Even if his attitude is abrasive, the questions are worth asking, and answering. At least let the record of them remain.
There are two reasons why I disagree:
1) From his way of writing it's quite clear that he doesn't want to honestly discuss about these things, he only wants to attack other people's faith, he wants to troll. This means that answering the questions is useless: He won't read the answers. And by "read" I mean "try to honestly, without strong prejudices, to understand what the other person is saying, without the pre-intention to nitpick about every single detail". He basically just wants a flamewar, not answers to his questions. His wording makes it quite clear.
2) As I commented earlier in the thread, these questions have been asked and answered a million times during past centuries already. There's little point in repeating all that here. I'm sure that if anyone honestly wants to know what has been said about them (which I highly doubt is the case with xebra) they can do a google search.
(With point 2 I don't mean that anyone should automatically accept the answers given to the questions. My point is that it would be useless to repeat the same answers here.)
Answering these trolling question is only going to cause this thread to become an endless flamewar. It's useless. Skip it.
Even if his attitude is abrasive, the questions are worth asking, and answering. At least let the record of them remain.
There are two reasons why I disagree:
1) From his way of writing it's quite clear that he doesn't want to honestly discuss about these things, he only wants to attack other people's faith, he wants to troll. This means that answering the questions is useless: He won't read the answers. And by "read" I mean "try to honestly, without strong prejudices, to understand what the other person is saying, without the pre-intention to nitpick about every single detail". He basically just wants a flamewar, not answers to his questions. His wording makes it quite clear.
By this logic, the questions would be worth answering if they had been asked by anyone besides xebra. This is specious -- a question is of the same merit no matter the person who asks it, or the attitude it is asked in.
And if, as you say, his attitude makes it clear he wants a flamewar, let me ask you this:
Of the following two courses of action, which do you feel is more likely to initiate/perpetuate a flamewar:
Giving a polite and honest answer to a question that was asked in a rude manner.
Ignoring a question and hurling insults at the person who asked it.
I would also remind you that, even if you assume xebra himself is uninterested in the answers, that does not preclude the existence of people who are curious about them.
Warp wrote:
2) As I commented earlier in the thread, these questions have been asked and answered a million times during past centuries already. There's little point in repeating all that here. I'm sure that if anyone honestly wants to know what has been said about them (which I highly doubt is the case with xebra) they can do a google search.
And everytime they're answered, they're answered differently. Because it is a question regarding an individual's unique perspective.
Xebra was asking specifically for Bisqwit's perspectives. Bisqwit's perspectives have certainly not been asked after, and explained, millions of times over the past centuries.
In fact, I haven't seen Bisqwit even attempt to answer these questions even once. I am curious about his unique perspectives on the issue. (Though I wish to make it clear that bear Bisqwit no ill will)
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
By this logic, the questions would be worth answering if they had been asked by anyone besides xebra.
No, I wrote it as an *additional* good reason not to answer them. Reason number 2 would all in itself be enough, IMO.
Of course, I'm still fuzzy as to how answering questions as asked is more likely to trigger a flamewar than ignoring the questions and insulting the asker.
He was insulted because of his derogatory style and his use of insulting words, especially when writing about something which is important to some people.
Xebra was asking specifically for bisqwit's perspectives.
Personally I doubt that. Sure, he addressed the questions to him, but IMO not because he wanted to know Bisqwit's opinion specifically, but just as a generic attack on christianity. Bisqwit was simply a handy target for an attack when he expressed his fait in this kind of thread.
Of course, I'm still fuzzy as to how answering questions as asked is more likely to trigger a flamewar than ignoring the questions and insulting the asker.
He was insulted because of his derogatory style and his use of insulting words, especially when writing about something which is important to some people.
I did not ask why he was insulted. I asked how you expect ignoring his question and insulting him to be less contributory to the flamewar than politely and honestly answering the question.
Or are you saying that you share Xebra's purpose of wishing to instigate a flamewar in this thread?
Also, I did some fairly substantial rephrasing/clarification in an edit that you seem to have missed.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Okay here is the thing with xebra. He is pissed off because Bisqwit rejected his Wonderboy run, which was emulated through GBA. And yes, he is trolling. He once asked in irc (I was there too) if he should ask a offensive question to Bisqwit or something like that which he knew would not result in a constructive and positive atmosphere to this topic.
Edit: sorry for hijacking this thread Bisq. Go ahead and answer more questions!
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
What is your personal favorite chapter/verse/other length of excerpt from the Bible?
Genesis 6:4 "There were giants in the earth in those days; and also after that, when the sons of God came in unto the daughters of men, and they bare children to them, the same became mighty men which were of old, men of renown."
Huh, I always thought that Jesus preached tolerance even of those who would harm you.
But xebra wasn't harming me. ;)
Don't think Jesus said never to do anything. When he noticed that people had turned a temple into a marketplace, Jesus didn't just passively watch from side but rushed there, threw the tables down, opened cages in which animals were kept, made a whip out of some ropes and expelled the sellers, and shouted how people have made his Father's room into a robbers' lair!
And, I am being WAY too tolerant with xebra already. I should have perm-banned him already when he started his hoodlum edits shortly after I submitted Star Control II. And it doesn't seem like he has gotten any more respectful after that either.
Huh, I always thought that Jesus preached tolerance even of those who would harm you.
But xebra wasn't harming me. ;)
If xebra wasn't harming you, then what was the cause for banning him? I am now totally confused.
Bisqwit wrote:
Don't think Jesus said never to do anything. When he noticed that people had turned a temple into a marketplace, Jesus didn't just passively watch from side but rushed there, threw the tables down, opened cages in which animals were kept, made a whip out of some ropes and expelled the sellers, and shouted how people have made his Father's room into a robbers' lair!
I am familiar with that incident. Jesus was upset because the rabbis, who should have been offering spiritual guidance to the masses, were instead using their status to profit off of the masses. The standard english translation is "den of thieves".
By comparison, Jesus never took action against the Romans, who blatantly enslaved and murdered his people. In fact, he did not even bar Roman soldiers from seeking his guidance. The same Roman soldiers who were directly responsible for his people being oppressed solely due to their faith, could ask advice of him, and be treated with respect. They were not bannished from his presence for being disrespectful.
Bisqwit wrote:
And, I am being WAY too tolerant with xebra already. I should have perm-banned him already when he started his hoodlum edits shortly after I submitted Star Control II. And it doesn't seem like he has gotten any more respectful after that either.
Why should stating that one has a disagreement with the site administration be a bannable offense?
I'll admit that it was not the most mature way for him to deal with the issue, but I would expect you to be tolerant, and try to work through the problem in a mature and reasonable fashion rather than jumping to a ban.
From my perspective, both sides has been lacking in tact and maturity when dealing with this situation. The reason I am taking issue with your behavior, and not xebra's, is because you have the power to ban, and are threatening to use it. Xebra only has the power to make statements, which can do no harm to anyone unless they allow those statements to bother them.
And, apart from xebra's abrasive behavior when asking questions about your faith, he can and does make positive contributions to the forum.
If you were to ban xebra for this, you would reasonably have to ban phil, jxq, xkeeper, zurreco, warp, and myself, who have each at times been more abrasive in behavior than xebra currently is.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
If you were to ban xebra for this, you would reasonably have to ban phil, jxq, xkeeper, zurreco, warp, and myself, who have each at times been more abrasive in behavior than xebra currently is.
I don't remember ever insulting someone's religious faith with swearwords.
I wouldn't mind if all of xebra's fanatic anti-christianity posts were nuked, as well as all the posts he makes protesting about the fact.
Warp wrote:
upthorn wrote:
If you were to ban xebra for this, you would reasonably have to ban phil, jxq, xkeeper, zurreco, warp, and myself, who have each at times been more abrasive in behavior than xebra currently is.
I don't remember ever insulting someone's religious faith with swearwords.
That is not the only way to be abrasive or detrimental to a forum environment. For instance, just last night you directly insulted xebra in some pretty strong terms. Some might argue that
Warp wrote:
I wouldn't mind if all of xebra's fanatic anti-christianity posts were nuked, as well as all the posts he makes protesting about the fact.
is even worse, than insulting a person with swearwords. After all, insulting a person with swearwords can only harm that person's ego. Whereas calling for action to be taken against that person can result in more dire effects.
And I don't believe this is the first time you've directed such strong statements against someone.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
Upthorn, you have truly pissed me off, completely. But I am not going to swear or be rude. But I will ask you this, are you seriously wondering what reasons Bisqwit have to ban xebra? There have been lots of situations when I, Zurreco, Phil, Fabian etc have used strong language but I certainly do not recall being anywhere near to xebras level. Oh man I need to calm down and take a deep breathe because your post... :(
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Upthorn, you have truly pissed me off, completely. But I am not going to swear or be rude. But I will ask you this, are you seriously wondering what reasons Bisqwit have to ban xebra? There have been lots of situations when I, Zurreco, Phil, Fabian etc have used strong language but I certainly do not recall being anywhere near to xebras level. Oh man I need to calm down and take a deep breathe because your post... :(
xebra was being rude and insulting, but he wasn't using strong language. Honestly, I don't think he should have been banned, but I'm not admin.
Build a man a fire, warm him for a day,
Set a man on fire, warm him for the rest of his life.
Yeah I'm with Upthorn on this one. If Bisqwit starts a thread inviting theological discussion, and even says he doesn't mind strongly worded questions (I can't recall the exact wording but it's in there somewhere before xebra's first post), I think this is to be expected and I think it's not very reasonable to ban xebra for it. Also like Upthorn said if it didn't hurt you Bisqwit then all that's left is xebra being rude and being rude has never been a bannable offense here. It's a pretty strong overreaction imo, and though it's not surprising (it's happened before a few times) I still think it's kinda wrong.
There have been lots of situations when I, Zurreco, Phil, Fabian etc have used strong language but I certainly do not recall being anywhere near to xebras level.
I suspect that the real reason many people are getting so riled up is that I'm talking unkindly about religion, and Bisqwit specifically because I seem to be focusing on his (one true) religion. I was much more unreasonable with JXQ in the Sonic 1 thread -- I wasn't even making points worthy of discussion! -- but no one really cared, and we worked it out in the end, the way grown men do.
Ask yourself this: would anyone be pissed off if I had been inflammatory toward Scientology? Would Bisqwit have banned me for cursing Tom Cruise, or if the Jesus Christ account had been named Xenu? Perhaps people should examine their own deficiencies before damning me for mine.
Actually, I think that quality of the original thread was diminished by people yelling at xebra much more so than just by xebra's posts. Even though pretty much everyone who ended up in this splitoff against xebra was eager to call him a troll, they failed to comply to the first rule of dealing with trolls: don't feed them.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
By hereby splitting those posts into a different thread I hope to have improved the quality of that original thread.
There's little chance of that, as this discussion was the only potentially interesting thing in that thread to begin with. And if I may be so bold as to ask, mein fuhrer, why split off these posts if you are just going to delete them? You may be fooling yourself about your reasons, but you aren't fooling your God.
