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Posted: 5/28/2005 7:24 AM
Post subject: Bigame Movies
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flagitious
Player (201)
Joined: 7/6/2004
Posts: 511
Ok what is a bigame movie? Well it is a term I just made up to describe this idea I just thought of: It is possible to design a series of inputs that when put into the emulator will beat more than one game. Probably not that fast or efficient, but I'm sure it can be done. This seems very interesting to me and there are so many different ways to play with it that I do not know where to begin. It would be very fun/challenging and maybe even interesting to others to create a bigame movie that beats two games at once as fast as possible. My original idea was a bigame movie that beats multiple levels of the same game, but multiple games at once seems cooler. Here is something almost unrelated. It is a short program that is valid in both perl and postscript and produces an interesting output when run in both languages. I haven't studied it but I think it is cool and a similar idea to bigames. Anyways a movie file won't work for two different games because I think it has the CRC32 or whatever, but this can just be editted so it will work. It would be cool to watch both videos at the same time in sync. But I do not know which emulators work like this (I know snes9x automattically pauses whenever it is not the main thing running)? Does this make any sense? What two games would people like to see bigamed?
g,o,p,i=1e4,a[10001];main(x){for(;p?g=g/x*p+a[p]*i+2*!o: 53^(printf("%.4d",o+g/i),p=i,o=g%i);a[p--]=g%x)x=p*2-1;}
Posted: 5/28/2005 7:26 AM
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BoltR
Former player
Joined: 8/12/2004
Posts: 651
Location: Alberta, Canada
Movie file is just controller input, it will work with any game you try to play it in. The CRC doesn't really mean anything.
Posted: 5/28/2005 7:27 AM
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flagitious
Player (201)
Joined: 7/6/2004
Posts: 511
Ah you are right this makes the idea even sweeter!
g,o,p,i=1e4,a[10001];main(x){for(;p?g=g/x*p+a[p]*i+2*!o: 53^(printf("%.4d",o+g/i),p=i,o=g%i);a[p--]=g%x)x=p*2-1;}
Posted: 5/28/2005 11:59 AM
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SXL
Joined: 2/7/2005
Posts: 571
idea was tested with the nes pinball game : http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1490 I wonder how a player would make an input sequence work with more than one game, unless total random. play games alternatively ? find close games ? you'd still need to have desynched parts, where the games are too different, and the character would "survive" by luck in the game the input wasnt designed for. tremendous work... and need of LOTS of luck...
I never sleep, 'cause sleep is the cousin of death - NAS
Posted: 5/28/2005 4:07 PM
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flagitious
Player (201)
Joined: 7/6/2004
Posts: 511
Haha the pingball thing is a good idea too. You say all this stuff about luck, but on this site there is no such thing as luck. If you get unlucky you do it again :) Alright I'll try to make one (or two should I say?). Now I just need two games. Preferably around the same length (no more than 10 mins btw). I'll just do whatever two games people want. Someone just name a game they want to see it on. And then someone after that name another game. The only thing I ask is that they are for the same system and that if the first game is almost always scrolling to the right, the second game should be often going to the right too. And the inverse of this as well.
g,o,p,i=1e4,a[10001];main(x){for(;p?g=g/x*p+a[p]*i+2*!o: 53^(printf("%.4d",o+g/i),p=i,o=g%i);a[p--]=g%x)x=p*2-1;}
Posted: 5/28/2005 5:02 PM
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YtterbiJum
Active player (333)
Joined: 11/25/2004
Posts: 75
Maybe SMB and SMB3?
Currently working on: SNES Star Fox, Level 3 (100%, published) SNES Star Fox, Level 2 (33%, after Sector X) SNES Star Fox 2, Expert mode (100%, published)
Posted: 5/28/2005 5:16 PM
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flagitious
Player (201)
Joined: 7/6/2004
Posts: 511
Hey, 1 game per person please. This way I can pretend I'm an impromptu magician ^^ . Which one do you want?
g,o,p,i=1e4,a[10001];main(x){for(;p?g=g/x*p+a[p]*i+2*!o: 53^(printf("%.4d",o+g/i),p=i,o=g%i);a[p--]=g%x)x=p*2-1;}
Posted: 5/28/2005 5:21 PM
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Blublu
Player (68)
Joined: 3/11/2004
Posts: 1058
Location: Reykjaví­k, Ísland
Super Mario 1 and Kung Fu is the way to go. Especially since you're walking in opposite directions! Should be interesting... Edit: No, I have a better idea. How about SMB1 and Excitebike. A cheap trick would be to get the game to pause for one game and not the other, then play the game that didn't pause, and after that one is finished, unpause and finish the other one. But that would be considered cheap, not cool, etc. There's also the super ultimate ridiculusness challence. Make a movie that completes all 6 NES Mega Man games. Yeah, right! Good luck with that one.
Posted: 5/28/2005 5:27 PM
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DeHackEd
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Former player
Joined: 11/6/2004
Posts: 833
/me gets started.
Posted: 5/28/2005 5:39 PM
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flagitious
Player (201)
Joined: 7/6/2004
Posts: 511
Heh I thought of the pause trick too, that wouldn't be very interesting if it was basically 2 movies one after the other, but maybe it could be used in very short periods or something. I will be aiming for shortest max time, so most likely the pause abused wouldn't pay off. Heh all 6 mega mans, that would really cool, probably a bit of stretch. I don't really know anything about mega man and I should start with just two movies at once to get a feel for it... Kung Fu and SMB1. I know I said if first movie involves mostly moving to the right so should the second. But I like this idea because they are both short heheh. If there is a way to wobble so that I can make both characters move in their desired direction with reasonable speed, I'll try this. But if there isn't it just wouldn't be interesting enough. I'll have to play around because I'm not very familiar with SMB1 and not at all familiar with Kung Fu. DeHackEd good luck if you are going to try too. Which games are you doing?
g,o,p,i=1e4,a[10001];main(x){for(;p?g=g/x*p+a[p]*i+2*!o: 53^(printf("%.4d",o+g/i),p=i,o=g%i);a[p--]=g%x)x=p*2-1;}
Posted: 5/28/2005 5:58 PM
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OmnipotentEntity
He/Him
Player (36)
Joined: 9/11/2004
Posts: 2631
I was trying this with MM1 and MM2, but I couldn't get two copies of Famitasia to sync up, and doing it in FCEU is tedious. I started trying to throw together a version of FCEU that spawns two windows that accept the same input. But I got lazy.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day, Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
Posted: 5/28/2005 6:19 PM
(Edited: 5/29/2005 1:01 AM)
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DeHackEd
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Former player
Joined: 11/6/2004
Posts: 833
The good news is that the concept works just fine. http://dehacked.2y.net/BT/torrents/MMX-and-MMX2-2.torrent (It's ~10 MB, about 3 minutes long)
Posted: 5/28/2005 6:35 PM
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Blublu
Player (68)
Joined: 3/11/2004
Posts: 1058
Location: Reykjaví­k, Ísland
That was better than I expected it to be. Very weird, though.
Posted: 5/28/2005 6:38 PM
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flagitious
Player (201)
Joined: 7/6/2004
Posts: 511
Yeah that was really awesome.
g,o,p,i=1e4,a[10001];main(x){for(;p?g=g/x*p+a[p]*i+2*!o: 53^(printf("%.4d",o+g/i),p=i,o=g%i);a[p--]=g%x)x=p*2-1;}
Posted: 5/28/2005 6:40 PM
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OmnipotentEntity
He/Him
Player (36)
Joined: 9/11/2004
Posts: 2631
Apparently the tracker hates Azureus. So uh... before I go getting a different client, what else does it hate if anything?
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day, Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
Posted: 5/28/2005 7:29 PM
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SXL
Joined: 2/7/2005
Posts: 571
it hates bitcomet too :
Error: Tracker Response Error:Hacked client access denied. in Tracker: http://dehacked.....
flagitious : what I meant was, record a movie for a game, and have enough luck to make it works afterwards with another game. actually, I didnt think about how to record a "bigame movie". maybe synchronize 2 emulators on the same movie file, as mentionned in the topic ? please explain...
I never sleep, 'cause sleep is the cousin of death - NAS
Posted: 5/28/2005 7:37 PM
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DeHackEd
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Former player
Joined: 11/6/2004
Posts: 833
Sorry, tracker's a little oversensetive. Bitcomet appears to be a really poorly hacked client so it gets denied access. I've removed that. As for my game production, take a look at this screen shot: http://dehacked.2y.net/mmx-and-mmx2.jpg
Posted: 5/28/2005 7:58 PM
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nesrocks
He/Him
Player (247)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
I tried doing it on fceu yesterday, playing totally rad + ye ar kung fu. the problem is when i played the ye ar kung fu movie on totally rad, it was out of sync, i wonder if it has anything to do with the movie header? i pressed the same keys on the same frames for both movies, but it seemed to have started out of sync already.
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 5/28/2005 10:12 PM
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SXL
Joined: 2/7/2005
Posts: 571
very nice work, DeHackEd. though I don't get how it's done 0.o sharing same movie file doesnt give interlock problems ? and the savestates...
I never sleep, 'cause sleep is the cousin of death - NAS
Posted: 5/28/2005 10:24 PM
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DeHackEd
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Former player
Joined: 11/6/2004
Posts: 833
Here's what I did. I modified snes9x to accept save-state commands from my joypad (only 1 save slot... I don't have too many buttons to work with). I linked my joypad into two pipes and had a copy of snes9x on each one. When I press save-state, both save and when I press load-state, both load. Technically each one is making its own SMV, but they should both have the same contents. This is contradicted by the desync, but I'm looking into it. The save-states are given names by the ROM's name, so that's not a problem anyways.
Posted: 5/30/2005 6:41 PM
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flagitious
Player (201)
Joined: 7/6/2004
Posts: 511
I like dehacked's method of putting the controller input into both emulators, this is much easier than what I was planning on having to do. I still like the bigame idea and am planning on doing it, but I have to finish this other project I started on first.
g,o,p,i=1e4,a[10001];main(x){for(;p?g=g/x*p+a[p]*i+2*!o: 53^(printf("%.4d",o+g/i),p=i,o=g%i);a[p--]=g%x)x=p*2-1;}
Posted: 5/30/2005 6:45 PM
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BoltR
Former player
Joined: 8/12/2004
Posts: 651
Location: Alberta, Canada
For me SNES9x accepts input when the window isn't in focus anyways, so it's actually pretty easy to do.
Posted: 5/30/2005 7:01 PM
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nesrocks
He/Him
Player (247)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
flagitious, you can test left+right to move right on one game and left on the other, might work
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 6/5/2005 11:08 PM
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DeHackEd
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Former player
Joined: 11/6/2004
Posts: 833
Status update. Stops on the final approach to Spark Mandrill and after defeat Agile for my first Zero part. Flagitious, I hope you don't mind me using this thread.
Posted: 6/12/2005 7:50 PM
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DeHackEd
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Former player
Joined: 11/6/2004
Posts: 833
It's been a week, and no response, so I'll take that as an "I don't mind." Status update. :) If there's no seeds, users of ABC or BitTornado will still be able to download from this torrent.
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