4) Lag!! Why lag, in a Wii game, when Melee had none? Try using Pikachu's down-smash on someone. The game will freeze several times during the attack sequence. The game also tends to freeze on the Ice Climber level when the iceberg is sliding down the hill.
Oh? I haven't noticed any lag in particular (except that the almost silly amounts of hitstop on some attacks that makes the game feel like it lags) on those stages. I guess I haven't played all that many FFA's though, so perhaps that could be it.
And on the point of lag in Melee: Try playing busy matches on Big Blue, Mute city or Fountain of Dreams. At least in the PAL version, there's a decent amount of lag.
4) Lag!! Why lag, in a Wii game, when Melee had none? Try using Pikachu's down-smash on someone. The game will freeze several times during the attack sequence. The game also tends to freeze on the Ice Climber level when the iceberg is sliding down the hill.
Unless I'm thinking of something totally different, the pikachu thing isn't lag. The game "stops" at times when you make super-powerful hits to another player. Compare this with Zelda's "sex kick" (her forward or back air when timed perfectly), Captain Falcon's knee (forward air, again timed perfectly) or Jiggy's rest attack.
My copy has gotten chuggy at times, though. I can't remember any stand-out incident, but it's happened.
Has anyone else experienced bad lag on wifi mode? Sometimes the game with run really smoothly, but my input seems to be a couple of milliseconds behind, which totally messes me up.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
CtrlAltDestroy wrote:
1) The pace is a lot slower than Melee. Probably just takes some getting used to.
2) Controls seem a little unresponsive compared to Melee. Again, probably just takes some getting used to.
3) Item limitations. Only 3 Poke-balls on the screen at once? Only one assist trophy?
4) Lag!! Why lag, in a Wii game, when Melee had none? Try using Pikachu's down-smash on someone. The game will freeze several times during the attack sequence. The game also tends to freeze on the Ice Climber level when the iceberg is sliding down the hill.
5) Something's wrong with the randomness. Try going into Training mode and summoning a bunch of Poke-balls at once. Throw them all. most of the time, they'll all be the same Pokemon. The same with assist trophies: I once got Excitebikes six times in a row. Could this have something to do with a new seeding technique used in online play?
6) Smash balls aren't as rare as they should be, especially when items are on High. One appears at least every 60 seconds. You pretty much have to turn them off if you're playing with somebody less skilled than you.
1/2: The game is different from Melee, just as Melee was different from the original. However, Brawl feels less floaty and more responsive than Melee to me, so I don't know what you're talking about.
3: There have always been item limitations in the series. Furthermore, it would be awful trying to play with Andross, Nintendog, Shadow, and Resetti at the same time.
4: What lag are you talking about? The game has always purposefully slowed a bit when big hits or multi-hit attacks are landed. Have you never noticed that before?
5: The drop rates are different for each thing. Otherwise, you would get Mew just as easily as you would Meowth. It has always been like that.
6: Don't know what you're talking about, really. Our 4 person 8 stock matches see maybe 3 smash balls max throughout the whole fight. How can you complain about the frequency of item drops being too high when you're playing on High frequency? Also, why would you turn them off when you're playing someone less skilled than you? If you're more skilled, you should be able to get the ball first, steal it, or resist the Final Smash itself.
Twelvepack wrote:
this other one that looks like Mr. Potato head.
They both block a large portion of the screen for a fair amount of time, and all it seems to do is piss me off.
That's Mr. Resetti. His whole purpose is to piss you off. The fact that you are mad about him doing his job bothers me greatly. Also, the fact that you didn't take the time to even read what he said means that you're not focusing on the smaller points of the game.
Dwedit wrote:
On the flip side, they boosted Zelda drastically.
Sheik is at least 1/3 slower than before, and the transformation takes almost 3 times as long. That's not to mention a few other things that would be considered nerfing Zelda/Shiek, which is fine.
Jigglypuff was overpowered in Melee. She is right where she needs to be right now. The only major shifting that still needs to be done are with Diddy Kong, Pokemon Trainer, and Wario.
Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
Zurreco wrote:
Twelvepack wrote:
this other one that looks like Mr. Potato head.
They both block a large portion of the screen for a fair amount of time, and all it seems to do is piss me off.
That's Mr. Resetti. His whole purpose is to piss you off. The fact that you are mad about him doing his job bothers me greatly. Also, the fact that you didn't take the time to even read what he said means that you're not focusing on the smaller points of the game.
Are you really supposed to read what he is saying, when you can hardly see your own character, and 2 level 9 computers are busy jumping up your ass, superman style?
I like this game, don't get me wrong, but I cant stand items or maps that mess up your ability to actually play the game. Not being able to see, or suddenly reversing the controls does nothing constructive to the game play.
I have an idea, how about an assist trophy that turns the display off completely for 30 seconds! That way, you get to know what its like to play brawl if you don't own a TV.
fun fun fun.
I like items, and I like variety in the game play, but introducing things that accomplish nothing but prevent you from playing the game is asinine.
Joined: 2/13/2007
Posts: 448
Location: Calgary, Alberta
Twelvepack wrote:
I have an idea, how about an assist trophy that turns the display off completely for 30 seconds! That way, you get to know what its like to play brawl if you don't own a TV.
fun fun fun.
Well, A pokemon can do that for about 10 seconds. (Togepi). The game isnt all fighting, some items are designed to throw you off.
As for the rest of the complaints. I've heard stuff just like this when Melee came out.
Renting this space for rent.
Trying to fix image on this site. Please cut slack.
As of April 6th, 2012:
After a long absence, here we go again?
After 50 hours of Brawls.. we got all characters, all stages, all assists. There's still a lot of missing music - we only have 200 tracks - but maybe half of what's there is really awesome, and luckily there's a menu where you can turn off bad songs so.
The load times and lag are both annoying...
Subspace Emmisary is really fun. It's like a Kirby game. It's great.
Zelda is a LOT better - in Melee Shiek-only was the way to be but now Zelda-only is really powerful. Gannondorf and Samus are worse (why did they need to be nerfed if they were already not good?). Jigglypuff's rest is worse but her other moves are better so she's still playably good. Fox and Captain Falcon were both toned down, which is nice, and Kirby and Ness were both given very nice boosts. A lot of repeat characters play differently which is good and it mixes things up a lot - most people are changing their mains. Even 'repeat' characters like Ike, Lucas, Wolf, Toon Link, etc are very good and interesting takes. And Snake is a fun and playable character even if Sonic's really not.
Right now I'm still learning the game but Ike is really fun to play - his range and power make up for his lack of speed and the invincibility and armor/immortal on his B attacks mean I don't need to worry about dodge/block much. Metaknight, Wario, and Dedede are all disappointments which is sad. And I don't know what to think of Lucario yet - I liked Mewtwo who was definitely bottom-tier in Melee and he inherits from that but is also a lot better in a lot of ways, but he's still hard to use so I don't know whether he'll end up in the middle or near the top yet.
The stages, now that they're all unlocked we can turn off the bad ones (Norfair, New Pork City, Unknown Planet, etc) - like 3/4 are really good, and a few are really, really fun to do.
All in all I really like the game. It doesn't seem like much more than an upgrade to Melee, but that's all anyone ever wanted anyway, and Subspace Emmisary is worth the price of admission by itself.
someone is out there who will like you. take off your mask so they can find you faster.
I support the new Nekketsu Kouha Kunio-kun.
I didnt. But I wish I wore diapers at the age of 21, so I wouldnt have to clean up my pants after i found out that my brawl doesnt arrive in the mail until the 17th D-:<
adelikat wrote:
I very much agree with this post.
Bobmario511 wrote:
Forget party hats, Christmas tree hats all the way man.
1/2: The game is different from Melee, just as Melee was different from the original. However, Brawl feels less floaty and more responsive than Melee to me, so I don't know what you're talking about.
3: There have always been item limitations in the series. Furthermore, it would be awful trying to play with Andross, Nintendog, Shadow, and Resetti at the same time.
4: What lag are you talking about? The game has always purposefully slowed a bit when big hits or multi-hit attacks are landed. Have you never noticed that before?
5: The drop rates are different for each thing. Otherwise, you would get Mew just as easily as you would Meowth. It has always been like that.
6: Don't know what you're talking about, really. Our 4 person 8 stock matches see maybe 3 smash balls max throughout the whole fight. How can you complain about the frequency of item drops being too high when you're playing on High frequency? Also, why would you turn them off when you're playing someone less skilled than you? If you're more skilled, you should be able to get the ball first, steal it, or resist the Final Smash itself.
For the record, I'm not bashing the game. I'm just observing it.
3. One of the most fun things I've done in Melee is turn on Poke-balls to max, set stock to 30 or soemthing, and have a Pokemon fight. I was just a little bit disappointed to see that this isn't nearly as intense as it used to be.
4: Melee never had the "freeze for a second due to super-powerful attack" effect that Brawl does. I personally like games without that effect.
5. My sister played again today, and she got: Munchlax, Munchlax, Munchlax, Munchlax, Weevil, Munchlax, in that order. I'm not joking. (This was in Training mode, by the way, and she was continually spawning Poke-balls, but still.)
6.
Also, why would you turn them off when you're playing someone less skilled than you?
To make the game more fair. Nobody likes being utterly beaten. Win too much, and suddenly you no longer have a playmate. :(
Subspace Emissary is awesome, it is a full game in and of itself.
I personally like the assist trophies that block the screen if your playing friends it makes for a fun battle. Smash balls are fun to have on because the fight for them makes the game more frenzied and fun, again mainly if you're playing with other people. The thing I dont like about it is some people's way Final Smashes are way too good (Kirby) and some are terrible (DK). The Dragoon item is similar to a smash ball in that it makes for some chaos trying to get all the parts.
The gameplay in this is more floaty than in Melee and less fast paced. It lends itself more to mind games than technical skills, especially with wavedashing out. I dont like the absence of wavedashing but the absence of chain throwing is a good thing. Also, every character has far more recovery, as it is much easier to make it onto the edge of you're knocked off. This combined with the automatic sweetspotting and the fact that it takes much more percent to kill someone make edgeguarding a much bigger part of the game, which I like.
The characters are also more balanced, when I play random there are almost no characters that I complain about getting, which is the opposite of Melee.
All and all I'd say the game is better than Melee, there is just a lot more stuff in it. It is less technical but more fun overall.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Twelvepack wrote:
Are you really supposed to read what he is saying, when you can hardly see your own character, and 2 level 9 computers are busy jumping up your ass, superman style?
Well, in that case, you could always stand behind him, since he absorbs all projectiles that hit him. Seriously, you're jumping the gun on judging things.
CtrlAltDestroy wrote:
Melee never had the "freeze for a second due to super-powerful attack" effect that Brawl does. I personally like games without that effect.
My sister played again today, and she got: Munchlax, Munchlax, Munchlax, Munchlax, Weevil, Munchlax, in that order. I'm not joking. (This was in Training mode, by the way, and she was continually spawning Poke-balls, but still.)
Go use Pikachu's Thunderbolt, Ganondorf's Warlock Punch, G&W's 9, etc. in Melee, and you will see the same tiny pause that is prevalent in Brawl. Sure, it's a bit more defined by certain attacks in Brawl (looking at you, Zelda), but it's always been a part of the series.
I think something is seriously wrong with your game if you're getting those pokemon drop sets. I don't think I've ever seen the same pokemon show up more than 3 times in a match, and I've never seen two of the same kind in a row.
5. My sister played again today, and she got: Munchlax, Munchlax, Munchlax, Munchlax, Weevil, Munchlax, in that order. I'm not joking. (This was in Training mode, by the way, and she was continually spawning Poke-balls, but still.)
Did anybody else specifically try the training mode for that? It seems that CtrlAltDestroy is saying that part for a reason... All I have seen so far in the replies is that "oh, that never seems to happen to me during a match." I would try testing this in training mode myself, but I cannot play Brawl until tomorrow...
Also, have you experienced this lack of randomness during a match instead of just in training mode, CtrlAltDestroy? If you have, then that would definitely indicate that something is wrong based on information given by others already.
(I'm just trying to help organize this part of the discussion...)
<ccfreak2k> There is no 'ctrl' button on DeHackEd's computer. DeHackEd is always in control.
Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
Boco wrote:
And Snake is a fun and playable character even if Sonic's really not.
Funny you should say that, I found the opposite to be true. I guess I don't really know how to play snake, his moves are the right combination of gimmicky and slow that all I ever seem to get is smacked in the face.
Sonic on the other hand is fast and responsive. Granted his B moves are mostly trash, but his normal a attacks and throw are good enough to make him usable.
Wat is really strange to me is that bowser seems almost playable as well. Slow as he ever was, but it seems he hits harder, and is harder to kill then before! and whats more, he gets style point for sure. Got to love the white shell.
4: Melee never had the "freeze for a second due to super-powerful attack" effect that Brawl does. I personally like games without that effect.
Melee had hitstop on a lot of attacks. Samus' charged beam, Mr. G&W 9 Judgement hammer, Ganondorf's stomp etc. It's a lot more pronounced in Brawl, with attacks like Ganondorf's stomp, C. Falcon's knee and Zelda's kicks being some nasty offenders.
Zurreco wrote:
Sheik is at least 1/3 slower than before, and the transformation takes almost 3 times as long. That's not to mention a few other things that would be considered nerfing Zelda/Shiek, which is fine.
The entire game is pretty much 30% slower then Melee, so either Sheik is a snail or she's just following trends. Also, her new tilts are insane, so she's not bad even with the nerfs. But yeah, the new transformation is horrible. You better stick to just one of the characters, switching midbattle means a free combo for the opponent.
Jigglypuff was overpowered in Melee. She is right where she needs to be right now.
Huh? Puff was never all that good. Weaving, stalling, being annoying, yeah. Great in teams, sure. But overpowered? Far from it.
thegreginator wrote:
some are terrible (DK)
Where's your rhytm, son?
thegreginator wrote:
I dont like the absence of wavedashing but the absence of chain throwing is a good thing.
This combined with the automatic sweetspotting and the fact that it takes much more percent to kill someone make edgeguarding a much bigger part of the game, which I like.
I was getting the impression that edgeguarding mattered less with both the new autosweetspotting (there's no guessing whether he'll aim for sweetspotting or not anymore. You can aim for as much recovery as possible and sweetspot at the same time) and with the ridicolous buffs to recovery (can't edgeguard people who can come to the middle of the stage from one of the edges).
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 1978
Location: Making an escape
I went out and bought me a used Gamecube controller for the express purpose of playing this game. I'm glad I did: I feel like I can actually play this now! As such, my already rather high opinions of this game have been boosted dramatically.
Oh, before I got the controller, I tried a demo station using the sideways scheme. My impressions: If they're going to make a DS version anytime soon, they'll have to do something drastic to the gameplay, or at least with some of the timing. Main issue was the double tapping: it seemed you had to be WAY fast with it to get it to work. Mashing "down" to fall through a platform and not succeeding is not fun.
But yeah, this game is great, Norfair notwithstanding! (future stage impressions will come later)
Oh, I have to agree with CAD on the Pokéball issue. During my time playing non-training modes, Munchlax and some four-legged stomping thing came out in disproportionate amounts.
And one last thing: DK rocks now! Man, has he been buffed.
IronSlayer: Sorry to have let you down. I agree, we were both being rather childish. I probably shouldn't have posted that story; I'm most likely the bigger offender right now because of that. He and I seem to be cool now.
A hundred years from now, they will gaze upon my work and marvel at my skills but never know my name. And that will be good enough for me.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Ferret Warlord wrote:
If they're going to make a DS version anytime soon, they'll have to do something drastic to the gameplay, or at least with some of the timing.
How so? I figure it would handle just like playing Brawl with a Classic Controller, save a few button remaps and the need to justify tilts for the Dpad. Putting grabs on Y (since you don't NEED two jump buttons and no one really does R+A, right?) would solve the lack of Z, taunts on tapping, and holding L would access tilt attacks. Seems to cover everything, right?
My impressions: If they're going to make a DS version anytime soon, they'll have to do something drastic to the gameplay, or at least with some of the timing. Main issue was the double tapping: it seemed you had to be WAY fast with it to get it to work. Mashing "down" to fall through a platform and not succeeding is not fun.
The Wiimote's d-pad is rather horrible though, while the DS' is quite alright, so it wouldn't be just as bad.
Zurreco wrote:
Ferret Warlord wrote:
If they're going to make a DS version anytime soon, they'll have to do something drastic to the gameplay, or at least with some of the timing.
How so? I figure it would handle just like playing Brawl with a Classic Controller, save a few button remaps and the need to justify tilts for the Dpad. Putting grabs on Y (since you don't NEED two jump buttons and no one really does R+A, right?) would solve the lack of Z, taunts on tapping, and holding L would access tilt attacks. Seems to cover everything, right?
R+A is for shieldgrabbing, but otherwise, yeah, sounds like a great controlscheme. It would perhaps be a bit clunky with fast aerials, but as a draft, it doesn't sound bad at all.
Joined: 10/27/2004
Posts: 1978
Location: Making an escape
I would think "Select" would be better for taunting. There's no real need to have 3.
D-Pad: One tap for tilt, double tap for "tapping" (for smashes and jumps and stuff). Of course, I'd personally disable the d-pad for jumping since I wouldn't use it for that and it would just get in the way of attacking.
L for shield, R for grab.
I guess it could work. Just make the timing on the double tap a little more lenient than it stands in Brawl.
So yeah, maybe I spoke too soon. Wiimote just sucks for this game. Worse than Wimote + nunchuck.
A hundred years from now, they will gaze upon my work and marvel at my skills but never know my name. And that will be good enough for me.
Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
On a side note, the fact they finally allowed us to customize the controls is a huge plus in my book. Turning off "Up to jump" has been a fantasy of mine for years.
On a side note, the fact they finally allowed us to customize the controls is a huge plus in my book. Turning off "Up to jump" has been a fantasy of mine for years.
Really? That's cool. In Melee I sometimes liked to play Ganondorf, and he had this really powerful charge kick attack that could knock out someone at 0%, but it was an up+a attack and it was a bit difficult moving the stick slow enough for him not to jump kick instead.
One way to tell Brawl is amazing.... I haven't been on the site in two days. Well, I guess that means time to get back to SMAS and Mother 3. Well..... maybe after a couple matches. *zooms away leaving the post still up*
Ferret Warlord wrote:
During my time playing non-training modes, Munchlax and some four-legged stomping thing came out in disproportionate amounts.
Yeah, Munchlax, Metagross, and Gulpn have been most common for me. Along with Latios (not Latias) and Gardevoir for an odd reason.
Final Destination has left me many times saying, "DAMN YOU FOX, SENDING SAKI/GRAY FOX/EXCITEBIKES ON ME!"
The only stage i need still is 75m.
EDIT: WE FOUND A HIDDEN MICKEY! (the three circled things you find on bars of soap at Walt Disney World) It's at the top-right corner of the Events screen.
See Youtube page (GIRfanaticTAS) for all runs and stuff.
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
I rented it and played for 3 hours with a friend who doesn't own a Wii. He had trouble with the controller again. He thinks it's overly complicated and I make fun of him because he looks like a monkey from the 2001 film trying to understand the bone.
About the game, I really liked the sub-space emissary, yeah. And the whole 'trophy/sticker hunting' thing is something really needed in a SSB game.
Overall I liked it, I think I'm gonna have to buy this one, along with DBZBT3.
