Joined: 8/6/2006
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Location: Connecticut, USA
I'd probably have to vote against "at least one of every item" since it means you'd have to do pointless stuff like buy the Super Ball. And it seems to just fall into hazy category anyway.
The thing is, there is no point in trying to stick to conventional completion categories in games that don't have conventional ways of measuring the completion rates. Find one that suits the purpose, and stick to it. If anything, it's not any more vague than trying to find some set of variables in the game to fill the "this be 100%" quota. If you want to see a run that saves all characters, let it be an all-character run.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Ok then. I propose an all-character, all-Esper, all-skill (character specific), submission which beats the entire game. I think the only thing that this would skip that most other people would look for are item quests involving the coliseum and maybe a few cool boss fights.
Speaking of which, did they add in Gau's missing rages on the GBA version?
According to my Gamefaqs sources, he has Allo Ver (Death Warden) now but still not Siegfried, Chupon or Pugs. EDIT: DW uses Quake, and is undead with Stop immunity... really don't see going to Cave on the Veldt on a speedrun though, and ChickenLip already has Quake.
Ok then. I propose an all-character, all-Esper, all-skill (character specific), submission which beats the entire game. I think the only thing that this would skip that most other people would look for are item quests involving the coliseum and maybe a few cool boss fights.
I'm a little surprised as to why an alternate FF6 run is being discussed.
Naturally, I'm not against it this sort of run but I'd like to ask why you people feel such a run should be made. It won't be "completed as fast as possible" and the game doesn't have a progression measurement system (like SMW 96 exit or DKC 102%).
Is such a run considered to compensate for the lack of entertainment or gameplay technique in the existing run? If that's the case, in addition to what Zurreco has proposed, I also suggest the consideration to hugely sacrifice time in order to play out battles to be as entertaining as possible. This may include defeating bosses via non-conventional means to abusing not-so-apparent weaknesses of bosses to ignoring the clear status + instant death technique altogether (exceptions in certain cases).
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
The discussion is more or less in response to the fact that FF6 has SO MUCH CONTENT that is being skipped over in speedruns. Massive amounts of characters are ignored, cool techniques never experienced, memorable events passed, etc. People just want a run that does justice to the wide berth that FF6 offers.
It's not that I would expect the runner to slowly go through each notable conversation, or to show off every little trick in the game, but it would be nice to see how these portions of the game could be handled when they are otherwise not involved at all.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
That was the plan this whole time. Keep the current any% run on the site and then add a "100%" run to go alongside it. Did you think that we were going to obsolete the current one with a full submission?
Joined: 8/6/2006
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Location: Connecticut, USA
Would "all-skill (character specific)" mean getting all the Blitzes and Swordtechs but skipping the Rages, Lores, and Dances?
Edit: Well, even leveling Cyan and Sabin up to get those would be tedious. Probably the only entertaining skill collection would be Lores.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Why would that not include Lore, Rage, or Dance skillsets?
I thought you get all the SwdTech skills when you complete Cyan's side quests in the WoR, and Sabin gets all of his Blitzes when he gets Bum Rush. Right? Dances are incredibly easy to get, so that just leaves Lore and Rage farming for about an hour or two.
Actually, I do believe you only get Bum Rush or whatever you want to call it when you visit the cabin at the cross. The other blitzes you have to get by levels.
EDIT: According to GameFAQs, Sabin learns Spiraler at level 42.
<Zurreco> if so called professional players cant adapt to every playing field, theyre obviously not that great
Joined: 8/6/2006
Posts: 784
Location: Connecticut, USA
I'm pretty sure Sabin can learn Bum Rush with leveling. I seem to remember being surprised when I used the Lete River leveling trick as a kid, and came back to Sabin having all the Blitzes.
Also, saying "all skills (character specific)" seems to imply that you'd only get skills for specific characters. Which is why I was wondering. And the dances are easy to get, but I seem to remember that the Water Rondo took a lot of time and map movement to get.
Joined: 6/9/2005
Posts: 171
Location: Southern California
ElectroSpecter wrote:
And the dances are easy to get, but I seem to remember that the Water Rondo took a lot of time and map movement to get.
Don't you basically re-trace Sabin's scenario from the river back to Narshe, on foot, after you get the Airship? (It is very long, I just want to confirm this is how to do it.)
Joined: 8/6/2006
Posts: 784
Location: Connecticut, USA
XkyRauh wrote:
Don't you basically re-trace Sabin's scenario from the river back to Narshe, on foot, after you get the Airship? (It is very long, I just want to confirm this is how to do it.)
As I recall, yeah, that's the way I did it, and I think the only way to do it.
I'm pretty sure Sabin can learn Bum Rush with leveling. I seem to remember being surprised when I used the Lete River leveling trick as a kid, and came back to Sabin having all the Blitzes.
Yes, sorry, I meant to convey that Duncan only taught Bum Rush if you visit him before learning it through leveling, not all blitzes that you haven't learned yet as was supposed earlier. Though I doubt a speedrun would prefer getting to level 70 over level 42 and visiting the cabin. :P
Also, you can get a Chocobo in Nikeah and take it to Baron Falls at least.
<Zurreco> if so called professional players cant adapt to every playing field, theyre obviously not that great
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
The thing about getting all the Rages is that it gives you ample time to level 3 other characters while Gau is diving. That gives you the chance to make good headway towards the Blitzes, maybe pick up some Lores, and level up a third person for no reason other than higher stats. Plus, that gives a huge array of Rages to use throughout the rest of the run, thereby adding variety to each future battle.
In summary, who is going to start doing this run?
