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Posted: 3/1/2015 5:39 PM
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biggyboy
Player (51)
Joined: 2/7/2012
Posts: 70
Could you get a big ammo drop from the second Shield Attacker RX in the same room instead of grabbing the ammo in the fourth screen? Love your Plug Man stage btw :)
Posted: 3/1/2015 7:25 PM
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biggyboy
Player (51)
Joined: 2/7/2012
Posts: 70
I think this is a nice strategy for met+sniper joe room: http://www.twitch.tv/dabigbooi2/b/631405883 It's very tight to vanquish the Met before he fires his shot while still having Sniper Joe facing left. Second strategy is for real time use.
Posted: 3/1/2015 7:30 PM
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AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
Okay, so I studied a bit the Wily stages and here are my conclusions: Wily 1) Basically this whole stage is quite easy to tas when it comes to selecting weaponry. Rush Coil and Rush Jet. Only thing I am wondering is if it's faster switching to Concrete Shot for the miniboss. One big thing I'd like to point is the boss fight. There has got to be a way to make it several seconds faster. I am pretty damn sure that even if we switch to a stronger weapon, refilling weapon X should take much less time compared with having a much faster boss fight. Wily 2) Basically the same approach. Rush Coil, Concrete Shot and L Trident. Wily 3) Seems to be a very easy stage. Definitely using Rush Coil. I am pretty sure we do not need to use Tornado weapon like exoSDA did in the end of the stage. Wily 4) Before we reach Wily 4, we should obviously try being a pascifist as much as possible to avoid using the M tank and/or big refills.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Posted: 3/1/2015 11:03 PM
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diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
biggyboy wrote:
I think this is a nice strategy for met+sniper joe room: http://www.twitch.tv/dabigbooi2/b/631405883 It's very tight to vanquish the Met before he fires his shot while still having Sniper Joe facing left. Second strategy is for real time use.
Nice biggy! We can incorporate those when we redo the level. Still have some other things to touch up on.
AngerFist wrote:
I am pretty damn sure that even if we switch to a stronger weapon, refilling weapon X should take much less time compared with having a much faster boss fight.
The Magma Bazooka might be a good candidate since it can hit three of the spike balls at once. :UPDATE: Here's the updated file with 146 frames of improvement to Tornado Man's stage. http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21150791537985066
Posted: 3/2/2015 9:53 PM
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biggyboy
Player (51)
Joined: 2/7/2012
Posts: 70
Very nice time save!
Posted: 3/2/2015 10:45 PM
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negative_seven
She/Her
Active player (419)
Joined: 11/25/2012
Posts: 103
Location: Europe
Atari TAS of 2022
I know it's tough to do, but would an encode of the wips be a possibility? ;)
Posted: 3/2/2015 11:05 PM
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AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
TehSeven wrote:
I know it's tough to do, but would an encode of the wips be a possibility? ;)
We are at Wily 1, hang on for a few more stages and then we will submit. Speaking of which I have begun tasing Wily 1 and its horrid ladder optimizations :(
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Posted: 3/3/2015 12:43 AM
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diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
Haha yea those are never fun. I usually use the frame at which all the sprites despawn as a benchmark and try it over and over again. It takes 20 frames to reach maximum height, but it's faster to grab the ladder before this because your upwards acceleration during the last few frames is less than climbing speed. Also, unless the platform is really high, it's usually faster to use rush jet to get an extra jump up.
Posted: 3/3/2015 10:20 AM
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biggyboy
Player (51)
Joined: 2/7/2012
Posts: 70
Random interesting thing in Hornet Man's stage: I managed to completely clip through the unwrapping platform. This made it possible for me to unwrap the platform but still end up on the right side of it which normally is impossible. Potential? Only seems to work well with non-projectile like weapons unfortunately.
Posted: 3/3/2015 10:23 AM
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diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
Yea, I clip the edge of one of those in the run because it gives a slight zip-like boost. I tried to maneuver two zips out of them but there's not a safe platform below twice. It is interesting that you made it completely inside, but it just acts like a concrete block at the point. As so soon as you jump you'll be evicted.
Posted: 3/3/2015 10:27 AM
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biggyboy
Player (51)
Joined: 2/7/2012
Posts: 70
As you see on the video I manage to not only zip off it but also ride the platform very quickly as it unwraps.
Posted: 3/3/2015 2:07 PM
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diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
biggyboy wrote:
As you see on the video I manage to not only zip off it but also ride the platform very quickly as it unwraps.
How exactly did you manage to get inside? So I went ahead and tried a Magma Bazooka strat against Wily 1. Unfortunately we're left with only 2 pixels of energy left which isn't enough to get another full blast, but the plug balls seem to finish the job anyways. Still some tightening up to do, but this strategy automatically loses 150 frames for switching weapons and at least another 100 to refill the weapons. Still, it clears the boss in 17.73 seconds. The fastest in-game time trial by MegaDestructor9 is only 15.5 seconds (which took over 45 seconds real time) so this strategy is pretty damn fast. Still have to try with the rush jet/buster only, but unless it's faster than 22 seconds or so the bazooka should be right choice. Link to video
Posted: 3/3/2015 2:53 PM
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ALAKTORN
He/Him
Former player
Joined: 10/19/2009
Posts: 2527
Location: Italy
DS TAS of 2012
Those first Plasma Ball attacks looked really slow… can’t make them take a shorter path?
Posted: 3/3/2015 2:58 PM
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diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
ALAKTORN wrote:
Those first Plasma Ball attacks looked really slow… can’t make them take a shorter path?
Nope, they're intentionally slow. The spike balls have a reset period after they hit the wall or the boss where nothing moves them for about a second after returning to their starting spot. This is also why I have to wait for an extra second before firing the charged magma bazooka after damaging the boss. I time the plug balls so they hit the spike ball on the first frame it becomes vulnerable. You'll notice my last two plug balls do in fact take the shorter path.
Posted: 3/3/2015 7:42 PM
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AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
Beautiful strategy diggi! Not sure if this will help but before switching to Magma Bazooka (one of the coolest name of a weapon!), fire one of the heads with Rush Coil/Jet and then switch to Magma Bazooka. That should maybe help solve the matter.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Posted: 3/3/2015 7:48 PM
Quote
diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
I thought about that, but then we wouldn't start the fight with a full charge which is one of the benefits of starting with the bazooka. It's worth a try though. Might eliminate the switch to plug.
Posted: 3/4/2015 11:51 PM
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AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
My fingers are aching so much... Spent a lot of time trying my best optimizing these damn ladders: http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21205806660109173 72607 is the frame when the screen starts scrolling after defeating the Dragon. I have not tested using Concrete on him. The first gate starts moving upwards at frame 75023. Your move diggi!
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Posted: 3/5/2015 3:21 AM
Quote
diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
Wow, it only takes you 40 frames to kill the dragon with the coil out. There's no way switching to concrete will improve on that, especially when we need full concrete for wily 4. Why did you turn around to kill this enemy, though? There's shouldn't be any RNG based moments in this stage.
Posted: 3/5/2015 7:29 AM
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AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
I am very glad you noticed I turned left for one frame to kill that enemy. The reason is because of RNG. You see in like exoSDA's speedrun, that particular enemy flew very high up. In our case, it goes up in midair. I am one frame or two from avoiding its pellet before facing the next set of enemies. By the time you are about to jump, its pellet has reached you while you are jumping. So all in all, sacrifing one frame was the best I could do unless you find a way to gain that frame. Oh man diggi I spent many many hours trying to find the best pattern for the dragon. When you jump and your distance towards it really matter. What was also very frustrating is that the fight had a few blank frames. Again, maybe you could squeeze one frame or two but know that I tested a lot of things. Yeah I figured there shouldnt be too much testing if Concrete would be faster because of how many frames it takes to activate it and also saving Concrete shots is obviously very important aswell.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Posted: 3/5/2015 5:35 PM
Quote
Checkers
Joined: 2/24/2014
Posts: 3
For the first screen of Wily 1, if you only kill the rock of the first Hoohoo and leave him alive, you should get an optimal pattern from the first pit enemy to save that frame. This can be seen in Privateye's 32:01 here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JLsA5OaNNw&t=1208
Posted: 3/5/2015 5:51 PM
Quote
AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
Checkers wrote:
For the first screen of Wily 1, if you only kill the rock of the first Hoohoo and leave him alive, you should get an optimal pattern from the first pit enemy to save that frame. This can be seen in Privateye's 32:01 here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1JLsA5OaNNw&t=1208
Thanks for the tip! If that truly works then I hope Diggi can fix it via hex-editing.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Posted: 3/6/2015 3:18 PM
(Edited: 3/6/2015 6:37 PM)
Quote
diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
Yep, it did work and I was able to hex edit in the change. Then I saved about 18 frames at the first lava beam room. So in all, about 20 frames saved. However, I also fixed the energy management which ended up costing about 45 frames in this level to save 6 frames overall. At this point, I'm going to assume we're going to need the M-Tank since we'll need to refill the magma bazooka and concrete shot before wily 4. Since this is the case, anytime we can "top up" the weapon we're using, we save 3 frames because the top pixel only takes 1 frame to fill instead of the full four. Keep this in mind whenever you're using weapons. Refill them as much as possible so the time lost from the M-Tank is reduced. I also saved a few more frames on the boss. The limiting factor in this fight is the topmost enemy. I'm able to kill the bottom three enemies four times each before the top one hits his spike all the way to the left wall. Then I use the plug balls to hit the top spike ball on the first frame it becomes vulnerable. After that I kill the last red enemy at the same time the top enemy is killed. So I'm pretty sure that's going to be limit for this strategy. I did try a rush coil start, and not having the initial blast slows the fight down quite a bit. http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21242344372063836
Posted: 3/6/2015 5:59 PM
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AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
We are prime example that working together helps one spot things you sometimes won't notice :) Thanks for fixing my things. I managed to save 16 frames from your boss battle. http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/21244784306673238 Mind tackling Wily 2? I've had enough of ladders for today :D
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Posted: 3/6/2015 6:37 PM
(Edited: 3/7/2015 2:49 AM)
Quote
diggidoyo
Experienced player (583)
Joined: 1/27/2011
Posts: 427
Location: Oregon
First edition TAS of 2015
Ah, nice find! But it turns out the whole Magma strategy has to get scratched. Using the buster eliminates most of the down time and makes the fight finish in only 16.5 seconds! That's 94 frames faster. Additionally, since it doesn't use any weapon energy, it ends up being over 200 frames faster. I think there's still some tightening up to do with the buster fight, but here's how the two strategies compare: Link to video I also added your improvement to the end of the buster only fight.
Posted: 3/6/2015 7:07 PM
Quote
AngerFist
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
First edition TAS of 2015 Innovative TAS of 2007
Just downloaded and saw your latest file. It looked polished. Unless you find a better idea, I'd say that's a keeper.
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
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