Post by CLChambers00

Posted: 12/6/2006 11:36 AM

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Creatus

Joined: 3/18/2006
Posts: 81
Location: Finland

Oh! I just forgot the main goal. So that was my mistake :P

Posted: 12/7/2006 12:51 PM

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Randil

Skilled player (1828)

Joined: 4/20/2005
Posts: 2161
Location: Norrköping, Sweden

Thusday is done! This was another "Window Crashing Day". As you will see, I got a lot of paper refills on this day. I counted how many paper refills I got every day, and this is the result: Monday: 4 refills. Tuesday: 6 refills. Wednesday: 7 refills. Thursday: 13 refills. I hope this will keep rising even more. :D Because I got so many refills, I wasn't always able to use up all my papers before getting a new refill. Because I got so many refills on this day, I threw more papers on moving objects like the reaper, and the small car that drives around. If you have any comments or questions, then shoot. Otherwise, enjoy!

My own page on this site.

Posted: 12/7/2006 9:03 PM

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Tailz

Former player

Joined: 7/2/2005
Posts: 309
Location: Baltimore, MD

Very nice job. I wonder what happens to the papers you break windows or hit people with? Also, I think you should do the training course on Sunday as well.

Guybrush: "I'm selling these fine leather jackets." Wally: "Really?" Guybrush: "No. I 'm lying." Wally: "In that case, I don't want one!" Currently working on: Nothing at the moment.

Posted: 12/8/2006 3:33 AM

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tool23

Player (80)

Joined: 2/8/2005
Posts: 130

bonus nostalgia points! i definitely enjoy watching it, but dont know if it will get published

Posted: 12/8/2006 3:46 AM

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adelikat

He/Him

Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3576)

Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4754
Location: Tennessee

Looking good. A game like this needs to have maximum variety which you are achieving well so far. For the remaining days, I recommend going out to the street a little more. It is more impressive to hit targets from afar. The few times you did that were some of my favorite moments. Also, is it just me or was there a little bit of lag at the beginning of tuesday when the tornado on screen? If so, perhaps you could refrain from throwing so many papers during that time.

It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects

Posted: 12/8/2006 11:47 AM

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Randil

Skilled player (1828)

Joined: 4/20/2005
Posts: 2161
Location: Norrköping, Sweden

Friday is done now. As you'll see, there was some lag on this level. I hope it's not too annoying. I try to hit more people with papers, and I also try to ride the bike out on the street more. There were 11 paper refills on this day, that's a 2 less than yesterday. Let me know what you think about friday. Enjoy!

My own page on this site.

Posted: 12/8/2006 2:59 PM

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Titus_Kwok

Joined: 4/30/2006
Posts: 480
Location: the secret cow level

god... I watch this, and I wonder how I ever managed to die when the hit detection is that bad.

Posted: 12/8/2006 11:34 PM

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VANDAL

Experienced player (614)

Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 612

Friday looks really nice, it's probably my favorite day so far. I could barely notice the lag and I was really trying to observe where it may be.

Posted: 12/9/2006 4:45 PM

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Tailz

Former player

Joined: 7/2/2005
Posts: 309
Location: Baltimore, MD

Amazing, Friday was spectacular! I love watching you pelt people with papers. I didn't notice any lag though I wasn't really looking for it so it couldn't have been that bad. Either way, great job.

Guybrush: "I'm selling these fine leather jackets." Wally: "Really?" Guybrush: "No. I 'm lying." Wally: "In that case, I don't want one!" Currently working on: Nothing at the moment.

Posted: 5/1/2017 11:47 AM

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c-square

Active player (378)

Joined: 9/25/2011
Posts: 652

Hi all, I just found this: Link to video Does anyone want to update a 10+ year-old TAS?

Posted: 5/1/2017 11:48 AM

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Spikestuff

They/Them

Editor, Publisher, Expert player (2656)

Joined: 10/12/2011
Posts: 6449
Location: The land down under.

sure... and I failed. Whoop, my laziness.

WebNations/Sabih wrote:

+fsvgm777 never censoring anything.

Disables Comments and Ratings for the YouTube account. Something better for yourself and also others.

Posted: 5/2/2017 9:26 PM

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Alyosha

He/Him

Editor, Emulator Coder, Expert player (3828)

Joined: 11/30/2014
Posts: 2834
Location: US

Some console testing needs to be done with paperboy before a new run can be made. The arrangement of customer houses after power on is determined by power up timings in the emulator, and I am almost certain that the configuartion in the currently published run is not accessible at power on.

Posted: 2/26/2018 8:58 AM

Post subject: NES Paperboy

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CLChambers00

Joined: 7/21/2017
Posts: 54

I have ran NES Paperboy on a front loader NES with an everdrive, and I also TASed it using Bizhawk, this would be a new TAS to surpass the old one. However, despite the fact that the tas editor allows you to modify frame by frame my run of Monday was 4272 frames, but TAS required 4285 frames. There is no lag frames on this day and it is the fastest the day can be accomplished. After TASing it I compared the frame count to the frame count of my recent world record run, and the amount of frames it took me to complete each day ran almost exactly 99.7% of what was required in Bizhawk, using NesHawk. This is very strange. I first thought that maybe my NES was consistently running faster but again I have compared my runs to other player runs and they are comparable. I used three forms of verification to get the frame count of my run on original hardware: 1) Viewing the timer value in LiveSplit on first and last frame, 2) frame analysis of OBS capture of the game, and 3) frame analysis in Yua after deinterlacing the direct feed recorded by Amarec. Here is the BK2 file for the first version of my TAS since my next version is not completed yet. You will also find in here the direct feed of my world record run and a video of the BK2 file. Placing these side by side you can see what I am talking about: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1k6oFIsPaWaBeFjnNrkib-_yhxXwFhRU3 Also, here is the run the TAS is based on: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4sESTUcQM10 Any thoughts?

Chambers_N

Posted: 2/26/2018 1:45 PM

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Alyosha

He/Him

Editor, Emulator Coder, Expert player (3828)

Joined: 11/30/2014
Posts: 2834
Location: US

Interesting. I tested your movie in the most recent BizHawk version and it still syncs, so it's not an emulation difference there. I tested it in Mesen and it did de-sync, so that is a strong indication that something is up. The game uses CNROM which isn't anything too special. I'll look into it. EDIT: Some initial results: Car Honks and Crashes in the game use the DMC channel meaning some DMC DMAs happen at those times, but I didn't see anything that would cause slow down there. Mesen ends up 3 frames behind BizHawk by the time of the restart, I haven't tracked down why yet (probably some ppu timing thing since Mesen starts a little differently.) Whatever the case may be slower isn't helping us here. EDIT 2: I'm not seeing anything here that would cause an error of 13 frames. My suggestion would be to send this run through a console replay device. If there is a consistent de-sync it might point out where emulation is going wrong, but right now my guess is that it would in fact sync (at least some of the time) and that the error is somewhere in the video processing. EDIT3: I added 3 frames to the movie right before pressing start to restart the game after the intentional crashes. After doing this the run synced in Mesen all the way up until Friday (~38000 frames.) This is pretty strong evidence the emulation is correct to much better then 13 frames every level.

Posted: 2/26/2018 11:35 PM

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CLChambers00

Joined: 7/21/2017
Posts: 54

This is curious. So Bizhawk reaches a pixel in 100 frames, and my NES reaches it in 99.7 frames it seems. And so my run slowly and consistently keeps pulling ahead. I was told that my NES could not be running fast because it would still have to sync with video output or something like that. I will see about getting some screenshots of some things.

Chambers_N

Posted: 2/27/2018 1:46 AM

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link_7777

Experienced player (878)

Joined: 11/15/2010
Posts: 267

I took a quick look myself, and I think some more analysis is needed, but your first big problem is that your video frame rates are different. That makes it much harder to compare. I'm guessing your WR one is straight from your game capture and the TAS one is an avi dump from bizhawk. The meta data suggests that your WR video is 59.94 fps where the TAS one is 60.099 fps. with the frame counts you listed that means the TAS is actually only 0.02775 seconds apart, which is less than 2 frames. That calculation assumes your start and end points for those frame counts are synced up, but they probably aren't since you're checking from the beginning of the level on mismatched frame rate movies that are already running. How does the real time equivalent of the TAS compare to your RTA WR if you assume a 60.099 frame rate for the TAS?

Posted: 2/27/2018 2:03 AM

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CLChambers00

Joined: 7/21/2017
Posts: 54

I got the frame count from the TAS editor for the tas frames. My frames are taken from the direct feed which according to amerec is 29.97. I also did an avi of both a bizhawk video and an avi from a movie down on the emu without tas editor and the frames were both 4285. I also checked the video by peanutfan22, and he is faster than the tas but a tad slower than mine. He is using Nestopia I believe.

Chambers_N

Posted: 2/27/2018 2:13 AM

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CLChambers00

Joined: 7/21/2017
Posts: 54

My new TAS frame count is 38466 so what time does that calculate to if that was 59.94 fps? If this was 60.099 fps then how does that work? This is all new to me. Also, I use a splitter based on what I see on my tv and that correlates to my frame count on my direct feed.

Chambers_N

Posted: 2/27/2018 2:20 AM

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Alyosha

He/Him

Editor, Emulator Coder, Expert player (3828)

Joined: 11/30/2014
Posts: 2834
Location: US

I guess its possible that your NES is running slightly faster then normal. Everything comes from the same master clock including the signals that control the TV signal. Could be some kind of frequency drift I suppose. It's pretty hard to account for 13 frames otherwise. Also I did test that simplified movements without paper deliveries does not effect the level time. So, it seems certain that the same amount of frames are passing here. The question seems to be how much real time each frame is taking.

Posted: 2/27/2018 2:29 AM

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link_7777

Experienced player (878)

Joined: 11/15/2010
Posts: 267

CLChambers00, maths my friend, please. 38466 frames ÷ 60.099 fps * 59.94 fps = 38364.233 frames. Convert to time and then back to frames (at the speed of your capture)

Posted: 2/27/2018 2:37 AM

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CLChambers00

Joined: 7/21/2017
Posts: 54

Lol, I am not very good at math, I couldn't think of that series of calculations to be honest, thank you.

Chambers_N

Posted: 2/27/2018 2:49 AM

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CLChambers00

Joined: 7/21/2017
Posts: 54

So counting frames does not seem to be a good way to compare runs, seems to me that YUA may recognize the frame rate of the video and converts it to appropriate time, do you guys confirm that?

Chambers_N

Posted: 2/27/2018 4:54 AM

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link_7777

Experienced player (878)

Joined: 11/15/2010
Posts: 267

I guess that is the short story. If your capture frame rate is different than the emu frame rate you should convert and compare actual time, not frames

Posted: 2/27/2018 10:04 PM

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CLChambers00

Joined: 7/21/2017
Posts: 54

Thanks for your help. I did a TAS in 10:39.763 for this game. :D

Chambers_N

Forum NES Games Paperboy Game: Paperboy

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NES Games

Paperboy Game: Paperboy