Post subject: World Of Goo
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When Dolphin will be ready, i would love to TAS this game, and I know that they're other people who wants to do it too... (Sorry for my bad English, I tell you that now before you cry ;p) In my opinion, we can have three TASes for this game : - any% : Just finish the game, trying to avoid the OCDs as they waste our time on the map. - 100% : All OCDs - Max Goo : Abusing the physic motor to get more goos than the game normally allows you. (exemple) I will personally try to work on an any% run... Here is a single-segment speedrun and this and this may be two interesting channels to look on. As Dolphin still can't synch the wiimote movement when you try to playback, we still can talk about known glitchs and strategies :p We can also talk about luck manipulation, because for each level we can have two situations at the beginning, for example level 1 can start with this or with this, and it would be very relevant if we could know how to manipulate those apparitions. I can confirm that the game choose that during the map, when we select the level, I was thinking about the number of the frame when you select the level... If it's odd or even... Oh well, any ideas ?
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How many Wiimotes can control at once? 2? 4?
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I succeed to control only one... Well, Dolphin does support 4 wiimotes, but we only have one mouse... Maybe later with a TAS-Input plugin... I agree that a run with 4 wiimotes would be really impressive for this game.
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Hmmm, I've got one question : should we start to make 1P run or should we wait for the PC emulator to become compatible ?' I ask that because the PC version run at 60 FPS and has a wider screen (which means moving faster, and throwing with more strengh and way more accurate) or will it be ok to a wii-version run and a pc-version run of this game ? What do you think ? EDIT : I did it ! :D But of course it desynch'd :(
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For a lot of the levels I think it would still be faster to get OCD (the time taken to not get it may be more than the time wasted on the map), but some I could see this. Like the first level you just end the level before getting them all.
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I think the optimal strategy when TASing is very different from the best realtime strategy, as you can keep things upright that shouldn't possibly be able to stay upright by repeatedly throwing gooballs at them with TAS precision and speed. (Likewise, you can keep things horizontal, etc.) I think the TAS will mostly be about building the narrowest possible structure and throwing things at it to make it go in the right direction, assuming the game lets you throw frequently and quickly enough (which would almost certainly be possible using a mouse, and maybe using a Wiimote too).
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This game can now sync with the latest build made by rog ( ).
rog wrote: http://dl.dropbox.com/u/11111638/Dolphin%20desync-fixes%20x64.exe http://dl.dropbox.com/u/11111638/Dolphin%20desync-fixes%20x86.exe This is the desync-fix clone i linked above (rbc61dbdf58a8bb088109839c5f25e7183830b166) merged with tas-input.
For a lot of the levels I think it would still be faster to get OCD (the time taken to not get it may be more than the time wasted on the map), but some I could see this. Like the first level you just end the level before getting them all.
That's true. I'm not even sure anymore if you really loose some frame when you get OCD, I though so but I realised that my test were wrong :p
assuming the game lets you throw frequently and quickly enough (which would almost certainly be possible using a mouse, and maybe using a Wiimote too).
You can throw one goo per three frame |catch-throw-release| ( http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LjiWVCOkUOk&feature=youtu.be ), but the problem is the speed. For example, in the 1-1 Going up, you need to move up the camera to throw efficiently (good ratio precision/speed) the goos from the ground to the pipe. I guess it's possible to throw them with a good speed without moving up the camera too, but even with TAS-precision this is very hard... But oh well, I guess this is part of the fun ! :p
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Note that the OCD animation is useful for a cutscene skip (in Whistler; if you got two OCDs in a row immediately before starting it, then you can whistle during the cutscene, according to the person who speedran the game for SDA).
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Is it a cutscene skip ? Hum, i'm going to read all the thread one more time on SDA :p Thanks !
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Read the publication comments too.
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I would also rather wait for 4 player support than make one with one player. I think it would be a lot more entertaining, and faster. One time my brother was stuck on an OCD (The level where the bottom would burn after a while) so I got another wiimote and helped him (We also had another one just whistling the same direction).
RachelB
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sudgy wrote:
I would also rather wait for 4 player support than make one with one player. I think it would be a lot more entertaining, and faster.
Do keep in mind, that other than otu0001 who has made all of one commit, there is not a single person working on dolphin right now who cares about tasing. There is a good chance you will be waiting quite a while for 4 player tasing.
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I also thought as you than a 4 players would be awesome, but as rog said the dev of Dolphin is pretty slow. I don't complain though, it's all free :p I can't wait in the future : 4 players wii VS 1 player PC *_*
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Hi ! Here is my first WIP ! http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yhl67n7e3ZM Times : 1-1 : 0:00 - 51 frames 1-2 : 0:02 - 148 frames 1-3 : 0:06 - 400 frames (I hate this level, and TASing it was... Ugh :p) ---- This is my first TAS attempt ever, so I really need feedback about what I should change and how to improve myself. Oh and also, does anybody know how to get a good quality recording ? I mean here the audio just keeps desynchronizing (no, it's not a real word), and the hack-version of Dolphin made by natt makes the whole movie desync... :s
RachelB
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Natt's patch needs to be updated for the more recent revisions. You can either bug him to do that, or i'll get around to it eventually.
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Well natt publised a new version of a/c http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=12601 so I guess he's working on it :p EDIT : I was asking that because I saw the high quality video of sonicpacker's runs on Super Mario Galaxy :p
RachelB
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No, his patch applies to that revision just fine. As far as i know, he is not working on fixing it for the later revisions.
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What I meant was that I don't want to urge him. He's doing it for free, and this TAS will take some time to be done. EDIT : Maybe I should specify that it's not the emulator itself which is causing the audio lag, but when I'm recording (with fraps for example). I read the movie making guide, but there isn't any avi recorder built-in Dolphin .
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Since this is a TAS where you can work at high speed, would it not be possible to just build up to the pipe and pull off bits from below before it crashes to save time?
"An artist who can’t take constructive critique on their work is only hurting themselves and their potential. Conversely, and artist that can’t communicate a critique in a constructive way isn’t helping anybody."
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STBM wrote:
EDIT : I was asking that because I saw the high quality video of sonicpacker's runs on Super Mario Galaxy :p
I don't know anything about natt's a/v recording thing and I've never even attempted to use it yet. What I do is set the graphical settings in Dolphin to be absolutely ridiculous and unreal, then I close the toolbar and status bar [which makes more room] and stretch the Dolphin window [using render to main, of course] to its biggest size without there being black bars on any side of the game. My monitor is 1920 x 1080, so I can get Dolphin to be a pretty decent size. Then I just dump it with, like I said, those crazy settings and large resolution. After dumping the frames [which takes a very long time because my computer isn't that good], I dump the audio separately since I don't know how natt's thing works. I use Sony Vegas to piece the video to the audio. I do not piece the audio to the video because the video has no lag frames. That's what causes the desynchs. So once the video is the proper length, I render it in with no motion blur in .wmv format. Depending on if the video is 4:3 or 16:9, I use a custom size (1920 x 1440 for standard, and 2048 x 1152 for widescreen). I also choose for the audio to be rendered as a 320 kbps mp3, because that quality is essentially lossless to the human ears (and YouTube murders it anyway). Hope this helps.
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Tseralith wrote:
Since this is a TAS where you can work at high speed, would it not be possible to just build up to the pipe and pull off bits from below before it crashes to save time?
So far, he hasn't done any levels with a goo that he can take off. You can only take off green goos.
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Thanks sonicpacker ! It will be very usefull ! Tseralith, as sudgy said, this can't be done yet, the only way to take off non-green goos is by breaking the tower on the side, which is too slow.
XkyRauh
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When you're tossing the white goos up, can you drag them off to the side of the level and toss them diagonally toward the pipe? That might be overall faster than the multiple scroll-drags... That said, looks real nice so far! Looking forward to the later levels. :)
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... I can actually throw them on the sides and make them bounce toward the pipe ! It will be hard to do, but hey ! It's a TAS :D Totally forgot to use the sides ! Thanks ! EDIT : Success ! New time for 1-3 : 0:04 - 269 frames :D
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New WIP, need feedback about the quality of the run so far and also the quality of the encoding :p Thanks Link to video[/video]