Alright, first question: more hits or more damage?
Neither.
There are a lot of "mosts" that i would take over either of those. I'd definitely rank "most stylish" or "most innovative" or "most technically adept" way over and above "most hits" or "most damage."
In fact, if you take a look at my Guile video, you'll notice that the best combos are very rarely the 100% combos. In fact the same trend applies to just about every advanced combovid. Take a look at kysg 3S videos, which always include death combos, but they're almost never as interesting as the non-100% combos. He also has some combos where he's clearly going for the highest number of hits, but again, they're rarely the most interesting combos.
The only exception to this rule is games where damage is very high by default. For example, damn near every combo causes dizzy in the SF2 series, so it's easy to turn anything into a 100% combo.
You should just adopt kysg's approach and put the high damage combos in their own category. Like at the end of the video or something. Try not to repeat any concept or combo element too many times in the video. Whatever you can make into a 100% combo, save it for a 100% combo. Whatever can't be incorporated into a 100% combo whatsoever, find another objective. In most cases those will end up being more interesting than the 100% combos.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
Alright, first question: more hits or more damage?
Neither.
There are a lot of "mosts" that i would take over either of those. I'd definitely rank "most stylish" or "most innovative" or "most technically adept" way over and above "most hits" or "most damage."
Ah, but I didn't say most. I said more. :)
I see what you're getting at though. The focus should be on doing unexpected/unusual/difficult things rather than being explicitly concerned with the result of those things. Well I didn't quite say that right but I think I get it :) Normal gameplay concerns are irrelevant.
Yeah it's all a matter of context. One way or another, every combo will impose its own objective. If you're using a lot of multi-hit moves then the objective usually turns into "most hits." If you're really close to 100% damage (or otherwise getting obscene damage), the objective becomes maximizing that damage.
However, that's really only two combos per video. Once you find the highest hit count for Ryu and the most damaging combo for Ryu, your third Ryu combo needs a new objective. Then it becomes a matter of doing unexpected things, like putting a Dragon Punch in the middle of a combo instead of the end. Or getting one more juggle hit over the established limit. Or putting as many fireballs as possible in one combo. Or using every one of his special moves in a combo. At this point it's perfectly acceptable (even preferable) to sacrifice a two-hit finisher for a one-hit move that's more difficult to connect or more stylish.
You're always going for the "most awesome" combo but the interpretation of that changes from one situation to the next. And like i said, the combos usually tend to get more interesting once you get away from "most hits" or "most damage."
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
Well, I got distracted after finding out that the sequel to Asura Blade, called Asura Buster, now worked in MAME. So after playing it a bit and finding even less combo videos for it than Asura Blade, I made a very short video for it instead: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LRx2freFxgw
I'm still interested in making longer videos for both games, eventually.
Question, should you come back to this thread, Maj: how long did it take you to put your Guile video together?
Cool vid. Short, but it looks good. I dunno anything about how the game system works but i like the combo near the middle where you're standing directly underneath the opponent and juggling them back and forth using backwards facing jabs.
That Guile video took a long time. Like a year to capture all the footage and about a month to edit it all together. It was kind of a big deal, and i had to learn a lot of games that i wasn't particularly familiar with beforehand.
Most 3-minute videos take me like a month or two. Here are some of my older videos that were made before i obtained programmable controllers:
CvS2 Guile Exhibition (Addendum) - a little over a month
CvS Ryu Expert Link Combos - two weeks
CvS2 Reversal Combo Exhibition - about two months
Usually depends on the depth/difficulty of the content, the length of the video, and how elaborate i want to make the editing.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
Cool vid. Short, but it looks good. I dunno anything about how the game system works but i like the combo near the middle where you're standing directly underneath the opponent and juggling them back
and forth using backwards facing jabs.
Thank you! That part with the back and forth jabs probably doesn't look too difficult but getting the positioning and timing right was a nightmare, even going frame-by-frame. I'm glad I stuck with it though because it's one of my favourite parts.
The rest of the video I tried to always be doing things that aren't typically found in normal gameplay and to bend a few rules. For instance after 3 launcher-type moves, no more attacks are supposed to hit, but I get past that in the 1st and last clip. I'm sure the game can be pushed much further but I think it's a good start. I wish I could've made it longer but I thought better to quit early than risk getting too repetitive. A longer one will take much more planning.
Maj wrote:
That Guile video took a long time. Like a year to capture all the footage and about a month to edit it all together. It was kind of a big deal, and i had to learn a lot of games that i wasn't particularly familiar with beforehand.
It definitely feels like a "big deal" video. I've watched it several times and I keep catching new things each time. That's really interesting to know that you included games you didn't know well, actually. Anyhow, the editing is superb; I generally favour minimal editing but that's because I feel many people aren't capable of overly enhancing the presentation without the editing and effects getting in the way.
Maj wrote:
Most 3-minute videos take me like a month or two. Here are some of my older videos that were made before i obtained programmable controllers:
CvS2 Guile Exhibition (Addendum) - a little over a month
CvS Ryu Expert Link Combos - two weeks
CvS2 Reversal Combo Exhibition - about two months
Usually depends on the depth/difficulty of the content, the length of the video, and how elaborate i want to make the editing.
Wow, how on earth do you do reversal combo videos without tool-assistance? Also, if you don't mind sharing some more, how many hours does "a month" translate to, roughly? Making my video took even more time than I thought it would, even though I do feel like it was worth it and am looking forward to when I have the time to work on something longer.
Thank you! That part with the back and forth jabs probably doesn't look too difficult but getting the positioning and timing right was a nightmare, even going frame-by-frame. I'm glad I stuck with it though because it's one of my favourite parts.
That sort of thing has become a favorite trick of Tekken combo video makers, but you don't see it very often in 2D games. It's definitely cool to watch though. I can understand the concern about repetitiveness though, and yeah, advance planning is the only solution.
plusmins wrote:
Wow, how on earth do you do reversal combo videos without tool-assistance? Also, if you don't mind sharing some more, how many hours does "a month" translate to, roughly? Making my video took even more time than I thought it would, even though I do feel like it was worth it and am looking forward to when I have the time to work on something longer.
Some of them required simple enough opponent interaction that i could get away with pressing the buttons on the other controller. Most of them required assistance from a sibling or a roommate or whoever happened to be nearby. Some of them weren't too difficult but a few of them took forever to pull off. Making combo videos by hand is still tool-assisted in a way. You're basically rerecording the sequence over and over until you get better at it and/or get lucky once. The only difference is that you're rerecording from the very beginning every time and it's more time-consuming because you have to set everything up every time.
Those three time frames i quoted were basically how long it took to make the video utilizing nearly all of my free time - evenings, weekends, late nights, whatever i could manage. If you notice, most of my CvS2 videos were made when the game was relatively new. So when i discovered something interesting, there was always an urgency to make a video and release it before someone else found it too.
However, the further you get from the game's release date, the more lenient it becomes. Most of the games used in SF? Guile Exhibition are well over 10 years old, so there wasn't as much urgency. In fact i took a few fairly large breaks from it. The beginning and end dates are listed in the credits segment, but i took breaks for a couple of months at least. The intensive thing was that my goal was to impress everyone who ever impressed me with a video, especially since this was going to be my first tool-assisted video so there would be no excuses if it wasn't up to par.
You know, there's always a tradeoff. If you're working on an old game, there's less pressure from competition but it's more time consuming to find something new. Also, adding a deadline can cause a lot of extra stress, but sometimes it's worth it.
As far as trying games that i didn't know - that just meant i had to learn them. I definitely didn't want to compromise the overall quality of the video simply to include more filler, so the SFTM, SvCC, CFE, etc. combos had to be good too. It's not too hard if you know where to look. It can be a bit intimidating walking into someone else's territory, but at the same time everyone has their own individual background and thought processes. So even if i can't top kysg's best combos, the differences in our styles will lead to at least a couple of combos that he never thought of trying. Anyway i'm gonna quit talking before i start trying to quantify insight cuz that'd be completely pointless.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
This is what happens when Kobe bows out of every All-Star event at the last moment and i've got nothing but boredom going on for two days:
A Tribute To TZW: The Original Combo Maestro
It's basically a highlight video so some of you will recognize every last clip. Hopefully you'll find it enjoyable though.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
I was thoroughly impressed with your Guile exhibition. I especially liked the counter-breaking combo during SFTM. Just have one question, though: During the last CvS2 fight (where you were using N-Groove), how were you able to use Sonic Hurricane with only one sphere stocked?
I was thoroughly impressed with your Guile exhibition. I especially liked the counter-breaking combo during SFTM. Just have one question, though: During the last CvS2 fight (where you were using N-Groove), how were you able to use Sonic Hurricane with only one sphere stocked?
In N-Groove, to use a Level 3 super, you need to 'activate' before using the super. He activates at 12:05.
Thanks dude, glad you liked the video. In that last CvS2 clip, Guile starts with around one and a half meters, but ends up with exactly two spheres by the time Kyosuke gets dizzy. Jump back, activate, LP Sonic Boom, chase after it and combo into Sonic Hurricane.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
Dunno if anyone will find these helpful but i wrote a couple of articles about making combo videos:
SF Combo Construction EssentialsSF Combo System Interpretation
It's nothing earth-shaking but i think someone needed to put it in writing. I've got two more articles in mind which should be more concrete.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
Two more articles ...
SF2 Engine Randomness Rundown
Explains a lot of the random occurances that come up in SF2 series games. Many of them are useful for TAS and TACV purposes.
Also, i finally wrote an article that explains some of the charge tricks used in my Guile video:
SF Charge Conventions
It covers all the basics, but i left out a lot of subtle stuff to keep it general. If two other people find this interesting, i will consider it a grand success.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
This is kind of a big deal.
Includes Servbot paper airplane combos! And an icefist falling out of the sky that nobody can explain.
Made with programmable controllers, so it qualifies as tool-assisted.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
Wow. That was a nice video.
I think joo is correct in what he said about the general public not appreciating the work. However, it might also be bad for the community if one person holds on to information without sharing it.
Yeah i know nothing about Samurai Shodown but i thought this was pretty cool:
Samurai Shodown 4 - Bust Basara Tool-Assisted Beatdown by Xenozip
It's not quite a speedrun, more of an entertainment show. Lots of toying with poor AI. Ignore the lifebars cuz blurtube is murder on SNK's love of flickering.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
Not exactly new, but it's too good to have only 333 views:
NKI Volume XI (shown at Evo2k8) | download link
It's a tool-assisted X-Men vs Street Fighter combo video with lots of cool-looking glitches and a minute-long Magneto/Storm combo at the end. And the giant floating head of Apocalypse.
My favorite clips are the Ryu/Juggernaut combo at 5:53 and the Magneto/Sabretooth alpha counter combo at 6:06.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
Joined: 10/11/2008
Posts: 64
Location: Kajaani, Finland
But how about Tony Hawk? You could make a billions of combo in them? Like emu's TAS, it has a combo of like 1 billion, but what about a video, which would be only, and just for comboing, and getting like 999 BILLION combo? Interest anyone? =p
I'd watch it. But i've never actually played one of those games before so i'm not the droids you're looking for.
This is kinda barely on topic one sense while at the same time being completely on topic in other ways. I've started sharing my held-secret-for-too-long love of fighting game screenshots with the fighting game community. Rather than clutter up this forum with another thread, i'll just point you guys to the already active thread on SRK:
Majestic Screenshot Gallery
Updated every Tuesday and Friday!
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
The guy responsible for those Meikyoshisui MvC2 tool-assisted combovids has just released the trailer for his combo DVD, which he's been working on for five years or something crazy like that.
MvC2 - Joo's DVD Trailer (downloadable high quality files plus transcript)
Joo's DVD Preview (blurtube version)
Crazy good content.
http://sonichurricane.com
Tuesday = new technical/combo video/article | Thursday = new screenshot | Saturday = new strategy article
