Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11495
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
Some people mentioned that when they were playing CZ on console in their childhood, there was a point in the lifebar where your HP stops decreasing no matter what. This may be tested for every HP value.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Here's the highlight: http://www.twitch.tv/mecha_richter/c/2180121
I started the highlight when the run starts so you can see what all I'm doing before the room with Roadkill. Nothing seems different though, which is what baffles me...
Two random ideas
1) Roadkill spawns at a non-fixed point when you reach his panel, right? Does the game pick a random place and spawn him when you reach the panel, or has he been simulated starting from an earlier point in the level?
1a) In the case of being simulated, is there a certain point in his walking where, if you mess with collision detection earlier (like if you can shake the whole level, or if it's going through a panel at a certain frame, or something) he clips through the cage/through the pedestal?
1b) In the case of being spawned on the frame you enter the panel, is there a certain point he can be spawned at that makes him clip immediately?
2) Is it some kind of sprite overload/sprite messup glitch? Like, if you transition to Roadkill's panel on a certain frame relative to when the paper debris falling down the screen despawns does it mess up their two sprite properties and make something weird happen?
Joined: 10/6/2011
Posts: 1697
Location: RU · ID · AM
I really love the moments in the current published TAS, when the Sketch is using super power to save time, it looks like he’s saying “no time to fucking talk, come on!”
I mean the arena and the second boss fight :-D
S3&A [Amy amy%] improvement (with Evil_3D & kaan55) — currently in SPZ2
my TAS channel · If I ever come into your dream, I’ll be riding an eggship :)
Hi everyone!
First time checking in to the site in a really long time...
I'm pretty sure it is possible to optimize the current run by at least another 30ish seconds if we can figure out the RNG and what triggers the arrow flags and dialogue flags so we can get rid of all the waiting. I get the feeling that this game is so glitchy that it is possible to find a way to glitch through the page boundaries without arrows, but that's just a guess...
There are too many possibilities, but I don't have the time to study how the game works in depth... but if anyone is interested to work on this, I'm happy to help!
On the roadkill spawn glitch, my guess is that lag from the paper plane caused sufficient delays to the sprite spawning, and by then the screen had started the pan down, resulting in the sprite spawning outside the cage.
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11495
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
xoinx wrote:
I'm pretty sure it is possible to optimize the current run by at least another 30ish seconds if we can figure out the RNG and what triggers the arrow flags and dialogue flags so we can get rid of all the waiting. I get the feeling that this game is so glitchy that it is possible to find a way to glitch through the page boundaries without arrows, but that's just a guess...
There are too many possibilities, but I don't have the time to study how the game works in depth... but if anyone is interested to work on this, I'm happy to help!
I have the time! I'd need all RAM addresses you have, and 2 movies demonstrating 2 possible RNG outcomes for some event. Or an explanation how to get them different.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
I'm pretty sure it is possible to optimize the current run by at least another 30ish seconds if we can figure out the RNG and what triggers the arrow flags and dialogue flags so we can get rid of all the waiting. I get the feeling that this game is so glitchy that it is possible to find a way to glitch through the page boundaries without arrows, but that's just a guess...
There are too many possibilities, but I don't have the time to study how the game works in depth... but if anyone is interested to work on this, I'm happy to help!
I have the time! I'd need all RAM addresses you have, and 2 movies demonstrating 2 possible RNG outcomes for some event. Or an explanation how to get them different.
Sorry mate, just saw your reply. Back when we were working on this TAS we didn't use any RAM watching--all outcomes were actually obtained blindly. That said, for manipulation of ? items, most button inputs seemed to influence the outcome (hence the random movements before picking up ?)
Not too sure what triggers events e.g. enemy spawn/dialogue/arrows etc., so will need to do more digging on that.
Its been so long, but might be fun to relook at the game to map out some important RAM addresses... Let me see what I can do this weekend.
I found this awhile ago but never got around to uploading a video of it, slightly faster way of doing the first panel compared to the tas.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MLDJSUtZMiE
I found this awhile ago but never got around to uploading a video of it, slightly faster way of doing the first panel compared to the tas.
Nice trick, i tested and it is approximately 101 frames faster.
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1903342035/Comix%20Zone%20%28first%20panel%20trick%29.gmv
Comix Zone is one of glitchiest sega game ever created, almost each screen hide own glitch or even two. This game definitely deserve to obtain the 5th TAS in future.
I not figured how to replicate the glitch with rat outside of cage, so no sense to continue further without it. But i wish good luck to the superhero who will dare to crack this nut!
I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.
Current projects: NES: Tetris "fastest 999999" (improvement, with r57shell)
Genesis: Adventures of Batman & Robin (with Truncated); Pocahontas; Comix Zone (improvement); Mickey Mania (improvement); RoboCop versus The Terminator (improvement); Gargoyles (with feos)
Joined: 4/17/2010
Posts: 11495
Location: Lake Chargoggagoggmanchauggagoggchaubunagungamaugg
Archanfel wrote:
I not figured how to replicate the glitch
Bro, don't even start! Let me do one thing then request my debugging of another XD Otherwise I'll never resume.
Warning: When making decisions, I try to collect as much data as possible before actually deciding. I try to abstract away and see the principles behind real world events and people's opinions. I try to generalize them and turn into something clear and reusable. I hate depending on unpredictable and having to make lottery guesses. Any problem can be solved by systems thinking and acting.
Yeah you right, if one runs after two hares he will catch neither.
I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.
Current projects: NES: Tetris "fastest 999999" (improvement, with r57shell)
Genesis: Adventures of Batman & Robin (with Truncated); Pocahontas; Comix Zone (improvement); Mickey Mania (improvement); RoboCop versus The Terminator (improvement); Gargoyles (with feos)
Joined: 10/18/2017
Posts: 171
Location: San Francisco
Maybe.
Link to videoLink to video
I had made a full run with Game Genie!
Here is what a game over looks like: Writing an X first on face value:
I don't know how to make paper airplanes in the game. How to do that?
Planned runs:
Marble Madness (Arcade, Genesis J, GG/SMS)
Proposed:
Ecco the Dolphin (Genesis, GG/SMS, CD: regular, camera freeze)
Ecco: The Tides of Time (Genesis, GG/SMS, CD; normal mode)
Mario Kart DS (all cups, all missions)
In progress: Grand Poo World 3 (all exits hard mode)
I don't know how to make paper airplanes in the game. How to do that?
Just hold "A" button.
Sad to see degradation instead of renaissance :(
I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.
Current projects: NES: Tetris "fastest 999999" (improvement, with r57shell)
Genesis: Adventures of Batman & Robin (with Truncated); Pocahontas; Comix Zone (improvement); Mickey Mania (improvement); RoboCop versus The Terminator (improvement); Gargoyles (with feos)
Speaking of the Renaissance, i glad to announce that i am started working on improvement.
Patashu wrote:
My hype levels will be unreal if someone figures out how to spawn Roadkill outside of the cage
Problem with reproducing Roadkill Spawn Glitch was much harder to solve than possible to imagine. There is about 1/65535 chance that Roadkill spawn outside the cage, and where is no clear way how exactly to do it.
Only crazy synthesis of perseverance, science, magic, combinatorics and of course luck helped to achieve this. Now this the most difficult part is successfully done and i finally can concentrate on recordering main part of run.
Sketch Turner is entering Comix Zone again. The Hero is stronger and faster than ever before!Link to video
Beside RSG there are many other interesting improvements i want to impliment into new TAS. According to my rough calculations i can save about 2000 frames over published movie.
Approximately once per two/three weeks i will post WIPs here. If everything will goes well, somewhere near the end of the year this humble project will be completed.
I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.
Current projects: NES: Tetris "fastest 999999" (improvement, with r57shell)
Genesis: Adventures of Batman & Robin (with Truncated); Pocahontas; Comix Zone (improvement); Mickey Mania (improvement); RoboCop versus The Terminator (improvement); Gargoyles (with feos)
In my dreams, I clearly saw the numbers 9:01 and you confirm them)
2000 frames is conservative estimation, it's a things that i tested and absolutely sure that it will work.
1-1 : 200 : 251
1-2 : 350 : 479
2-1 : 700 : ???
2-2 : 450 : ???
3-1 : 100 : ???
3-2 : 200 : ???
Full : 2000 : 2180+
Beside this there is also a several small ideas which hard for test. May be also some minor optimisations can be found in process. So there is a chance that final result will be even below 9:00 mins.
P.S. First page 1-1 is short enough, so next week it will have to be already done (and shown here).
I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.
Current projects: NES: Tetris "fastest 999999" (improvement, with r57shell)
Genesis: Adventures of Batman & Robin (with Truncated); Pocahontas; Comix Zone (improvement); Mickey Mania (improvement); RoboCop versus The Terminator (improvement); Gargoyles (with feos)
Ok, let's begin our journey into Comix Zone.
The first page is done!
Link to video(Link to movie)
Currently 00:04.18 seconds ahead of the published TAS.
I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.
Current projects: NES: Tetris "fastest 999999" (improvement, with r57shell)
Genesis: Adventures of Batman & Robin (with Truncated); Pocahontas; Comix Zone (improvement); Mickey Mania (improvement); RoboCop versus The Terminator (improvement); Gargoyles (with feos)
In published run there is often used bug for fast movement. For example first two screens of 1-2.
Can you reproduce it? Isn't it useful for any room in first page?
In published run there is often used bug for fast movement. For example first two screens of 1-2.
Can you reproduce it? Isn't it useful for any room in first page?
Of course i can, but actually it is very rarely useful. For example on one first screen of first page there is no difference even if use it. On the second screen it also useless, since we need wait to right time to use paper-plane trick. On last screen of here it is ineffective again (different frames when to kill first Flying Creature is significant, it give different outcomes when arrow will appear and sooner is not always faster).
Besides, fast walking method which i use has no screaming sideeffects and it is more pleasant to watch so i desided to ignore scream-walking type of running like Aglar did with Mickey, i will use this move only to destroy doors. In any case i plan to include some other small speed/entertainment tradeoffs in movie.
Patashu wrote:
Hell yeah! Great so far!
Thanks for positive response. Actually 1-1 was the most peaceful page. Degree of craziness will rise.
I show you how deep the rabbit hole goes.
Current projects: NES: Tetris "fastest 999999" (improvement, with r57shell)
Genesis: Adventures of Batman & Robin (with Truncated); Pocahontas; Comix Zone (improvement); Mickey Mania (improvement); RoboCop versus The Terminator (improvement); Gargoyles (with feos)
I don't know how to make paper airplanes in the game. How to do that?
