Post by Sticky

Posted: 8/28/2008 10:40 PM

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alden

Player (121)

Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522

To clarify: snes9x+Lua has no way to control mouse input as of yet. With the rom hack that allows the cursor to be controlled with the joypad, snes9x+Lua does a fantastic job with cursor control, as you can have it look at memory to determine exactly where it is. Overlaying a picture with snes9x is possible but the way I was originally imagining it (very easy) is not. As in, there is a method for overlaying an image, and there is a method for setting transparency, but apparently image overlays do not support partial transparency, at least according to the API. What you could do theoretically is draw the image pixel by pixel.

I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs

Posted: 8/28/2008 11:19 PM

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Warp

Banned User

Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland

alden wrote:

To clarify: snes9x+Lua has no way to control mouse input as of yet. With the rom hack that allows the cursor to be controlled with the joypad, snes9x+Lua does a fantastic job with cursor control, as you can have it look at memory to determine exactly where it is.

But if someone wanted to simply "play" mario paint with snes9x, how would it work? And how does it work with frame advance (so that one could make a TAS)? (I'm asking this because it would be cool to try this myself, but I just don't know how mario paint is "played" with snes9x.)

Overlaying a picture with snes9x is possible but the way I was originally imagining it (very easy) is not. As in, there is a method for overlaying an image, and there is a method for setting transparency, but apparently image overlays do not support partial transparency, at least according to the API. What you could do theoretically is draw the image pixel by pixel.

Maybe adding support for overlaying an image needs to be coded into the snes9x source code. (Another option would be to use an external program for this: The program would show the image semi-transparently, so anything behind it would be shown through it. Then just position the program on top of the snes9x window.)

Posted: 8/29/2008 12:19 AM

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alden

Player (121)

Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522

Hmm, I haven't gotten the mouse to work at all so I have no idea :)

I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs

Posted: 8/29/2008 12:55 AM

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Titus_Kwok

Joined: 4/30/2006
Posts: 480
Location: the secret cow level

Would it be possible to display the image in a separate application, set that application to be transparent (Aero Glass?), and position that window over snes9x so that the images line up?

Posted: 8/29/2008 2:37 AM

Post subject: More picture spam

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alden

Player (121)

Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522

Titus Kwok wrote:

Would it be possible to display the image in a separate application, set that application to be transparent (Aero Glass?), and position that window over snes9x so that the images line up?

Probably :) OK more pics:

And my personal favorite:

I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs

Posted: 8/29/2008 2:40 AM

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NrgSpoon

Joined: 6/14/2004
Posts: 646

Doesn't the newest ZSNES release have mouse recording?

I like my "thank you"s in monetary form.

Posted: 8/29/2008 3:12 AM

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bkDJ

Joined: 7/26/2006
Posts: 1215

Bisqwit wrote:

nightmares

Why can't the SMV format simply be changed to something more sane like mouse delta instead of position? Seems smarter than A) having the smv writer deal with mouse stuff the previous frame or B) running the risk of eventually hitting the 32000 limit + not having a very human-readable smv.

Posted: 8/29/2008 5:10 AM

Post subject: Re: More picture spam

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Randil

Skilled player (1826)

Joined: 4/20/2005
Posts: 2161
Location: Norrköping, Sweden

alden wrote:

OK more pics: [...]

Woah, these look really, really good, though I would have preferred them in a little higher resolution, if possible. I can't wait to see more pics. Out of curiousity, how many frames does it take the program to paint a picture, in average?

My own page on this site.

Posted: 8/29/2008 7:02 AM

Post subject: Still more

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alden

Player (121)

Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522

Thanks! Unfortunately these are all at actual SNES resolution. Or at least I assume they are as they are unprocessed frame captures. The movie for Kirby is 480,000 frames. I didn't count the others, but the larger ones probably took substantially longer than that. Edit:

The next two are the same as the second Chrono Trigger image above, but done with two different set of default stamps. All you can really make out is Crono's hair :)

Picture of me from the User Photo thread:

Same picture with a different palette and huge brush:

I'm going to be away from my computer over the weekend, so probably no more from me til next week :) Oh, and I have compiled them all at http://tasvideos.org/Alden/AutomaticMarioPaint.html

I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs

Posted: 8/29/2008 9:57 AM

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Aqfaq

Editor, Expert player (2477)

Joined: 4/8/2005
Posts: 1573
Location: Gone for a year, just for varietyyyyyyyyy!!

Cool tool-assisted paintings, alden! Slightly off-topic: I wonder if there's enough screenshots available at TASVideos for generating a good looking mosaic.

Posted: 8/29/2008 10:40 PM

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Derakon

Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960

Well, there's 1186 published movies. Seems like that should be enough to make something reasonably neat-looking. Obviously the more images you have the more likely you are to have the one that works just right for that segment of the final image. Also, the Game Boy screenshots are unlikely to be very helpful. Monochrome and all that. There's the small problem of resolution; generally in a mosaic every input image has the same resolution, whereas different consoles have differing resolutions.

Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.

Posted: 8/30/2008 2:06 AM

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alden

Player (121)

Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522

Yeah, that would be awesome! Maybe we could use just NES ones (and some obsolete ones if there's not enough) Seems like it wouldn't be too hard to do a decent one. I know the "professional" ones look at the shape inside the source pictures to try to match lines and stuff, but at a minimum all you really need to do is work out the dominant color of the picture (or a couple sections) and match to the pixels of the target one...

I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs

Posted: 8/31/2008 12:18 AM

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Pekopon

Former player

Joined: 10/6/2007
Posts: 330
Location: B.C Canada

This is what I was hoping this topic would stir up. Actual good pictures in Mario Paint. XD (Mine are garbage, and I admit it.) I'm pleased people have taken time to do this stuff. Now if only we could get a super sped up video of one being made.

http://www.youtube.com/user/PekoponTAS 18 coins?!

Posted: 8/31/2008 12:33 AM

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Rick

Former player

Joined: 6/25/2004
Posts: 607
Location: Maine

You know something? I would think it would also be amusing too, for someone with little artistic talent on a piece of paper like moi, to maybe re-create a screenshot of a scene from a TAS, using tools! I can see it as sort of a tribute thing. I dunno, I'm just blathering, sorry if it's kind of off-topic. Also, Pekopon, like I said on YouTube, Keep up the good work. =)

http://wiki.rustedlogic.net/The_Cutting_Room_Floor The Cutting Room Floor wiki.

Posted: 8/31/2008 11:56 PM

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alden

Player (121)

Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522

Pekopon wrote:

(Mine are garbage, and I admit it.)

Nuh uh! Seeing them drawn is way cooler and you had to use actual creativity :) The pixel by pixel ones won't be terribly interesting movies... Maybe an SVG interpreter like LagDotCom mentioned would look comparable.

I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs

Posted: 9/1/2008 5:09 AM

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Sticky

Joined: 2/26/2007
Posts: 1365
Location: Minnesota

adelikat wrote:

I very much agree with this post.

Bobmario511 wrote:

Forget party hats, Christmas tree hats all the way man.

Posted: 9/1/2008 5:33 AM

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alden

Player (121)

Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522

On topic, here's an svg I edited to look somewhat like it would in Mario Paint. I should probably look for something with less detail :) http://aldentas.googlepages.com/lion.svg (Results may vary depending on browser)

I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs

Posted: 9/14/2008 6:30 PM
(Edited: 6/17/2010 3:43 PM)

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Gunty

Player (198)

Joined: 12/3/2006
Posts: 151

Aqfaq wrote:

Cool tool-assisted paintings, alden! Slightly off-topic: I wonder if there's enough screenshots available at TASVideos for generating a good looking mosaic.

I tried making some mosaics with all non-obsoleted publication screenshots. While the tile-set is lacking some bright colors, the result is not too bad I guess. Here are some (about 4 MB each): Mario Flying Mario Bowser Yoshi Luigi EDIT: Moved images.

Posted: 9/14/2008 6:45 PM

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alden

Player (121)

Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522

Wow! Awesome. So how'd you do it? :D

I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs

Posted: 9/14/2008 7:26 PM
(Edited: 9/14/2008 7:29 PM)

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DaTeL237

Active player (355)

Joined: 1/16/2008
Posts: 358
Location: The Netherlands

impressive! :) any chance of increasing accuracy? :D (e.g. match the tiles after splitting them, then picking the best screenshot that best matches several regions (note this assumes that atm you only look for nearest mean color...) also try difference color spaces :) edit: and is there any chance of doing a video-mosaic on an existing (short!) TAS? :)

TASes: [URL=http://tasvideos.org/Movies-298up-Obs.html]Mr. Nutz (SNES), Young Merlin 100% (SNES), Animaniacs 100% (SNES)[/URL]

Posted: 9/14/2008 7:28 PM

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Randil

Skilled player (1826)

Joined: 4/20/2005
Posts: 2161
Location: Norrköping, Sweden

alden wrote:

Wow! Awesome. So how'd you do it? :D

If he says MS Paint I'll be extremely impressed. ;) Seriously though, they look awesome, and I am already quite impressed. :) Oh, and I found Shadowgate, Deja Vu and Deja Vu 2 in those mosaics, yay!

My own page on this site.

Posted: 9/14/2008 7:43 PM

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Gunty

Player (198)

Joined: 12/3/2006
Posts: 151

Basically, I first down sampled the target picture and matched the tiles based on their mean color value. In order to try and prevent from having several identical tiles next to each other, not the best tile match is assigned, but a random pick from the 5 best matches. I'm sure this method could be improved, but this seemed the most time efficient solution at the time. I programmed this in Mathematica which is a fairly high level programming language, so I doubt I have the resources to do anything fancy like video mosaic (current memory usage already peaked at 2 GB). Also, without increasing the number of tile screenshots, I don't know it would be desirable to increase accuracy. Typically, you would then see several identical tiles next to each other in homogeneous regions, which is quite ugly in my opinion.

Posted: 9/14/2008 8:10 PM

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DaTeL237

Active player (355)

Joined: 1/16/2008
Posts: 358
Location: The Netherlands

hmm I still think you can gain a lot of visual accuracy without using more/smaller tiles let me try to explain based on an example say you're currently matching screenshots mean color values to regions of 16x16 pixels in the target picture instead, split up the region to 4 smaller regions of 8x8 pixels and determine the mean color values of each of the screenshots' quadrants, now rank them (the screenshots) based on their mean square error in these 4 values (rather than 1, as you currently do)... ofc the split could be into any arbitrary shape and amount oh btw, you can probably avoid insane memory usage by first creating a lookup table (only 3 bytes per image for RGB)... which might also speed things up depending on your implementation

TASes: [URL=http://tasvideos.org/Movies-298up-Obs.html]Mr. Nutz (SNES), Young Merlin 100% (SNES), Animaniacs 100% (SNES)[/URL]

Posted: 9/14/2008 10:02 PM

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Bezman

Joined: 2/7/2008
Posts: 185

alden wrote:

The pixel by pixel ones won't be terribly interesting movies... Maybe an SVG interpreter like LagDotCom mentioned would look comparable.

I'm not so sure! I'd certainly be interested to watch them being made.

I'm just some random guy. Don't let my words get you riled - I have my opinions but they're only mine.

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