>Floating glitch is not available without pegasusu boots, IIRC
My bad. TAS-ing this game is so fast it didn't dawn on me you had no Pegasus Boots yet :)
>I'm going to get infinite rupees with YBA, I won't duplicate a heart container
It's the same decision we did with speedruns for this game so no worries.
Wow, this game is far glitchier than I thought. I could see why "100%" definition would be rather tricky, given how a number of things can be seemingly magically glitched. I have no idea what to make of duping rupees but not heart containers other than it would be "interesting", but good luck.
Edit: Btw how many of these glitches are still possible in the gba version?
Wow, this game is far glitchier than I thought. I could see why "100%" definition would be rather tricky, given how a number of things can be seemingly magically glitched. I have no idea what to make of duping rupees but not heart containers other than it would be "interesting", but good luck.
It seems clear to me. 100% is COLLECTING all the things in the game meant to be attained by game developers, not magically attaining them. If you duplicate something, clearly the original is still there, so it doesn't count for 100%.
As for rupees, there are an infinite amount of them, so they can't be classified as "collectibles." Actually, it's the same for heart containers. You can duplicate an infinite amount of them if you wish, but you must still collect all the heart containers in the game.
What I had thought was entering the correct entrance of dungeon and defeating Boss until I watched a new glitched 100% RTA. I didn't have the idea of activating EG by bonking and getting a pendant or a crystal. In order to get a pendant or a crystal, Link should be in the correct dungeon. So, I thought separating defeating a boss from collecting the reward was duplication of effort. I was wrong. Rethinking a tas route is necessary.
If a tas route is identical with an RTA route, I am not so motivated. When you explore a plaid world quickly, dashing is the first choice. Left/Right tricks like wobbling and pixelporting are not so useful. I think one of the significance of tasing is performing tas specific tricks. While I am happy to watch more sophistecated RTAs, the singnificance of tasing is losing. There are many categories about speedrun of this game. Just added wobbling and pixelporting, an RTA will be a tas. But when does it come to be a publishable?
I thought a tas specific route would be Skull Woods to PoD, and GTower. Somaria glitch in GTower in a tas can be done without conveyer, so it's faster than an earlier version of a glitched 100% RTA. But after I watched the latest RTA, I suspect my route is outdated.
Still, I made a mistake. Mushroom should be gotten earlier. I postponed it since I didn't wear pegasusu boots at that time. And I thought refilling magic meter after I got a pendant or a crystal took some time just after I got 1/2 magic meter with mushroom. However, with pixelporting, mushroom can be gotten very quickly. Also, around Kakariko village, Desert and Mountain, an earlier version of 100% glitched RTA method of the way of travelling overworld while collecting items is faster. I was going to combine the RTA route and my old tas.
About accessing Thieves Hideout, in a tas, the fastest way is getting a heart piece in a cave in mountain, floating to the entrance, no buffering clip downward in $EA and in room-stair glitch with left/right, but I have to use a mirror many times around graveyard. I don't have moon pearl at that time, so I can't take an RTA route.
In order to explore in plaid world and defeat bosses, Link has to have no flippers. I wonder if there were a way of defeating multiple bosses with flippers.
Anyway, here is a movie with left/right. (use snes9x v1.51rr) http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1800693805/ALttP_Fake_Flute_At_Dungeon_Entrance.smv
This trick works in some other dungeon's entrance. I was going to use this trick.
edit: I just came upon a thing and tried it. (use snes9x v1.43rr)
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/367214652/ALttP_FakeFlippers_to_KingZora.smv
I used a bomb and up/down. I don't know if it's possible without bomb and up/down to activate fakeflippers. As long as I tried, it seemed to be impossible. The optimal inputs of swimming are still a mystery, but swimming to King Zora is about 38 frames faster in Zora's river compared this inputs with my old tas in 2015. Not considered set up time.
edit2: This trick may or may not be known and maybe it's useless, but I'll show you. The method is Somaria glitch with spin attack in TRock near Mirror Shield entrance. If you have defeated Arrghus and if you have not defeated Trinexx, you can get Zelda's crystal and exitwarp in front of swamp. (recorded on snes9x v1.43rr)
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1039482360/Alttp_TRock-to-Swamp.smv
Escaping with Zelda not toward church but toward EP. (recorded on snes9x v1.51rr)
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/803069877/ALttP_EP_with_Zelda.smv
It's slower. I just wanted to show another application of backwalking through the door glitch and walking out through the gap in corridor.
Btw, when you do EG, you should avoid dark room and the closing effect of automatic door. It's slower.
Non-camera scrolling type of backwalking through the door glitch is faster in some cave in a tas.
Thanks!! Especially, Yuzuhara's smvs are very useful. I've not noticed that Somaria glitch can be done without grabbing a Somaria block with left/right. And I didn't know multiple somaria glitch. Maybe it is not known well. Still, there are a lot of things to be studied in this game.
I'll commentate some movies.
Swamp to 300r by Somaria glitch is slower, sadly. If you do this, you mustn't pull the lever and blocks must be put at that position. And you have to enter the building twice.
I could Enemy OoB in that smv's savestate without poke sword, but I couldn't in my WIP. Though I don't know if it's faster.
Bye bye turtle room is the fastest way in RBO tas with left/right. Consume some MP, prepare spin dash, green YBA in out-room stairs, activate spin dash, then go downstairs with left/right. Generally, when you go out-room stairs with left/right, you'll appear in a different initial position. This glitch abuses spin dash's highspeed. You'll appear in front of the boss door.
Now, I've done EP, PoD and Thieves.
-> http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/644184987/ALttP_100p_2017_WIP_002.smv
When you should get a Heart container in church is quite complicated. The distance between you and the chest is shortest when you first escaped the castle normally and restarting from church with boots is not so fast because you have to go up and down stairs. It depends on your strategy. This time I EGed to the church and get the Heart container after EP so I had only to be hit once. When I first visited the church, the pedestal moved, but this is not slower. The text box appears in the same timing.
I now understand when I clip toward left ledge, I don't have to put Link at the base position. If the last digit of Link's Y position is 0x1, 0x9, 0x2 or 0xa, press left, then Link starts to clip.
Damage boost by octorok was accidentally done, but it's not faster. Above church things, I did that section a few times. I copied inputs, then the result was that.
I was wrong in the cave with Grumpa. This time screen transition was reduced.
After I got Cane of Somaria, EG from in-room stairs to the clip room while avoiding dark room and BGM change by Trinexx was slightly faster, but I had to take damage this time.
To activate falling with exploded glitch in PoD, waiting a few decades of frames seems necessary.
To activate a crystal switch in PoD, Somaria beam causes lags but arrow also causes lags. It depends on RNG of turtles.
Arrows are excessive. After mimics, only 7 arrows are necessary, I think. (2 for Vitreous, 1 for Arrghus and 4 for Ganon)
300r is not necessary. We can get in digging game in tas. And Chest game -> Thieves -> Redboomerang is the fastest route. Thieves -> Chest game -> Redboomerang is the second.
I may not include bomb/arrow capacity upgrades. It looks redundunt and showing Fake Flute glitch is done before exploring Plaid World. Though, bomb/arrow capacity upgrades are possible like that: Pond of happiness -> Fake Flute in Ice Palace -> Pond of happiness.
Although the route is similar with RTA from now on, I'm thinking about some tas specific features. For example, releasing a fairy when I go to get Cane of Byra.
edit: A bomb after I got a redboomerang should not be gotten. Instead, I should have gotten from under the pod located up-right south from the conveyer room in Thieves. The former took at least 47 frames (50% chance) and the latter took 44 frames. Though I'm not going to redo unless there is a big mistake. Defeating Red & Blue Zazak and Red Stalfos is one of the most difficult part in this tas.
I don't know if this trick has been already known, but I found it today. So let me post it.
-> http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/361843225/ALttP_Stairs_with_SpinDash.smv
There are various ways of ascending or descending sort of stairs which doesn't cause a cutscene with spindash. If you push Link to the banister diagonally on wide stairs, or if you autofire or hold left and right on narrow stairs, Link ascends or descends quickly. This may be sometimes faster than pixelportation. In order to do pixelportation, you have to ascend or descend stairs to some degree.
What sort of run are we even talking about?
Trying to define which glitches are "minor" or "major" seems silly. For example, YBA gives arbitrary code execution (see the canceled Acmlm submission on this site, even). Time was ~4 minutes and isn't even optimized (and was canceled because it just skips to the end instead of doing anything particularly cool).
Any% w/Major Glitch is more or less "solved". Time is <3 minutes.
Showing off glitches is fun, but how do you make a run which doesn't devolve into "Skip to the end"? 100% with Major Glitches is easily done in code execution. Maybe you just ban YBA? (But this is no guarantee against arbitrary code, the game is really really really buggy, especially the japanese version).
Maybe allow YBA, but just ban using it for code execution? (How do you define code execution?). Maybe you also have to ban Wrong Warps/door way glitches/wall clipping teleports....
Is the Major Glitch category simply too broken to have any meaningful run?
[Edit: I started a 100% major glitch run. My time for EP->Zelda (clocking the second the sermon ends) was about 8:05. My estimates say that if you do Zelda->EP (clock the moment you leave after getting Boots) you would have a time of 7:20. In either case, you would EG as soon as possible to continue the quest. One issue I was debating was whether I should stop by to pick up the Cane of Somaria while running between EP (with boots) to save Zelda. It turns out it's on the way. As I mentioned, waiting to save zelda costs 45 seconds, so that run is a dead end anyway.
However, I noticed that current RTA 100% speed runners abuse YBA to do things like: Kill all bosses while in escape glitch mode, and only return to the dungeon to pick up their diamonds. If YBA lets you do crazy things like this, then I had to take a step back and really figure out if it made any sense to start with Zelda at all, and not just YBA and do crazy things. But then why not just YBA and 100% the game with code execution...
My conclusion was that (And you might disagree), the game is simply too glitchy to make even "no glitch" categories have any comprehensive understandable rules (which wall clips/teleports are allowed, and which aren't? Is it ok if you teleport 6 pixels, but not 60?..... The whole thing is incomprehensible.
Edit2: And if you glitch between areas (escape mode, wrong warps, clips, teleports...etc) you can skip all the keys too. Despite what Tompa said on this thread 3 years ago, boss chests do open up even without the right key, and everything unlocks if you are technically in the "Cave" dungeon. But you can also use doorway glitches to confuse the game into thinking you're somewhere else, and thus open chests that aren't even on the same screen as you. Do you even need to go to the Big Chest screens at all, at that point?
Playing with the game and glitches is fun, but the game is way more broken than anyone knew 8 years ago. It's a big problem. There is no way I can continue to work on a run without knowing the rules (Though I'll probably give up because it seems no rules can reign in this pile of garbage code).
Personally, I think you should just define your own rules for your TAS or even speedruns. If the community doesn't like it, then too bad for them. other people will like it. You're the maker, define the rules of your TAS or runs. =)
Yeah. It doesn't have to go on the Workbench to be shared with us, and if there's enough positive reception (and it's sufficiently optimized) it can get submitted to Workbench from there.
(also: we need a more accurate name for the Workbench since it's not for WIPs (which outsiders would expect to see on a Workbench), but for submissions. Maybe "Judge Queue?")
Trying to define which glitches are "minor" or "major" seems silly
In the RTA community, a minor glitch should not make "Any% NMG" different from "All Dungeons/Bosses NMG". So basically anything that doesn't sequence break the game in such a way where you start skipping the big milestones in the game. The essence of it is to play the game with a somewhat normal route, but allow micro-optimizations like spinspeed and bomb jumps.
We have an "official" list of what is defined as a Major Glitch here https://pastebin.com/bb0vHjcm, but it's not complete by any stretch. For example "Door glitches" should probably be renamed to something like "Transition Corruption" as glitches like dying while falling in a hole or glitches that skips a quadrant flag flip (for example https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1-OgGQWLko4) have been understood to work in the exact same technical way as e.g. YBA and Somaria jukes.
But maybe the TAS community would want a different set of rules than the RTA community. This has been unproblematic for us for quite a few years at least (there were some discussions when YBA was found initially.. :))
For example, YBA gives arbitrary code execution [snip] Showing off glitches is fun, but how do you make a run which doesn't devolve into "Skip to the end"?
Luckily not a problem in RTA. Though I actually found a crash recently (potion + indoors warp tile) that jumps straight to $7E00F8, which contains 4 bytes for last frame controller inputs (enough for a JSL), so whenever I'm not feeling lazy I'll try to figure out a constructive RTA-able ACE there. :)
But obviously with ACE, you don't have to actually play the game, and can jump around screens, fill up your inventory etc. so I assume it's quite common in the TAS community to disallow it if your goal is not to show it off..
Also, while YBA _can_ cause ACE, so can probably mirror (causes a lot of different crashes). I don't see YBA especially connected to that.
How do you define code execution?
I'd say the game executing unintended code that is specially crafted by you to achieve some goal, or something more eloquant.
Maybe you also have to ban Wrong Warps/door way glitches/wall clipping teleports..
Again, we don't ban moving around or the pegasus boots because it enables clipping. We just ban clipping. You don't have to ban everything that can cause an ACE, just ban ACE :).
However, I noticed that current RTA 100% speed runners abuse YBA to do things like: Kill all bosses while in escape glitch mode, and only return to the dungeon to pick up their diamonds. If YBA lets you do crazy things like this, then I had to take a step back and really figure out if it made any sense to start with Zelda at all, and not just YBA and do crazy things.
I quite like the new Plaid World tech personally :). Matter of taste I guess.
Despite what Tompa said on this thread 3 years ago, boss chests do open up even without the right key, and everything unlocks if you are technically in the "Cave" dungeon.
It's a little bit more complicated than that. I made https://pastebin.com/tenzyZWh to show which big keys are required from cave to open up things, and also which big keys will be set if you pick up a big key. In most routes you'll have big key inside caves, since you'll usually get one in Hyrule Castle at the very start.
But you can also use doorway glitches to confuse the game into thinking you're somewhere else, and thus open chests that aren't even on the same screen as you. Do you even need to go to the Big Chest screens at all, at that point?
In our experience, yes. It's not a lot of places where it's faster to get big chest contents from a different chest. The ability to do this fast in a TAS is of course better though.
I think the only instance in RTA 100% is when we grab hookshot from Plaid World (which is one of the coolest thing in the run imo: We release a spin attack at a specific coordinate, which populates a memory address with a value that is interpreted as an interactable chest tile from Plaid World, and so we can grab the hookshot right after killing Lanmolas..)
@neo_omegon you might want to join our discord, if only to lurk. Random videos are posted there from time to time with new discoveries. Mostly not useful, though :)
Here's one from last week https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_2o-xpnNeo. Can also cause some weird teleportation that should be looked more into https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SdkiuvL4oWI.
Edit: Oh, and today I found that if you catch a crystal while pushing a somaria block, you will save lag frames during the crystal cutscenes. This is due to the shield not being visible in the "push" animation, which persists through the cutscene.
35f for Vitreous. Not enough since it takes around 70f to change item, but it could be useful in glitched categories if you need to use somaria anyways.
This can be done by pulling a wall too, which is possible if you for example kill Helmasaur after an YBA - the screen doesn't lock, so if you move high up in the room before crystal drops, it will drop high enough that you can grab the spike with A and catch the crystal. It's free frames!
Some put emphasis on the ruleset, others think anything is better than nothing. I understand both stances. In that situation, I had better not making a to-be-submitted run, though I've not even decided if I will make a to-be-submitted run after I finish this testrun.
100% Glitched TAS has been longed. I had made one long before Glitched 100% RTA was categorized. I just want to improve my old TAS. I've been thinking and thinking about it. Once I have related, the task should be finished. There are more cool stuffs and more TAS specific features than I thought. The route around Kakariko village is a little different from RTA's.
I just have to say, "LET ME FINISH THIS TEST RUN FIRSTLY BEFORE MY MOTIVATION GETS LOST."
A lot of tricks and glitches have been found, but full game TASes, especially highly optimized are rare. Before the rulesets defined, we have a lot of things to do, and we can do them.
For example, we can study what are optimal inputs.
Almost all the clips are done without buffers, without poke sword in TAS. When you clip into the ledge westward, tap leftdown, tap left+A, tap leftdown+A, tap down+A, hold left, hold leftdown, hold down, ..., everything causes different results. Eastward is the same. The points you warp north, you warp south and most deepest points are located diagonally and they are especially important points.
When you are in EG, each screen transition takes different frames and initial position is different. So if there are several ways to go to your destination, you have to find the optimal way.
I thought I checked them all as far as I used, but there might be overlooks.
As for the rulesets, personaly, glitches should not be banned easily. Bug limited TASes make a question. Why TAS? Why not RTA? One of the significance of TASes is showing off glitches. However, this is only a personal opinion. It does not mean I will stop someone from making a bug limited TAS at all. I would rather enjoy it.
As for EG route, EG is not can-do-everything. If you get a pendant or a crystal, you have to enter each dungeon from the right entrance. So doing everything in 'cave' dungeon may be slower. And if your destination is distant, it took a while to get there by EG. Maybe visiting normally is faster.
About doorway glitches, I think there are several patterns. With scroll, without scroll, escaping through the gap, and going south and appearing north. But there are problems. If you perform doorway glitches, you cannot slash enemies and scroll does not work properly. And finally in many cases, you'll be stuck in wall. So my understanding is this glitch is useful only in limited situations.
Quadrant glitch is used by RTA player with Somaria Glitch in Turtle Rock in order to access Agahnim 2. I tried doorway glitch and Somaria Glitch there, but I couldn't access Agahnim 2 with capable of attacking.
As for region differences, clipping, YBA and Somaria glitch are available in non-Japanese version. Spindash and itemdash are Japanese version exclusive tricks. Spindash just makes you clip and fall off a ledge easily, especially in humanplay. I don't think Japanese version is particularly glitchy, personally. Anyway, any versions of this game are glitchy.
Edit: Oh, and today I found that if you catch a crystal while pushing a somaria block, you will save lag frames during the crystal cutscenes. This is due to the shield not being visible in the "push" animation, which persists through the cutscene.
Nice. I'll use this after defeating Mothura in SkullWoods.
Btw, Reset-Button seems necessary. I couldn't access Hookshot nor Agahnim 1 in the Plaid World without Reset. I tried inserting 'Reset' at the first frame in the movie. It does not cause desync, still I could not access them.
About doorway glitches, I think there are several patterns. With scroll, without scroll, escaping through the gap, and going south and appearing north.
Yeah. But the technical effect of all of them is that 7E00A0 (current loaded room) and 7E00A9/7E00AA (current quadrant Link is in) does not sync up with Link's coordinates (7E0020 and 7E0022). Basically Link's coordinates points to another screen or room than what the game thinks. This is what makes transitions act out, and different transitions can have different effects depending on the exactly how you're unsynced.
But there are problems. If you perform doorway glitches, you cannot slash enemies and scroll does not work properly.
Yeah. Link is able to collide with normal walls and doors because the game uses his relative coordinates (between 0x0 and 0x200) for that, but for sprites it's using the absolute coordinate (between 0x0 and 0x2000) so you need to be in sync. There are ways to fix it (fall in hole before u transition), and a few YBAs even automatically fixes the sync, like PoD Mimics, Vitty swordspin YBA, Arrghus swordspin YBA etc.
Quadrant glitch is used by RTA player with Somaria Glitch in Turtle Rock in order to access Agahnim 2. I tried doorway glitch and Somaria Glitch there, but I couldn't access Agahnim 2 with capable of attacking.
Study the exact movement, it's important. Start by holding down until you hit the fence, then transition up, then you need to go a little bit up before you can take the transition down again. Sometimes Link will travel further into the next screen if you keep holding down, and sometimes not (this is not 100% understood). But the RTA method is 100% consistent, probably in a TAS you can find a faster way that lets you hold down.
Btw, Reset-Button seems necessary. I couldn't access Hookshot nor Agahnim 1 in the Plaid World without Reset. I tried inserting 'Reset' at the first frame in the movie. It does not cause desync, still I could not access them.
Yeah, this is a bit complicated and I would have to see the full TAS up to that point to tell you exactly how you can fix it. (Your latest SMV desynces for me in Uncle's room btw. - I'm using Snes9x 1.51 v7 rr.)
But basically, the 4th row on the EG map (the row with Lanmola and Hookshot in it) in Plaid World will use a bunch of different memory addresses for its collision map. So for example releasing a spin will change some of the tiles, using or grabbing items like bombos or ether will as well. I'm assuming that's what happened. A list of at least some of the things affecting this row can be found under the section "$3x" at https://pastebin.com/8MAabJQQ.
You can fix it by resetting right before going into Plaid World, since this resets the RAM. But then you still will have to manipulate in a chest. I don't think it's needed to reset for a TAS (it's slower than just Save & Quit so you would want to try to avoid it), and instead try to pick up Bombos (if this is the problem) from a different X/Y coordinate and see if it's better.
You should definitely use this LUA script - https://milde.no/public/alttp/yba.lua - press X on the keyboard to see the collision map in Plaid World (Z toggles the extended HUD which is invaluable when messing with Door Glitches). It will show you exactly what you're colliding with, so maybe you can find a route around the obstacles. If not, try to grab Bombos from another coordinate and see again. If this makes you completely stuck I can see if I can find a way that would be good for a TAS.
In RTA we reset the console after killing Mothula (to clear up the path to Agahnim 1) and we release a sword spin aligned with this wall - https://puu.sh/yvlBb/9c629da350.png - which manipulates in a chest that's easy to grab. You can't spin again until after you grab the chest though, or it will be removed. You can also do the spin here - https://puu.sh/yvmaC/7654abd7c4.png - which is a backup for RTA. But best for TAS would be to find a good pixel to grab Bombos/Ether from.
Oh and since it's TAS. If you find a good opportunity to get your shield stolen from a Pikit it could save on lag frames in multiple places (crystal cutscene especially, but also things like pushing lever in Swamp, and some transitions.) Might be worth it.
I'm using "snes9x-1.51-rerecording-v7-win32."
http://tasvideos.org/EmulatorResources/Snes9x.html
At some point, filetype of the savestate was modified in both snes9x v1.43 and v1.51. So if you use savestate and loadstate, it could cause desync. This is true of other games. If you playback old submission files, remember this.
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/296986325/ALttP_100p_2017-Plaid_with_Reset.smvhttp://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/181665954/ALttP_100p_2017-Plaid_with_No_Reset.smv
I redid to make Pikit steal the shield. And now just before Vitreous. I've not made an optimal inputs in the Plaid World.
Taking a Heart Piece at the top of the mountain just before Red Mail are postponed. No buffering clip seems faster after I get a crystal in Turtle Rock.
For some checkings, here is an invincible code: 7E031F1E
Especially useful for keyboard players. I'm a keyboard player.
Bombos have already been gotten.
About exploring Plaid World, I'm going to take a little different way from RTA's. After I defeat Vitreous, I'll go down, right, right, right, right. Avoiding dark rooms is faster. At Trinexx battle, I've not decided if I use a spin attack or not. After defeating Trinexx, I could grab a Heart Container and Ether in the up-right room on the same screen in a short test. Then I'll go right, right, right, up, up. I'll take a fairy on the way. It saves refilling time.
Different emulators have different RAMs. You may not have to manipulate it perfectly, especially in not-to-be-submitted run.
I'm to be out for a few days from tomorrow. I have to attend a funeral of my relative at a distant place.
A little revised luascript. -> https://pastebin.com/tsvLHw42
So, sub 1-hour was impossible.
-> [OLD] http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1404131521/ALttP_100p_2017.smvedit2: Ganon Fight Improved. Without Fire Rod nor Lamp. saved 263 frames.
-> http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/725195672/ALttP_100p_2017_GanonImproved.smv
Currently, I ban encoding this. I think TASes should be evaluated by their imput files. And this is re-recorded on a deprecated emulator.
Known improvements (aside from minor pixel perfect):
- When I went into Grampa's cave, camera management should have been done by pixelporting in front of the cave like I did in GTower.
- From after I got the Moon Pearl to escape the tower, 16 frames improvable. I should have gone into the west hole at 3F, then dash south at 2F. Don't forget to push the blue pedestal at 2F. (If you tap a direction key toward the wall in wall or you do pixelporting, Link is pushed to be the position which value is 0 in mod 8. That is why I recommend hexed value when you watch Link's position.)
- When I clipped in the mountain to go to Thieves, I had taken slower way. 34 frames improvable. When I went to get the gold sword and silver arrow, I fixed this.
- As I mentioned before, a bomb should have been gotten from under the pod in Thieves instead of 'after' I got the redboomerang. A bomb 'before' redboomerang is no problem.
- When I went to get the book of Mudora, the lags before the light world was large but the lags before the dark world was low. If I used the Mirror a little east, the lags before the light world was low but the lags before the dark world was large. One frame improvable.
- In the last cave in desert, where a bomb is used, 5 frames improvable. Press (<^>A) at 100152thnd frame then hold A. Dashing without pixelporting is faster.
edit:
-I dashed with Fire Rod before visiting the potion shop for preparing green potion YBA. However, using the Cane of Somaria just after I get a crystal in SkullWoods is faster. It consumes fewer MP.
Other comments in newly done part:
The former of Link's position is (0x0d50,0x2354), the latter is (0x0c50,0x073a). For tasing, displaying values are preferred.
About the backup strategy to get the Hookshot, the former can be done without losing a frame. So this time, I used this.
Ether can be gotten after any boss in Plaid World. If you manipulate Link's position and the camera's position, there is no frame difference. However, after Lanmola should be avoided. If you dash north, then dash back south, you can get the Heart Container 9 or 10 frames faster, but Ether drops at bad position.
Lanmola battle seems to affect Hookshot's position. So the battle should be done after you get the Hookshot.
Agahnim 1 charges his ball over his head, so attacking from north is a little faster.
If you do wobbling properly, you can go through Octrock's ball.
Using the Hookshot after pushing the lever in Swamp is one frame faster.
I'm not familiar with pokesword mechanism so Arrghus battle is just by trial and error. Sometimes Link breaks it, sometimes Link changes his direction. Also, in Mothula battle, pokesword has different damage.
After Swamp, I didn't use Reset. There are three reasons. First, aiming for faster time. Second, to see what the game would like. Third, to feel how much difficult to make a movie in that state.
After using the Mirror after Ice, I could do pixelporting. But I couldn't find a good swim clip to get the Heart Piece on the small island.
Somaria glitch twice at Mirror Shield entrance in TRock enables you to get infinite small key, but this time it's useless.
Camere works differently in Agahnim 2 battle. In my TAS in 2015, Link was northern part in the cutscene skip because it's faster. But this time, camere also moves north. The direction of dashing for the cutscene skip is north or east or south. It depends on the position of Agahnim 2. And if you defeat Agahnim 2 where he is too right, it's slower.
I had thought Link's position related with lags between the light and the dark world. However, things seem not so simple. Sometimes lags are different even if you use the Mirror at the same postion. Enemies' positions may have something to do with.
Now I hold making a to-be-submitted TAS. One thing is the rulesets are not defined. Other is sub 1-hour seems impossible, so I'm not motivated. Other is my real life is a little complicated.
And thanks everyone on this thread and many players!
Currently, I ban encoding this. I think TASes should be evaluated by their imput files. And this is re-recorded on a deprecated emulator.
That's a little harsh, considering that it would require potential people who are interested to download the emulator, illegally download the game and then playing it back on the emulator. Not everyone is interested in the inputs contained in the input file. Some people, myself included, are interested in the result of your work, not the work itself. But without an encode, it's a hassle to see the product of the work.
Now I hold making a to-be-submitted TAS. One thing is the rulesets are not defined. Other is sub 1-hour seems impossible, so I'm not motivated. Other is my real life is a little complicated.
Well, I mean, you can still release your work as-is. There is no requirement to submit it. I'm sure many would appreciate your work even if it's not optimal.
Thanks. It's appreciative if my work is being looked forward to.
But, for those who are not interested in TASVideos community, encoding a movie is equivalent for publishing a movie. And it's dissapointing for those who make a movie on an appropriate emulator to submit if a movie made on a deprecated emulator is well-known. So maybe there are people who don't agree with encoding. Strictly speaking, there might be people who disagree with using a deprecated emulator. I should be criticized sharply.
If those who want an encoded stuff are the mainstream, I don't mind. Currently, I myself won't encode it, though.
Skimmed through the smv (can't invest more time into it right now).
For tasing, displaying values are preferred.
My bad.
So the battle should be done after you get the Hookshot.
This is faster anyways, since the AI starts when you enter the room.
I had thought Link's position related with lags between the light and the dark world.
You mean quick warp? This is not lag, it's just a bug where game finishes warp animation faster sometimes. All that matters is Camera X position, not Link's X position, which will shift slightly relative from the Camera X, depending on certain actions like dashing or holding dpad inputs during overworld transitions.
Some notes:
Check out https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=t4vazptC7Gw (found on yuzu's twitter @yuzuhara_ideas - inactive but has a couple things there still). If it's not possible to use any of that, then at least you can push the water lever right after grabbing hookshot. Skips one of the key pots when you visit Swamp.
Also, pick up crystals such that their shadow is right below Link's eyes. Pendants you want to pick up low, crystals you will lose up to 30f if you do this (Link will catch the crystal faster, but the animation afterwards will be slower). Or rather, it depends on how the screen is scrolled.
You can definitely skip the hard reset after ice rod. But it's hard for me to tell you exactly which inputs to do, because it depends on which frame you pick up Bombos on, and which coordinate Link has when you pick it up. It shouldn't be too hard with trying/failing different coordinates until you find one that works well (can use yba.lua to see the collision tiles).
Looks like you are only missing 34s for sub 1 hour? You will also lose some seconds in real time due to snes9x running on ~59.94 fps instead of ~60.1, not sure if that matters in the TAS community, or if you only care about frames? But I will look more into it in detail later when I have time. I've also shared it with the people in Discord, maybe someone on there have any suggestions for routing. 30s isn't _that_ much! :)
Oh my gosh! If you guys watch Yuzuhara's movie, no one won't be satisfied with my work. He seems to know how to fix camera and Link's coordinate after somaria glitch and doorway glitch. He should know better routes in other dungeons. In that sense, I have no choice but to give up making a to-be-submitted run. It's beyond me. Let's just hope he finish making his run and submit it here.
Well, I just made a tas of this game just because I myself wanted to see it.
Still, any feedback, any criticism about my run is welcome for the future tas of this game by someone. If encoded stuffs are necessary, I no longer mind.
Oh my gosh! If you guys watch Yuzuhara's movie, no one won't be satisfied with my work.
Yuzuhara is in a class above anyone honestly. The initial founder of YBA, and he understood transition corruptions better than anyone, as seen from the youtube video I linked (which goes above my head too).
I'd wish it didn't make you not want to work on the game, because I and others have been entertained by your work already. More people will surely be entertained if you submit it. Submitting a sub 1 hour 100% run to tasvideos.org would be a great achievement, and it could inspire others to look for improvements, which is only a good thing. (I am one of them. Watching your TAS has made me want to TAS too.)
Also that youtube clip is the most insane thing I've seen. I don't think he has stuff like that in every dungeon.
But anyone should only do what they want to do, so if you don't want to submit a run I completely respect that.
Edit: Forgot to mention, afaik he is not active. He might never post anything alttp related ever again.
To be fair, almost any run of LTTP should get accepted considering the game is fun to watch, and the state of the current "best" submission is really non-optimized.
