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Posted: 7/3/2013 8:20 PM
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
Joined: 5/21/2013
Posts: 414
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Level 27! Link to video Getting those two gems through the green teleporter turns out to be faster. It takes roughly the same amount of time but requires much less fuel to charge. I get the enclosed gem from the right instead of left because of the batbot, which doesn't take much extra time. Also, surprise ending!
Posted: 7/3/2013 8:30 PM
Post subject: Contraption
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Nach
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Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
Note, the blue route requires Svimmer's trick. As does this one:
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 7/4/2013 2:37 AM
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
Joined: 5/21/2013
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Let's do another level today, 28 is quick and fun: Link to video
  • The key here is to get onto the bridges with the teal switch flipped. To get the earliest cycle I have to get to the teal switch ASAP and trap the marble (which also happens to get it turned around, which I was unaware of). It would be faster to press the switch once and go back to get the 2nd gem, but the red switch gets flipped before you can get to the bridge, blocking you off.
  • Going down the "crate stairs" is awkward because you can't just fall down to the next one. This is the best solution I could come up with. There is a better way to do it after all, I'll fix it (probably won't post a new video)
  • I get the stunner because if I went down straight away, the marble would block me off.
Posted: 7/4/2013 2:28 PM
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Svimmer
Joined: 9/27/2011
Posts: 207
Location: Finland
slamo wrote:
Also, surprise ending!
Congrats on the second death abuse!
Nach wrote:
Note, the blue route requires Svimmer's trick.
The great drawback with that trick (let's call it phase-climbing) is having to make up for the time the block took to phase out and in again. With purples and lreds it wouldn't be so bad... So let's keep a lookout for that. Slamo, I have to say I'm severely disappointed with you this time! :) You can make the first cycle, the jump to get the first two gems is really hard to perform (on the first time, after that it magically becomes automatic, and I'm not even being ironic!) so the timing must be real tight or something else is going on. Anyway then you just press the cyan button once and proceed as before.
Posted: 7/4/2013 2:31 PM
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Nach
Emulator Coder
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Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
Svimmer wrote:
The great drawback with that trick (let's call it phase-climbing) is having to make up for the time the block took to phase out and in again. With purples and lreds it wouldn't be so bad... So let's keep a lookout for that.
That's an extremely limited view. In this exact case, it's dark red, and you start via breaking the block, and RETURN with your trick. Since it's RETURN, the time is not the issue here, and the trick is valid.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 7/4/2013 2:41 PM
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Svimmer
Joined: 9/27/2011
Posts: 207
Location: Finland
Nach wrote:
That's an extremely limited view. In this exact case, it's dark red, and you start via breaking the block, and RETURN with your trick. Since it's RETURN, the time is not the issue here, and the trick is valid.
Ah yes you're right. In the blue route of the first suggestion you use the time usefully by collecting the three gems (and the phaser possibly). And yes there could well be situations where the opening you created can be passed through again or something else useful be done with the waiting time... or even combining it with a monster redirection. In the second suggestion it looks like you're only going through once, which makes me think it couldn't quite make up for the time even if you don't need to get the three gems later, but what do I know. :) You'd have to consider forfeiting the later usage of the stunner though. Oh and come to think of it if you picked up the stunner, you couldn't get across the bridge, so the second alternative becomes less attractive. With the first you could just barely avoid picking it up I think, but after that you couldn't justify going back for it for getting past the marble.
Posted: 7/4/2013 3:56 PM
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
Joined: 5/21/2013
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3 seconds saved on this level thanks to Ilari and Svimmer! Link to video Changes:
  • The first jump at the top of the ladder is now able to get both gems. I phase down slightly to reposition and make the jump possible, since it involves subpixel shenanigans to get any height.
  • Holding alt down the crate stairs lets me get some more distance and makes falling down the stairs possible.
  • No stunner, no waiting for the marble at the end.
Posted: 7/5/2013 2:41 PM
Post subject: Missile City
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
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Time for 29, I think. Route 1: Route 2, let's try to use the teleporter:
Posted: 7/5/2013 8:31 PM
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
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Missle (sic) City: Link to video Poor trackbot...any improvements I can make here?
Posted: 7/5/2013 8:58 PM
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Svimmer
Joined: 9/27/2011
Posts: 207
Location: Finland
Oh please God let this be the fastest route! :)
Posted: 7/5/2013 9:06 PM
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henke37
Editor
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Location: Sweden
Enemies? What enemies?
Posted: 7/6/2013 7:16 PM
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
Joined: 5/21/2013
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Time for a full WIP. 30 levels: Link to video If you've seen the 10 level WIP and want to jump ahead, skip to 2:55 Statistics so far - Movie length: 9:39.95 s Rerecords: 19792
Posted: 7/6/2013 7:25 PM
Post subject: Missile City
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Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
I've been mapping out this level for gem relationships, with ideas with various levels of reliability. Maybe others can find some ideas here that escaped us. slamo may have found the fastest route already, but here's some other routes based on the above: A key point about this last one is, that it avoids some cross over, and starts the final leg of the route at the bottom left. The middle of route 2 here may not be optimal, but there's a lot that can be reworked with the same basic idea, ending up with the final leg.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 7/6/2013 10:48 PM
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creaothceann
He/Him
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slamo wrote:
Time for a full WIP. 30 levels: <video>http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wQuENBEdsDA</video>
½ speed version: https://vimeo.com/69811072
Posted: 7/6/2013 10:51 PM
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Nach
Emulator Coder
Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 4588
Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
From Anonycat:
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 7/7/2013 7:25 PM
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Svimmer
Joined: 9/27/2011
Posts: 207
Location: Finland
creo: thanks for the half-speed! You don't have time to grasp what's happening in the full-speed ones, so i think there should be such an encode for the full video. The sounds are a little off but i'm guessing that's just the speed-halving.
Posted: 7/7/2013 9:10 PM
Post subject: Jumping!
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Nach
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Location: In his lab studying psychology to find new ways to torture TASers and forumers
Rewatching the run at a slow speed: Link to video (thank you creaothceann!) I realized that jumps are not necessarily optimal. Jetman jumps to his full height immediately on the slightest tap of the jump button. In any situation where you have to jump twice in a row, you want the first jump to be as low as possible, so you can jump again sooner. Since jumping height is constant, you can ensure that sooner scenario if the first jump is earlier (where applicable). For example, pay close attention to Chutes & Ladders. Suboptimal jumping unfortunately is an epidemic that affects even our best TASers.
Warning: Opinions expressed by Nach or others in this post do not necessarily reflect the views, opinions, or position of Nach himself on the matter(s) being discussed therein.
Posted: 7/7/2013 10:28 PM
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Patashu
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Joined: 10/2/2005
Posts: 4043
Is input in Jetpack hexable (barring random drops)?
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
Posted: 7/7/2013 10:30 PM
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Ilari
Emulator Coder, Skilled player (1113)
Joined: 5/1/2010
Posts: 1217
Rookie of 2010 New systems TASer of 2010 New systems TAS of 2010
Patashu wrote:
Is input in Jetpack hexable (barring random drops)?
Probably not, even if improvement is minor and one can match RNG states upon exit.
Posted: 7/7/2013 10:44 PM
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creaothceann
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Editor
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Svimmer wrote:
creo: thanks for the half-speed! You don't have time to grasp what's happening in the full-speed ones, so i think there should be such an encode for the full video. The sounds are a little off but i'm guessing that's just the speed-halving.
No problem. For the sounds I use GoldWave's "Time Warp" effect; it has several modes and I'll try the other ones...
Posted: 7/7/2013 11:23 PM
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
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There are certainly improvements to be made on some of the earliest levels...as time has gone on we've learned more tricks and I've gotten better with movement. Chutes and Ladders in particular would be better if the "hold alt" trick was utilized. We've generally agreed to keep moving on instead of starting from scratch in the interest of completing the run, as I believe it can still be very entertaining. If someone (or me) decides to revisit this when it's done, there's a great wealth of knowledge now, possibly with more tricks to come. Visible progress with level 30: Link to video "Wiggling" up ladders and narrow shafts is key here to maintain the horizontal jumping speed when exiting them. I believe this is also the first known use of "pre-phasing", although it's a very minor use (first brick on the way back). There are some crates that either get in the way or help you out, I tested phasing certain ones to make the trip back quicker and this is what I found to be optimal.
Posted: 7/8/2013 8:21 PM
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Svimmer
Joined: 9/27/2011
Posts: 207
Location: Finland
Fighting with a new win 8 laptop today... be away for a couple of weeks and not necessarily very active with the project (especially if i can't even copy my files over... sheesh!). Created new entries into RP naming section for various new tricks... opinions wanted if you feel one of them misses the mark. I called one of them "delay-phasing" instead of "pre-phasing" to avoid potential confusion.
Posted: 7/10/2013 7:24 PM
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
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Two worms in this one. 31 Link to video The level can be split up into a few sensible paths to travel down. I tried three different routes: One with six cycles (two passes each for the outsides and center), one with four cycles (one pass for the outsides and two for the center), and one with three cycles (one pass for each section). The one with four cycles turned out to be the fastest. I tested a lot of the borderline gems (ones that could be grabbed on another pass) but let me know if I missed anything.
Posted: 7/11/2013 7:49 PM
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
Joined: 5/21/2013
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Here's a 1 second improvement on level 31: Link to video This route uses 2 cycles instead of the original 4, simply splitting the level in half.
Posted: 7/13/2013 7:26 PM
Post subject: Worlds Collide
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slamo
Reviewer, Expert player (2435)
Joined: 5/21/2013
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Level 32: Link to video The level is laid out in a pretty sensible order already, it's just collecting the gems between the ladders that required some testing. A stunner pops up in a really nice spot again, but I don't think getting it actually saved any time.
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