is nothing right above you that you need, roll first.
hypothesis 3: what? you can't flipflap during a roll. I do use the momentum I have to slide while crouched and reposition myself if I have to flipflap or, later in the game, shoot eggs.
And yeah I was busy with other stuff, but I'll encode when I'm done.
3) rolljump is 0 loss and is pointless if the alternative is plain running.
I meant, you gain 4 frames over running at the beginning of the maneuver and lose them when you land.
bkDJ wrote:
hypothesis 3: what? you can't flipflap during a roll. I do use the momentum I have to slide while crouched and reposition myself if I have to flipflap or, later in the game, shoot eggs.
Directions:
1)Run
2)Hit B
3)Wait a few frames
4)Hit Z
5)Hit A
This works even if you rolled off a platform.
EDIT: and if you start the flipflap jump in the first few frames of a roll, you seem to move faster when sliding. An imprecise console test seemed to confirm this.
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I assumed you couldn't since you can't interrupt a roll with a duck.
Right, just like you can't start a talon trot in midair.
Directions:
1)Run towards ledge edge
2)duck
3)Hit talon trot the frame before you leave the platform.
You will fall streight down for a bit, then stop completely for a frame when the talon trot starts.
Also, in the crow's nest on Blubber's ship, talk to Bottles right as you leave the platform.
Completely unrelated, I'd like to see you dodge one of Conga's oranges by rolling off the stump and jumping back on from midair. EDIT:Sorry, you did do it(as mentioned in next post).
For someone with frame advance: Is the stop-in-midair useful anywhere? Can you jump on that one frame?
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Joined: 5/27/2005
Posts: 465
Location: Turku, Finland
Nice job with the Spiral Mountain! And because you don't use the same eour as the SDA run, it looks less copied. I presume this run will take quite some time to get finished since you two are being so thorough, which is good of course.
I'm wondering 2 things. 1: why does project64 play this game at 60fps, but mupen64 plays it at 30fps. the missing 2 frames every 4 makes TAS difficult. And a new trick I didn't think of. on juju in mumbo's mountain, instead of doing a slow backflip which falls slowly and pauses after landing, you can just do a normal jump and and Z to stomp. before stomping, you go up and collect the honeycomb :D (saves maybe 1 or 2 seconds)
CONFIMED! HAH!
I predicted earlier that you may be able to jump on the frame you enter a Talon Trot in midair; Well, I just did it on console.
Directions:
1)Trigger a talon trot when you go off a ledge, as above
2)The frame you stop in midair, hit A along with the control stick in the desired direction.
I'm currently working on a beak bomb slide in places other than Freezeezy.
EDIT:Also, directions for beak buster climbing in case you missed it earlier:
1) Grab onto a climbable pole.
2) Jump
3) Wait a few frames (Timing is critical: you can ascend anywhere from 0 to ~4 meters based on timing)
4)Hit Z
You will begin grabbing at the peak of the beak buster and continue moving up at the same speed until the grab animation finishes. Perfectly done, this is noticably faster than normal climbing.
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http://tas.monotoli.org/mov/bk/Banjo-Kazooie-TAS-bkDJ.m64
http://tas.monotoli.org/mov/bk/SpiralMountain-bkDJ.mkv
(sound glitch on the last second but whatever I'm not fixing it)
