It didn't especially help that I'm not exactly an OoT speedrunning expert, and I have very little knowledge of the internal details of most of the tricks, routes and glitches
Well, you could have learned if you really wanted to see that route tased. ZSR is a good reasource and there are a lot of friendly, helpfull people on the dicord.
Warp wrote:
(especially the ones that are not used in the unassisted speedrun because they are not feasible for humans to do consistently).
The only tricks in this game that humans can't do are z- and a- slides.
Warp wrote:
All these tricks and techniques can be seen in the unofficial N64 TAS (ie. the one that uses the (previous) any% route that normally crashes the console, but doesn't crash the emulator for some reason)
The reason is that it uses a graphics plugin that emulates so inaccurately that it doesn't crash. You can see quite a few graphics glitches throughout the run.
Most graphics plugins do crash.
Just out of curiosity: Can you explain a few more technical details about this? Why would this make it possible to skip the Slingshot? I always thought slingshot is needed to manipulate certain memory values by creating seeds. Maybe I have a huge misconception here :/
Just out of curiosity: Can you explain a few more technical details about this? Why would this make it possible to skip the Slingshot? I always thought slingshot is needed to manipulate certain memory values by creating seeds. Maybe I have a huge misconception here :/
Yes, but also no. :D
There are a few different things here.
At the moment you use the slingshot direction to write certain values. But you don't technically need to. Link's angle or first person angle could be used as well (the later has more options but is not really viable for RTA, as far as I understand).
Up until the return-A Ocarina skip was found you would have needed a deku seed drop to move the camera without the ocarina. So for that you still would have needed the slingshot. (and it was kinda hard for RTA, which is why nobody worked on a heap manip for it, as far as I understand).
So now with the return A ocarina skip it is viable to also skip the slingshot and people are looking for a heap manip and a way to use Link's angle.
There is still a chance that this might not work out, though. But I have faith in those guys.
(especially the ones that are not used in the unassisted speedrun because they are not feasible for humans to do consistently).
The only tricks in this game that humans can't do are z- and a- slides.
I said "for humans to do consistently". In other words, the tricks that could theoretically be used in the (old) any% but aren't used because they are too difficult to do consistently enough, such as the Mido skip. Or jumping directly from the top level inside Deku Tree onto the skulltula that glitches you out of bounds (for the GIM glitch).
Nobody went to the highest level to break the web for quite a while. You'd hover off a skulltulla.
Mido skip is also feasable for humans to do in a run. With the GIM route it just wasn't worth it, since you needed to go through there twice.
The route before that did use mido skip.
So I'm still not quite sure what you are on about. I especially don't get how it prevented you from tasing.
Isn't this new route kind of bad for a TAS due to the different timing method? You warp to the very first part of the credits, which means that some textboxes will have to be cleared, while the previous route skipped them.
Current project: Gex 3 any%
Paused: Gex 64 any%
There are no N64 emulators. Just SM64 emulators with hacky support for all the other games.
Isn't this new route kind of bad for a TAS due to the different timing method? You warp to the very first part of the credits, which means that some textboxes will have to be cleared, while the previous route skipped them.
This isn't a new problem, though. The previous non-ACE route warped to Ganon and it had the same issue - people just cited both times iirc
Isn't this new route kind of bad for a TAS due to the different timing method? You warp to the very first part of the credits, which means that some textboxes will have to be cleared, while the previous route skipped them.
This isn't a new problem, though. The previous non-ACE route warped to Ganon and it had the same issue - people just cited both times iirc
There could be a problem with this though where the runner has to decide between different routes. One that is faster according to RTA timing, the other according to TAS timing. In which case, which route should one chose?
Isn't this new route kind of bad for a TAS due to the different timing method? You warp to the very first part of the credits, which means that some textboxes will have to be cleared, while the previous route skipped them.
This isn't a new problem, though. The previous non-ACE route warped to Ganon and it had the same issue - people just cited both times iirc
There could be a problem with this though where the runner has to decide between different routes. One that is faster according to RTA timing, the other according to TAS timing. In which case, which route should one chose?
With access to TAS tools and precision, there's probably a setup that's almost identical to the current setup except being a few frames faster or slower which would warp to a portion of the credits after the last cutscene.
A TASer of the game would have to find a setup which works to do that, though one almost certainly exists.
Link to video
TAS-only, and definitely will be refined soon, but HERE IT IS!!!
Too good to be true, damn :D
Cheeze writes that skipping sword, shield or deku nuts is quite unrealistic. So what exactly are the dependencies right now? I assume something like this maybe?
- Nuts are needed for "walking while talking".
- Sword is needed for the memory manipulation process itself (right? wrong?), getting past Mido and seemingly to pick up the rock (right? wrong?)
- Shield is needed to activate Return A
As I haven't played much OoT within the last years, my knowledge on stuff like the exact effects of "walking while talking" is quite rusty. Some help for the old man on the following questions would be awesome:
- What necessary effect has Return A? Can't we simply do normal "walking while talking", walk to the rock, pick it up and carry it towards the Deku Tree area loading trigger? From what I understood the main benefit of Return A here is, that it makes the camera follow link until we get to the rock. Would the rock be unloaded otherwise without the camera pointing at it?
- Do we have to get Mido out of the way to be able to carry the rock towards the Deku Tree area or would he be unloaded during the "walking while talking" process?
- What necessary effect has Return A? Can't we simply do normal "walking while talking", walk to the rock, pick it up and carry it towards the Deku Tree area loading trigger? From what I understood the main benefit of Return A here is, that it makes the camera follow link until we get to the rock. Would the rock be unloaded otherwise without the camera pointing at it?
- Do we have to get Mido out of the way to be able to carry the rock towards the Deku Tree area or would he be unloaded during the "walking while talking" process?
1) Yeah, the rock would be unloaded otherwise, and part of the setup is unloading the rock as you're grabbing it.
Sword may be required to cancel Return A to snap the camera back after picking up the rock (not 100% on that), it's needed to load in the spin attack aura into memory for the heap manip iirc, and for position setups on RTA
2) I think we need to get Mido out of the way to come back from the Deku Baba area, and also for the heap manip, at least that's what I've gathered.
It really does seem like all 3 items are crucial.
Not sure if Mido unloads, MrGrunz. The guard in front of the Kokiri exit does (or at least doesn't block you). But I seem to remember that Mido was different. If he does, you'd still have to get back, as evilas said, and I don't think you can slide with return A. Could be wrong though. Even then I'm not sure if hess-speed is enough to clip through him.
Vielleicht solltest du jemanden fragen der sich mit sowas auskennt. :D (ask the guys on dicord)
In any case, you'd probably need sword to get enough rupees for shield fast and you need shield for return A. So the only time you could concievably save by skipping Mido would be his text.
This run is probably not legit (people are still discussing what should be allowed for RTA). It's certainly not legit for TAS. It sets up things in RAM with a different file before the run and the video begins.
Also it doesn't skip anything that the slingshot skip video evilas linked doesn't skip as well.
I don't think it sets up anything in RAM - resets clear RAM. What she does is a setup to set the Controller 3 stick to the correct angle beforehand and do the slingshot skip I linked to.
That's definitely not legit for RTA wr yet - people are still discussing it.
In a TAS, you wouldn't do that, you'd just set Controller 3 to the correct angle manually.
Yeah, I was wrong there, sorry. The legitimacy of multiple things are being discussed at the moment and I confused them.
So the run is basically the same as the slingshot skip video.
https://youtu.be/MXH7OiwOx0I
WR down to 8:11.3
With TAS luck manipulation we should be able to get 13 rupees from the bushes, and make Sub 8 mins possible
Is anyone planning on tasing this?
Interesting new development: Even when ACE is banned, you can supply your filename as DATA to a function that calls another function based on what your filename was. This can be used to make a very fast any% no ACE route. I think the OoT community will rule soon on how to define categories.
Link to videoLink to video
