Skilled player (1606)
Joined: 6/11/2006
Posts: 818
Location: Arboga, Sweden
What the... That was a new one. Sigh, it will be a bitch to use that one, since it cuts off a lot of gem-hunting. Should be useful though. Nice find. Edit: Using it in level 3 saved 28 frames, HOWEVER, those might be lost during the re-run of level 4 which I am about to start today, so... well, we'll see if it will be in the next WIP or not. However, this makes up new possibilities for other levels, of course. Edit2: http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/288005138/02%20-%20Level%204%20re-done.fcm. Level 4 came out 119 frames faster than last time, so this WIP is almost 150 frames faster than the last one.
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Skilled player (1606)
Joined: 6/11/2006
Posts: 818
Location: Arboga, Sweden
Screw editing, delete-copy-paste-editing, here comes a double post http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/1604599810/04%20-%20Level%205%20done.fcm A new WIP
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Editor, Active player (297)
Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 7469
Location: Arzareth
Cardboard wrote:
A new WIP
Have you considered the duration of time it takes for Kuros to run from the treasure to the door after killing the boss? Edit: It would seem you have.
Former player
Joined: 6/25/2004
Posts: 607
Location: Maine
I've been poking him into thinking about that, so don't worry about it Bisqwit. =p
Skilled player (1606)
Joined: 6/11/2006
Posts: 818
Location: Arboga, Sweden
Actually... on some bosses, it won't matter, because the farther to the left you are keeping the battle, the faster you kill him, and the longer you have to run, and the time comes out even with keeping the battle late and far to the right. Regarding the spider boss, getting knocked down was essential to delay the actual invisibility time for Kuros. UPDATE: I redid Castle Exterior, because I found out, the hard way, that if you pick up two gems on one frame, the game only counts one. With this in mind, I redid the bonus room in CE, and left the level around 90 frames faster. I admit that I haven't been moving on as fast as I should lately, and this huge level will take a lot of time due to massive testing, but I will try to work faster. Also, this will probably not obsolete both runs. Peace. EDIT2: I finished the huge level last night. Two more bosses and the last level to go. I won't release more WIPs from this point. This last level looked stupid but can hardly be done better, and the next one will probably look even worse. Gained around 12-or-so-seconds on this level, many of them by skipping the "Jump-to-get-gems-out-of-thin-air".
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Editor, Active player (297)
Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 7469
Location: Arzareth
Have you also considered that sometimes the same gems count as one or two depending on whether you collect them with the body or with the dagger?
Skilled player (1606)
Joined: 6/11/2006
Posts: 818
Location: Arboga, Sweden
Yep, I have, except for in level 4, though... I was not really aware of it back then, but... oh well. I try to take as many gems as possible with the dagger, but some have to be taken with the body, since the dagger is too far away to take the gems/waiting would take too long time. One problem, however, is that I know of improvements in many of the early stages (Like the 2-gems-with-dagger-one-with-body-one), but... I will still submit this one, and later on redo the entire run, after finishing up a few other projects (Hex-editing is, as you might know, impossible). I feel that this run is looking good enough right now. Redoing this will be my 3rd or 4th "primary run" on the list. Also anyone wanting to redo the re-use levels run, feel free to ask me for help and/or advice as for the improvements on the earlier levels. And, I feel that W&W is a game that's better if run by 2 or more authors (Due to the randomness), so I will make noise before I start my re-run and hope for help/volunteers. I'll try to finish this run tonight. I get off work in about 5 hours, and get home and ready to TAS in about 7, so the run should be done within the next 14-or-so-hours. Wish me luck.
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Skilled player (1606)
Joined: 6/11/2006
Posts: 818
Location: Arboga, Sweden
Alright I said that I would make some noise when I decided to start the re-use levels run, and here goes. WIP1, entering the tree in level 1. 66 frames faster than the published full run up until this point. I'll try to redo some more stuff and see if I can get it any faster, if not, then I'll continue with the stage. Questions/comments/suggestions?
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Joined: 1/13/2007
Posts: 343
What every select button item does. Boots of Force. Opens chests, and does 4 bars of damage to enemies that you boot with them. Most useful one for tasing. Does NOT open doors, despite what the manual says. Boots of Lava Walk. Lets you ride the lava spout. Nothing for pressing select. May save time if used properly, but very unlikely. Horn (of valhalla): Reveals secret doors/gems by pressing select. Useless for TASing, since you already know where they are. :) Wand of Wonder: Freezes enemies with screen traversing attack. I hate this. Staff of Power. 3 bar energy attack that traverses whole screen. Good if you lost the boots of force. Cloak of darkness. Makes you invisible TO THE WIZARD MALKIL. Affects no other enemy in the game, they will still find you no trouble. CRAP
Skilled player (1606)
Joined: 6/11/2006
Posts: 818
Location: Arboga, Sweden
WIP2, randomly placed halfway through level 2. Now 72 frames faster than the recently published full-run was up until this point, so 6 frames gained in this level this far, 3 due to changed strategies when getting the second gem-chest (By opening it later, Kuros held higher speed for a longer time. Kinda) and 3 frames after getting the Potion Of Levitation due to the faster-falling trick which was not used in this level in the previous run. Edit: This game sucks so much that I am surprised that the Angry Video Game Nerd has not yet attacked it. Well the reason for my rage is the fact that I just discovered a 31 frame window between "entering door after killing boss" and "key countdown". This sucks on so many levels, and even though I entered the door after the boss in level 2 76 frames faster, I leave the level itself only 62 or 64 or whatever frames faster. Boooo. As for level 1, 18 frames would have to be gained for the frame window to change to my advantage, and I doubt that a bit right now. I do not know if this applies for the entire _level_ or just the boss fight that depends on this, but anyway... bleh. Right now, I need to gain 18-isch frames on the fight (or perhaps the entire level, iono at the moment) to actually gain frames on this level. Oh well. I will be back with more news later on. Edit XIV (No, not really): I made a slitght route change and beat the frame rule. Yay for me, so 95 ahead of the old full run at this point etc. Two more levels before the level breaking. Yay. WIPs for president! Edit again: New WIP. 192 frames ahead of the published full run at this point, so almost 100 frames gained in the level alone, due to new potion-use and a new way of abusing the wall glitch. The boss fight is also faster (13 something frames), despite having more HP. Nice frame window this time. Edit no. 1986: WIP of level 4. Like some might know, I suspected that level 4 could gain quite a nice amount of frames, and so it did, I went from 192 frames ahead to 511. You do the math. Most of the gain come from more abuse of Potions, probably. Also, the skipped gem in the last bonus room would have been pretty useless to pick up due to the not so popular double gem glitch. I had some bad luck with the enemies overall in this level, probably due to the improvements in the level. This is also the last level where I can compare to my old full run, just so you know. No more "xx frames ahead of the old run which I am not intending to obsolete just yet".
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Skilled player (1606)
Joined: 6/11/2006
Posts: 818
Location: Arboga, Sweden
Double post! Yeah! Take that! Time to improve the full TAS! Alright I've picked up this useless piece of garbage again, and basically starts where my re-use levels TAS left. This WIP here contains level 5 played the way it should be played. 128 frames faster than in the published full TAS as well \o/ I am a link. Any suggestions for the next level? Or maybe this level before I start with the next level. Keep in mind that I haven't been able to reproduce that spider killing, but could probably do it if I had to.
Warp wrote:
omg lol this is so fake!!!1 the nes cant produce music like this!
Player (147)
Joined: 11/14/2011
Posts: 68
Location: Brookline, MA
I think that now that Wizards and Warriors II and III have fresh TAS movies, it might be good to look at this first episode as well. I just verified that both of Cardboard's movies sync on FCEUX 2.2.2. The FCEUX times: All Levels - 00:12:13.72 Reuse Levels - 00:09:34.47
Player (58)
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 312
Location: Sweden
'someone wanna help me? http://tasvideos.org/userfiles/info/63287100516554539 Moderator edit: I moved your post here. Please use the main game thread for discussing new research. — moozooh