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Posted: 5/14/2005 6:14 PM
Post subject: Holy Diver (J)
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
I'm going to start a time attack for this hard game. I dont know of any glitches at the moment. If anyone know of any, please let me know.
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/25/2005 6:31 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Ok.. After the first jump (Black screen) MY frame count measures 660, while FODA's V1 measures 681(21 frames ahead). Then after the first set of steps, i am still 21 frames ahead. Then after the second set, I lost 1 frame.. somewhere i do not know... Then after the 3rd set i lost another 2. Then when i picked up the item i lost another frame. I lost 4 frames in the first floor.. Still unknown to where. My idea (not 100%) is that when you are turned blue(using magic) you might walk faster.... That is the only thing that i can see me and foda doing different there. Im about to test further...
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/25/2005 6:49 PM
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Ferret_Warlord
Skilled player (1416)
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 1978
Location: Making an escape
You lose a frame every time you land. Have you minimized the number of jumps you made? And I wasn't aware Foda made anything. I have the first level done, though. I was 677 in the first room, so nice improvement. :P
A hundred years from now, they will gaze upon my work and marvel at my skills but never know my name. And that will be good enough for me.
Posted: 5/25/2005 7:05 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
I have.. I jump 9 times while Foda jumped 10.. I dont understand..
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/28/2005 1:46 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
k.. After so many days of testing.. i think i have the fastest time for the first items dissapearence. No clue yet to if blue makes you faster or not.. but.. I'll stay blue anyway just not to risk it.. In this version, i stayed blue after my first shot on the first floor. Took some of FODA's idea's from his movie which took the item at frame 1882. Then i gained one frame on him by getting a second shot in instead of a jump, Making me get the item at 1881. I doubt that can be quicker so.. i might try the stairs next. Get the FCM here: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/35/Vatchern-Holydiver-Level1-Floor1-V2.fcm
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/28/2005 4:33 PM
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Ferret_Warlord
Skilled player (1416)
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 1978
Location: Making an escape
You CAN make it up those stairs with one jump without brushing against the steps, you know. Also in the first pit, you can nail those two grunts with one dual shot, eliminating another jump. Plus, I know you can start jumping a few frames sooner when grabbing the bracelet. A glitch I know of: when the game locks your controls for something like a cutscene, you have one frame in which to do something. It helps on the first boss as you can jump ahead a little bit as the doors close. There's also another glitch where hitting pause resets certain enemy timers, like when they shoot, but it shouldn't be needed. Good job thus far. I like the falling technique in the first room.
A hundred years from now, they will gaze upon my work and marvel at my skills but never know my name. And that will be good enough for me.
Posted: 5/28/2005 7:55 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Thanks Ferret. I have made it up the steps in one jump but.. You stop for 2 frames i noticed.. Because where the character just makes it, it takes one frame to set him up, then hes stopped for another frame. so, i find the dual jump is more convient. I will try to see if i can nail those two grunts but.. where one is so low, i think the animation of the shot wouldn't be finished before he hits the ground, making it freeze for more frames. And yes, i can start jumping sooner. i can just rerecord that.. i just wanted to see when the bracelet was gone. Thanks for the gitch, that will be helpful. One glitch i found, is with the dual shot. You can shoot it to one side of the screen, and it hits any objects that are half ways pass the screen on the other side. (Might be useful for level 2 boss if i can position right)
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/28/2005 8:00 PM
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nesrocks
He/Him
Player (246)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
ferret: about the jump before the door closes, it works, but i dont know if its faster, because the door will only close as soon as you land, so, jumping before it closes or after makes no difference.
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 5/28/2005 8:04 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
FODA: Well.. how about when you have defeated level 1 boss, when you have to wait for the doors to open?
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/28/2005 8:16 PM
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Ouzo
Former player
Joined: 8/15/2004
Posts: 422
Location: Minnesota
Did anyone else think of the Dio song when they saw this thread?
Posted: 5/28/2005 8:40 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
to be honest.. i never heard of that song.
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/28/2005 9:45 PM
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Ferret_Warlord
Skilled player (1416)
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 1978
Location: Making an escape
Actually jumping as the door closes is faster. The doors closes on a timer regardless of whether you're on the ground or not. My level 1. The boss can be done about a second faster, but getting into the same postion at the end of the battle shouldn't be much of a hassle. There's another glitch with the twin fires where you can shoot a ball in either direction if you turn around at the right time. I was kind of hoping to save my 200th post for something a little special. Oh well.
A hundred years from now, they will gaze upon my work and marvel at my skills but never know my name. And that will be good enough for me.
Posted: 5/29/2005 1:36 AM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Cant get .fcm.. a page full of wierd symbols come up.
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/29/2005 1:49 AM
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slash_star_dash
Former player
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 518
i emailed the fcm i got earlier to you... hope you get it alright... (didnt see your name in the logged in users spot is why i posted)
Posted: 5/29/2005 1:17 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Once again.. the floor can be done quicker. Black screen entering room. Mine is at 660. Ferrets at 677. i am 17 frames quicker there. Items dissapearing. Mine is at 1881. Ferrets at 1895. I am only 14 frames ahead, meaning ferrets way is 3 frames quicker then mine. So.. Back to testing again.
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/30/2005 2:09 AM
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Ferret_Warlord
Skilled player (1416)
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 1978
Location: Making an escape
I can garauntee you it's those three extra jumps I mentioned. I just checked my own run and making those big jumps only stops me for one frame. I don't know why you're stopping for two; maybe you're in the wrong position?
A hundred years from now, they will gaze upon my work and marvel at my skills but never know my name. And that will be good enough for me.
Posted: 5/30/2005 2:51 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
Hmm..... Im not sure either.. I have exactly 2 hours of free time starting soon so.. i'll spend that making my holy diver calculations.. then doing them.. and maybe do the stairs leading to the upper level, and destroying the blocks. That caused me grief before.. and it will probably do the same this time. Seems like everytime i use non-magic shots, i can never hit them all in one jump. Then when i use the Dual-shots, i can.. but theres a bug that if you are shooting with magic there and the animation isn't stopped when you land.. the animation will repeat. That is what caused me the most grief.. But im sure its possible to not allow that somehow.
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/31/2005 1:22 AM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
When i watch your movie ferret.. i think for sure that your stopped for 2 frames..
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 5/31/2005 1:52 AM
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Ferret_Warlord
Skilled player (1416)
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 1978
Location: Making an escape
Watch it frame by frame. And if the two grunts are still causing you grief, try shooting at the flyer earlier. You're shots don't have to hit at the same time.
A hundred years from now, they will gaze upon my work and marvel at my skills but never know my name. And that will be good enough for me.
Posted: 5/31/2005 1:58 AM
Quote
Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
I do watch it frame by frame... When your character has to get shifted up.. thats a frame. then, like always, hes stopped for a frame when he lands.
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 6/1/2005 3:55 AM
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Ferret_Warlord
Skilled player (1416)
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 1978
Location: Making an escape
Watch it again. Pay attention to frames 820-823. Don't watch whatshisface, watch the background. It changes between frames 820 and 821. It changes between 822 and 823. But between 821 and 822, there is no change. Thus, there is only a one frame pause on frame 822. I'll edit this post with a gif if I need to illustrate further. Please forgive me if I sound condescending. That's not my intent.
A hundred years from now, they will gaze upon my work and marvel at my skills but never know my name. And that will be good enough for me.
Posted: 6/7/2005 8:04 PM
Quote
Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
moving right first dont work.. i got 10th hit on him at 3808.. 7 frames quicker then mine but.. im over too far and he stops running and dont jump.. so that slows it down.
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 3/2/2006 12:12 AM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
I am on the stage 5 boss now. If anyone knows anything about this game, I need a good techneque to kill him fast. I tried using Breaker, but its really slow. http://vatchern.maclenet.com/Bablo.fc1 <-- The save state for anyone wanting to try it to help me :)
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
Posted: 3/2/2006 3:14 AM
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nitsuja
Emulator Coder, Skilled player (1310)
Joined: 12/21/2004
Posts: 2687
Computer TASer of 2011 TAS of 2011 First edition TAS of 2011 Computer TAS of 2011 Sega TAS of 2010 Sega TAS of 2008 Sega TAS of 2007 Glitchy TAS of 2007
I don't know if this will help find a strategy, but here are some damage numbers: 
breaker:   4-5 damage per firing
twin fire: 1-2 damage per firing
overdrive: 1-3 damage per collision
thunder:   2-7 damage per firing
no magic:  1-5 damage per pass?

Boss's HP: 64, at address 0446
Posted: 3/2/2006 1:01 PM
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Vatchern
Player (86)
Joined: 3/8/2005
Posts: 973
Location: Newfoundland, Canada
I tried using breaker again. sad part is i run out of MP, and have to switch to Single shots taking alot longer time.
http://tasvideos.org/Vatchern.html
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