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Posted: 7/5/2007 6:29 PM
(Edited: 7/4/2008 12:57 PM)
Post subject: Sonic 1 Megamix
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DDRKhat
Player (37)
Joined: 9/9/2006
Posts: 388
This will be the "official" topic for all runs to do with the On-going fan-hack Sonic 1 Megamix by Team Megamix. This first post is simply a catalog of all recordings done by users and for which Megamix. It is requested that new recorders of this hack start their recording from a blank SRM file (the linked file is a hex-edited SRM file with all settings to default, put this in your gens folder and set it to read-only, to prevent desyncs) and adjust the preferences in the recording. Any recordings which require pre-set settings will be labeled appropriately (This is due to recovery from the previous Topic) This file will set the settings for marked runs, remember to watch this recording on a blank SRM file Any recordings that are faster than the current will be posted up first, and all recordings that are beaten will fall into the archive category, so viewers can see what we have come from. They shall also fall into TWO categories.. "All Emeralds" and "No Emeralds" +Sonic 1 Megamix 2.0+ Theoretically no runs from this version should be done, however if they are, for whatever reason, they will be accepted. +Sonic 1 Megamix 3.0+ --All Emeralds-- [Sonic] Playtime: 19m 25.53s Player: Fano & DDRkhat) [Shadow] Playtime: 20m 59s Player: emu (Requires Pre-Config) [Mighty] Playtime: 27m 44s Player: DDRKhat --No Emeralds-- [Sonic] Not Done [Shadow] Not Done [Mighty] Not Done +Archive+ [Sonic] Playtime: 30m 53s Player: DDRKhat (Requires Pre-Config) [Mighty] Playtime: 31m 4s Player: DDRKhat (Requires Pre-Config) --Known Tricks-- Robotnik Monitor Evasion - This glitch is performed by making the character invincible as the monitor is about to strike. Without lag-count, the monitor takes 28 frames to take effect (I believe this is true to ALL monitors? No idea, was only counting this..) This can be done by, for example, using light-dash with Sonic on frame 25/28 (cause it takes 2 frames to become invincible). Mighty's Rapi-Shield - This can only be performed while playing as Mighty. This also requires 2 or more shields. While possessing two-or-more shields, you can switch between them at the cost of 5 rings by pressing A. If you do this while in-air twice in succession, you can re-perform a shield ability, such as a double-spark shield jump.
A whisper in the wind~~
Posted: 7/5/2007 6:33 PM
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P.JBoy
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Joined: 3/25/2006
Posts: 850
Location: stuck in Pandora's box HELLPP!!!
That hack is still in progress (or at least it should be, there are some bugs). I don't think it should be TASed until it's definatly complete :-)
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:33 PM
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nesrocks
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Player (246)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
This is by far the best hack I've ever seen. I'd like to see a TAS of it when it's finished.
aka Nesrocks http://www.youtube.com/user/UoBtExFODA https://nesrocks.com https://twitter.com/bitinkstudios
Posted: 7/5/2007 7:50 PM
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DDRKhat
Player (37)
Joined: 9/9/2006
Posts: 388
Perhaps Nitsuja could take ahold of the project and see what he could do with it. Long as it doesn't break the game too much I'd love to see him go through some of the levels :)
A whisper in the wind~~
Posted: 7/5/2007 8:02 PM
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Raiscan
Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom
I'm playing it through now as Shadow. It seems very well made and interesting, but there are a few bugs in it that can be problematic (Springs not working) and it would probably require lots of lag handling, though that will be easier thanks to Upthorn's new version of Gens. I'll edit this post later for any interesting quirks I descover.
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
Posted: 7/5/2007 8:16 PM
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N._Harmonik
She/Her
Joined: 8/27/2006
Posts: 502
Location: Canada
P.JBoy wrote:
That hack is still in progress (or at least it should be, there are some bugs). I don't think it should be TASed until it's definatly complete :-)
Like completed games don't have bugs?
Why, oh, why do I even <i>try</i> to understand my own species?
Posted: 7/5/2007 8:19 PM
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P.JBoy
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Joined: 3/25/2006
Posts: 850
Location: stuck in Pandora's box HELLPP!!!
N. Harmonik wrote:
P.JBoy wrote:
That hack is still in progress (or at least it should be, there are some bugs). I don't think it should be TASed until it's definatly complete :-)
Like completed games don't have bugs?
Not to mention Lag
Posted: 7/5/2007 8:24 PM
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DDRKhat
Player (37)
Joined: 9/9/2006
Posts: 388
P.JBoy wrote:
N. Harmonik wrote:
P.JBoy wrote:
That hack is still in progress (or at least it should be, there are some bugs). I don't think it should be TASed until it's definatly complete :-)
Like completed games don't have bugs?
Not to mention Lag
If you view my test-run TAS then you will notice the lag when it comes to the "Labyrinth" zone area. although it is alot more minimal then an actual player. It also gives a good example of the "shoot self into wall dash" glitch on the 2nd-to-last zone.
A whisper in the wind~~
Posted: 7/5/2007 11:29 PM
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upthorn
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Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
Sega TAS of 2011 Sega TAS of 2010 Sega TAS of 2008 Sega TASer of 2007
1) The hack is far from finished. 2) I have been making tools specifically for it as work on it progresses.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Posted: 7/5/2007 11:37 PM
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Wockes
Joined: 5/17/2007
Posts: 393
Location: Sweden
Don't forget that you can get stuck when completing the first labyrinth zone.. Try dashing to the left after completing the level. Still it's a kick as* game
"No love for the game gear"
Posted: 7/6/2007 12:07 AM
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r0xm2n
Joined: 3/5/2007
Posts: 27
I was waiting for someone to bring this hack up. A TAS of this hack would be more entertaining then most other sonic TAS's combined (or about as equal as the S3k one). Also, it would overall be as fast as a sonic advance tas. The lightdash can be used in interesting ways. Also, due to how easy it is to get very high speeds (no speed cap), zipping should be very easy, jumping over whole levels via slopes should be easy. That's when sonic is not simply dashing through the level really quickly with his double jump move. The new Labyrinth Zone (Misty Maze) will require some crazy lag management. But yeah, some new versions of the hack are in the making, so a TAS might have to wait for now...
Posted: 7/6/2007 7:17 AM
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DDRKhat
Player (37)
Joined: 9/9/2006
Posts: 388
upthorn wrote:
1) The hack is far from finished. 2) I have been making tools specifically for it as work on it progresses.
Tools specifically for it eh? This sounds like it's gonna be a great TAS to watch :) Alright then, look forward to its final release so you can go at it :)
A whisper in the wind~~
Posted: 7/6/2007 7:11 PM
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IMPblackbelt
Joined: 6/19/2005
Posts: 180
I can't get it to work for some reason. It desyncs almost immediately. Anybody have any solutions? Just downloaded the rom yesterday...
Posted: 7/6/2007 7:44 PM
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upthorn
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Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
Sega TAS of 2011 Sega TAS of 2010 Sega TAS of 2008 Sega TASer of 2007
Since I noticed that there is a gmv linked from the first post now, I have done this video to demonstrate what a proper TAS of the first zone, with the same goals and preferences, might look like. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TWawwJDUAOg ( GMV here, for dialup users or people who just don't like youtube) Might, but probably wouldn't, since I was still somewhat sloppy, and didn't explore other possible routes much. Also, for those of you who are having desyncs (which is probably most of you), it is because the GMV linked in the first post, and the GMV linked here, too) require the camera scrolling to be set to "extended" in preferences.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Posted: 7/6/2007 7:54 PM
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IMPblackbelt
Joined: 6/19/2005
Posts: 180
Woah. Found some sort of wierd glitch at the start of Misty Maze act 3. That first really long slide at the top of the level, if you continue to hold down after you're about to land on the ground, you'll pretty much warp through the ground and be able clip through the floor. Maybe someone can see if they can manipulate this?
Posted: 7/6/2007 7:57 PM
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upthorn
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Sega TAS of 2011 Sega TAS of 2010 Sega TAS of 2008 Sega TASer of 2007
IMPblackbelt wrote:
Woah. Found some sort of wierd glitch at the start of Misty Maze act 3. That first really long slide at the top of the level, if you continue to hold down after you're about to land on the ground, you'll pretty much warp through the ground and be able clip through the floor. Maybe someone can see if they can manipulate this?
That can actually be done easily in real time. Part of the reason the current release is far from finished.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Posted: 7/6/2007 8:52 PM
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DDRKhat
Player (37)
Joined: 9/9/2006
Posts: 388
Yeah I apologise to all for that. As for your TAS upthorn. 0:14 I notice a little loss of speed on it. As for your special stage, your route is shorter but mine (when done right) is faster to get into the Emerald. As for that GENs version, looks sexy, could I get a sneak-peek at that? I wanna give the current Megamix a better temporary TAS if you wouldn't mind? Also is there any tips you can suggest for doing TASes? like how to spot exploits etc? You guys seem to do it easily and I have no idea how you find these exploits so well.
A whisper in the wind~~
Posted: 7/7/2007 1:48 AM
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r0xm2n
Joined: 3/5/2007
Posts: 27
Nice tas. I'm surprised the Midair speed dash wasn't used more, I though the SuperPeelOut would be useless for a tas (obviously not!!). But then, why was the spindash used in other spots? Also, I thought when having the speedshoes powerup, using the midair speeddash would be faster in gaining lost momentum as opposed to stopping for a superpeelout. Nice zip glitch in act2. Also the 1st time I saw the special stages tas'd, no comment except to say, it's nice to see someone breeze through those things. Obviously, an all Emerald Run won't be any less feasible or entertaining then an any% run, you finished each act with over 100+ rings, despite taking the shortest path.
Posted: 7/7/2007 2:46 AM
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upthorn
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Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
Sega TAS of 2011 Sega TAS of 2010 Sega TAS of 2008 Sega TASer of 2007
DDRKhat wrote:
0:14 I notice a little loss of speed on it. As for your special stage, your route is shorter but mine (when done right) is faster to get into the Emerald. As for that GENs version, looks sexy, could I get a sneak-peek at that? I wanna give the current Megamix a better temporary TAS if you wouldn't mind? Also is there any tips you can suggest for doing TASes? like how to spot exploits etc? You guys seem to do it easily and I have no idea how you find these exploits so well.
I am not sure what you mean about speed loss at 0:14. I might not be totally optimal in how I do it, but I'm reasonably sure that strategy of using the motobug to stop and do a spindash is good. For special stage one, your route might be faster, I'm not sure, because I haven't timed how long it takes those diamond things to lose one hp. Though I suppose I could just compare the special stage demos to each other and see which of the two routes is fastest. I probably won't be releasing the gens version, more because of perfectionism than anything else -- it works well enough for me to use, but I would feel guilty about releasing it publically in its current state.
r0xm2n wrote:
I'm surprised the Midair speed dash wasn't used more, I though the SuperPeelOut would be useless for a tas (obviously not!!). But then, why was the spindash used in other spots? Also, I thought when having the speedshoes powerup, using the midair speeddash would be faster in gaining lost momentum as opposed to stopping for a superpeelout.
Here's a list of values that might help you understand why I did what I did.
  • normal acceleration: 3/64ths pixels per frame per frame
  • Speed-shoe acceleration: 3/16ths pixels per frame per frame
  • normal top speed: 6 pixels per frame
  • Speed-shoe top speed: 12 pixels per frame
  • Airdash speed: 10 pixels per frame (note, this is not a boost, but a constant speed)
  • Perfect Spindash speed: 12 pixels per frame
  • Super peel out speed: 12 pixels per frame
  • Super peel out speed with super shoes: 16 pixels per frame
  • Super peel out charge time: ~18 frames
So basically, while you are correct that it would be to use airdash to regain lost momentum, as compared to stopping and charging a super peel out, I would be stuck at 12 pixels per frame max, instead of 16. Though you are correct that I probably do not use peel out optimally in that video, at least for as far as act 1.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Posted: 7/7/2007 5:15 AM
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r0xm2n
Joined: 3/5/2007
Posts: 27
Interesting figures there. If you're forced to slow down or stop for whatever reason, the SuperPeelOut makes sense, especially if you can maintain that 16 pixels speed over a long distance. Otherwise, it's probably not worth stopping for that 18 frame chargeup. One thing I've noticed is jumping while going downhill. If done while going fast enough, you'll sometimes be able to go faster then the screen can scroll. I think only in City Outskirts or Starry Night could you put it to positive use though.
Posted: 7/7/2007 1:27 PM
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DDRKhat
Player (37)
Joined: 9/9/2006
Posts: 388
upthorn wrote:
DDRKhat wrote:
0:14 I notice a little loss of speed on it. As for your special stage, your route is shorter but mine (when done right) is faster to get into the Emerald.
I am not sure what you mean about speed loss at 0:14. I might not be totally optimal in how I do it, but I'm reasonably sure that strategy of using the motobug to stop and do a spindash is good.
Before that you do several thwaps and do not go anywhere, you do not sound to get any speed from doing it, where as sticking to the floor would be faster. Run along into rings, use light-dash, go up the hill and at the last frame, jump through the motorbug and thwap. ("Thwap" being the air-attack, titled "Thwap" from what it sounds like)
upthorn wrote:
For special stage one, your route might be faster, I'm not sure, because I haven't timed how long it takes those diamond things to lose one hp. Though I suppose I could just compare the special stage demos to each other and see which of the two routes is fastest.
That wouldn't quite be smart as my route wasn't done optimally, you would have to sit and master my route to get a fair comparison, I admit on the 2nd special stage your route was faster.
A whisper in the wind~~
Posted: 7/7/2007 4:29 PM
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upthorn
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Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
Sega TAS of 2011 Sega TAS of 2010 Sega TAS of 2008 Sega TASer of 2007
DDRKhat wrote:
upthorn wrote:
DDRKhat wrote:
0:14 I notice a little loss of speed on it. As for your special stage, your route is shorter but mine (when done right) is faster to get into the Emerald.
I am not sure what you mean about speed loss at 0:14. I might not be totally optimal in how I do it, but I'm reasonably sure that strategy of using the motobug to stop and do a spindash is good.
Before that you do several thwaps and do not go anywhere, you do not sound to get any speed from doing it, where as sticking to the floor would be faster. Run along into rings, use light-dash, go up the hill and at the last frame, jump through the motorbug and thwap. ("Thwap" being the air-attack, titled "Thwap" from what it sounds like)
Airdash speed: 10 pixels per frame Spindash speed: 12 pixels per frame The spindash takes longer, but the extra speed is necessary in order to make the jump earlier, where I do.
ddrkhat wrote:
upthorn wrote:
For special stage one, your route might be faster, I'm not sure, because I haven't timed how long it takes those diamond things to lose one hp. Though I suppose I could just compare the special stage demos to each other and see which of the two routes is fastest.
That wouldn't quite be smart as my route wasn't done optimally, you would have to sit and master my route to get a fair comparison, I admit on the 2nd special stage your route was faster.
I mean the demos. Like, the "don't touch anything for 60 seconds and a demo starts" demos. There's a different set for each character, but all three of the special stage demos complete the first one.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Posted: 7/7/2007 8:53 PM
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Anon
Joined: 4/17/2004
Posts: 275
upthorn wrote:
Also, for those of you who are having desyncs (which is probably most of you), it is because the GMV linked in the first post, and the GMV linked here, too) require the camera scrolling to be set to "extended" in preferences.
I'm not seeing anything about any camera setting at all in Gens, much less a selection for "preferences". Something tells me that you're using an entirely different version of Gens than the ones that I have.
Posted: 7/7/2007 9:00 PM
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P.JBoy
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Location: stuck in Pandora's box HELLPP!!!
Extended in the actual preferences in the actual hack. ie. the game
Posted: 7/7/2007 9:05 PM
(Edited: 7/8/2007 12:04 AM)
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DDRKhat
Player (37)
Joined: 9/9/2006
Posts: 388
Anon wrote:
upthorn wrote:
Also, for those of you who are having desyncs (which is probably most of you), it is because the GMV linked in the first post, and the GMV linked here, too) require the camera scrolling to be set to "extended" in preferences.
I'm not seeing anything about any camera setting at all in Gens, much less a selection for "preferences". Something tells me that you're using an entirely different version of Gens than the ones that I have.
Once the game is started, press START, then press your "DOWN" button 3 times, you will see "Preferences" , press your "A" button. then a nice menu will come up, "Camera" will be in there somewhere, change it to "Megamix" Or, to make things simple, I've made a input to set it up as I had mine setup. <link> Once you've done that, then play the "TAS" I put up. make sure you delete the "Sonic 1 Megamix.srm" If there is one, in your GENS folder [Edit]I apologise, wrong one, use the revised link. otherwise It will desync later on in the movie when I get super sonic unlocked New Link: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/393145481/%5BSetup%5DSonic%201%20Megamix%20v3.gmv [/Edit]
A whisper in the wind~~
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