I thought nitsuja decided that forward speed was somewhat lower when pressing two directions. You hug the walls with diagonals when you should be pressing only one direction. For example at 3626, 3674, around 4390, 5210, 5776, 5838, 6343, 6374, 7425, 8308, 8334, 8377, 8461, 8709, 8757, 8964, 9162, 9213, 11241, well you get the idea. This is just until you pick up Zelda.
The lamp doesn't hurt normal enemies, so probably it's the same for the two you mentioned. The safest thing is to check, though.
I thought nitsuja decided that forward speed was somewhat lower when pressing two directions.
This only applies when you're actually moving in those two directions, I think. (Although in cases where you're walking along a wall while facing towards it, I think it looks slower or at least more careless than facing in the direction being walked in, so I'd rather it not be done.)
Then the only things different in my path from TSA's will be the Ice Rod gotten after the Ice Palace, and I complete #2 after #5.
I think that it slows you down iff you are facing the wall *and* you are walking near the edges of a door. If that's the case then I need to change one part.
I haven't made any tests though.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day,
Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
edit: And I can't believe I missed this, but when Zelda says "Sanctuary is just beyond that door. Pull that switch over there" right near the end... that's totally unnecessary, you can walk a bit to the right first and that dialog box won't be triggered at all.
Is this now done in the new video?
I still can see the Messagebox. Did you miss this idea, Omni?
cu
Fabian
I was thinking of taking this path (it differs slightly from TSA's because I don't need the hookshot in the Ice Cave):
Won't the hookshot be a time saver since it alows you to travel over gaps etc? Also you can use it if you don't wanna take damage from those fires that are cycling around some places. Anyways. It will be interesting to see how you work it out. :)
You might want to look around the forum for a new route that TSA provided. I beleive he posted somewhere with some tricks a different temple order that wasn't in his run.
Won't the hookshot be a time saver since it alows you to travel over gaps etc?
I don't know how quick the dash across the gap glitch is, guessing a pixel every two frames though, and there's only one place where you'd need it in the 5th dungeon, would having the gold sword for dungeon 2 be save more time than the time lost in dungeon 5 from not having a hookshot?). But I can already travel over any pit as long as I have the dash boots and I can get to its edge.
I completely forgot about the restart. I'll have to put some more thought into the path.
Would grabbing extra keys in a dungeon help? I'm not sure if they port across dungeons.
@Fabianx: There were two text boxes, one at the entrance and one at the wall. I don't think you can get around the second one.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day,
Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
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OmnipotentEntity wrote:
I completely forgot about the restart. I'll have to put some more thought into the path.
Doesn't restarting in this one take a long time? I remember the restart going back to the title screen, which means watching that Triforce animation every time.
It's admittedly useless once you get the flute. But there's a few places where it might be useful before then (like 2nd palace -> Death Mountain, maybe, I'll test).
So it's nothing major. But I still need to think this entire thing out better. <3 @ TSA for the maps and the good starting point.
And Happy V-Day.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day,
Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
You only have to watch the triforce animation the first time. After that you can skip it with start, so restarting should be quick business. It should be used directly after coming out of the secret passage to warp to Link's house, for example, because it's closer to the first dungeon. Probably after visiting Sahasrahla or whatever his name is, to go to town and get the book too.
Would grabbing extra keys in a dungeon help? I'm not sure if they port across dungeons.
No, they don't. At least not from Crystal Dungeon 1 -> Crystal Dungeon 2.
Truncated wrote:
You only have to watch the triforce animation the first time. After that you can skip it with start, so restarting should be quick business.
*nod* Cool beans. I could die within dungeons as well as a substitute Magic Mirror as well.
Sorry about the lack of updates. V-Day responsibilities and all that.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day,
Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
I could die within dungeons as well as a substitute Magic Mirror as well
when I was speedrunning this game, I found that using death saves time in the Desert Palace. Do you really want to do that though? I don't think it would look very good.
Some notes:
1. Doing Swamp Ruins (Crystal 2) before Misery Mire (Crystal 6) is a necessary change.
REASON: Hookshot allows you to cross gap at start much quicker, and you can use the hookshot in Skull Woods a few places.
2. There is a key in Skull Woods in the room 2 SCREENS LEFT of the entrance where there are 2 Gibdos and a switch you mush hold down. The key is under a pot. This is more optimal than the one I get later and Mirror warp.
3. Getting the Ice Rod later is optimal - get it around the Ice Palace part (I think I saw somebody mention it already.
4. My Ganon's Tower part - you can light those four torches much faster than I did in the room with the spinning flame thing.
5. Research the Ice Palace more...I have a gut feeling my route is not the best there...
That's about all.
Some notes:
1. Doing Swamp Ruins (Crystal 2) before Misery Mire (Crystal 6) is a necessary change.
REASON: Hookshot allows you to cross gap at start much quicker, and you can use the hookshot in Skull Woods a few places.
That's about all.
I cant imagine the setup time for the bash into the block being any longer than the time it takes to select the hook and extend it across the gap...
This signature is much better than its previous version.
I cant imagine the setup time for the bash into the block being any longer than the time it takes to select the hook and extend it across the gap...
They are about the same, I'd have to see which is faster. If it's within a few frames I'll do 6 before 2, because I'll save at least 20 in the #2 boss fight with the Gold Sword. And doing Misery Mire so soon is just cool.
TSA wrote:
2. There is a key in Skull Woods in the room 2 SCREENS LEFT of the entrance where there are 2 Gibdos and a switch you mush hold down. The key is under a pot. This is more optimal than the one I get later and Mirror warp.
Thanks.
TSA wrote:
5. Research the Ice Palace more...I have a gut feeling my route is not the best there...
Will do.
And thanks for the support. I was half afraid you'd get pissed.
flagitious wrote:
sewer rat, red shooters, tangela, jumpy plants: 5,1,5,20,5,1,5,5
skeleton: m,1,h,a,m,b,1,h
jumpy statues: ahaAahaA
one eyed bombers:bbbBbb8b
dogs with pitch fork, skull heads, guards: hhhh1h1h
venus fly trap: hfM,20,8h,20,A
green dildos, hammer on ice: Mmm5Mmhm
Right now I'm debating pretty heavily with myself whether it's faster to get the 100 rupee chest or manipulate enemies to get the extra 100.
Because each kill takes (Number of hitsx16 frames + reward spawn + frames of manipulation if applicable) and I'd need a total of 20 kills to earn at least 120 rupees.
It's not so much whether or not the amount of frames are less (because they clearly are) it more of a "Will I be able to naturally come across that many enemies of that one type before the first Crystal Dungeon?" Which isn't quite so sure as I'll be warping everywhere.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day,
Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
Because each kill takes (Number of hitsx16 frames + reward spawn + frames of manipulation if applicable) and I'd need a total of 20 kills to earn at least 120 rupees.
It's not so much whether or not the amount of frames are less (because they clearly are) it more of a "Will I be able to naturally come across that many enemies of that one type before the first Crystal Dungeon?" Which isn't quite so sure as I'll be warping everywhere.
You can get way more than 120 rupees on just the rats before the sanctuary. They're one hit kill and can also be manipulated to bunch up so you can kill 2 or 3 with one sword slash which is luck-manipulated to make them all drop rupees. Keep in mind though that boomarang-ed enemies only drop 1 rupee and (I think) don't count toward the sequence.
I'd rather not kill enemies that it'd be quicker to avoid.
Anyway, here's me getting with the update. I'm up the the room with the Big Key in it. I either have to find a way to manipulate the Tangelas into *not* dropping or find a smooth way to get the rupees they drop.
Note: When I use the boomerang to get the key, it seems as if it'd be faster to just walk and pick it up. But the key isn't pickupable until a few frames later and it's enough to make walking to the key and back 3 frames slower.
Note: I skip a green rupee toward the end of this video yet I pick up one at the beginning of the dungeon. Reason being is I lose no time with the first rupee, but the last green rupee would have cost me a few frames to I ignored it.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day,
Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
I just want to see this video made so I can know what the fastest times should be around...and possibly learn to do a few more things differently in order to get a lower time. I won't redo my run ever unless over 1 min of time can be saved relatively easily on a human run.
I'd rather not kill enemies that it'd be quicker to avoid.
Understood, and I guess there are probably faster ways of getting rupees than there.
OmnipotentEntity wrote:
I'm up the the room with the Big Key in it.
You're going to get the big key without killing the skeletons, right?
OmnipotentEntity wrote:
I either have to find a way to manipulate the Tangelas into *not* dropping or find a smooth way to get the rupees they drop.
It's probably best to get rupees from them whenever they're in your way, and if it can be a 5 or 20 it's probably worth a boomarang toss to take it even if it drops it a tiny bit off the path you're taking (I doubt manipulating something to not drop will ever save much time since that slows down the whole sequence by 1).
OmnipotentEntity wrote:
Note: When I use the boomerang to get the key, it seems as if it'd be faster to just walk and pick it up. But the key isn't pickupable until a few frames later and it's enough to make walking to the key and back 3 frames slower.
Yeah, items can be collected quite a bit earlier with the boomarang; even if you're already standing directly on top of an item when it's appearing, you'll still pick it up faster by throwing a boomarang.
About the left+right/up+down (moonwalking) thing, I personally wouldn't mind it as long as it isn't overdone, and I don't think the fact that it isn't being used to its full potential is a very good argument since the glitch caused by using it while walking through that doorway is a WAY different thing than just using it sometimes to face one way while walking the other. (But as for actual usefulness, the only things I can think of right now are using it to block something with your shield that you'd otherwise have to turn around to do, or using it to cause your boomarang to launch from further away from you than normal, both pretty minor.)
They are about the same, I'd have to see which is faster. If it's within a few frames I'll do 6 before 2, because I'll save at least 20 in the #2 boss fight with the Gold Sword. And doing Misery Mire so soon is just cool.
Agreed, the early Misery Mire was one of my favorite parts in TSA's run as I didnt know you could do it so early :-) I also like the couple of close calls like the half heart on gannon and those jumping little eyeballs of the Misery Mire boss (vitreous?)
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