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Posted: 1/29/2012 3:34 PM

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Reeve

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When the grapple connect to that hub or whatever it is, it acts like a grapple block and just pulls Samus. Although it keeps damaging Samus while connected, it seems it doesn't push Samus back for the damage boost. Try it yourself to understand better what i'm talking about. Sometimes my english play tricks on me.

Posted: 1/29/2012 1:33 PM

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Reeve

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Another Half second time saver. Actually in my test it was 27 frames faster but if optimized it can be at least half second probably. I actually pointed this before, but i don't know if i was clear enough about what i was talking and i don't know if it was tested or not. So i tried it myself. The bad news is you need to waste one super for that, but i don't think this would be a big deal. smv Edit: Managed to save 2 more frames, now it's 29 frames faster.

Posted: 1/28/2012 11:04 AM

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Reeve

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Cpadolf wrote:

The problem with morphing in mid air to clear the ledge after the E-tank is that you'll continually rise through the air until your momentum drops to 0, which means you lose a lot of time floating in the air.

I see. I supose, if the cwj is possible, that it's not possible to clear the ledge making Samus hitbox smaller, holding down, like i did in the first smv hero posted, in the eyed door area.

Cpadolf wrote:

For the noob bridge, it is possible to get a high enough speed to skip the mid air morph, but it's actually faster to just go full speed with armpumps and do the mid air morph to reach the platform.

That's cool! The "no armpump" was more to make it possible without the morphball, but if it is better with it, then it's cool!

Cpadolf wrote:

For the Gravity Statue room, it could be possible, but I think the second robot will be in too bad of a position to go down quickly if you do this.

I understand. So the time gainned by keeping the speed in the Statue area could not pay for the time lost making the robot to go down, right? You can consider too to not loose time landing the pb in the upper area, and land while shooting the robot.

Posted: 1/28/2012 6:24 AM

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Reeve

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Regarding the Full Speed CWJ that hero posted, can it be used in that Energy Tank room in Pink Brinstar, below the Charge Beam, when coming back? There's a two blocks ledge right before the door that could be used to prolong the cwj animation. If possible, it could be possible to morph right after the CWJ and use that trick that makes Samus keep her vertical speed while morphing in the ledge of the ceiling. So you could go higher and save some time. Edit: Also, after the Brinstar Clean up, in the room before the noob bridge, right after openning the blue gate, it should be possible to not use armpump for samus to get the highest speed and use the same trick to cwj from the door straight to the noob bridge without the need of morphing in mid air. There's a small ledge right before the door. Edit 2: Btw, Cp, regarding that GravityBots Early Shot, would it be faster if you shoot just the first robot, use the speedkeeping trick to reach the Statue but still landing the Power Bomb to clean the false Chozo, then manipulate the second robot to be in a position to fall quickly? You could try to shoot that robot right before morphing over the SpeedBooster blocks going to the robots area.

Posted: 1/27/2012 11:53 AM

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Reeve

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Cpadolf wrote:

It would be significantly faster to just run through the door. The reason I jumped through it in my run was to save realtime (lessening door scrolling), I think I lost 20 frames or something ingame from that.

I see. I never liked that in-game time sacrifices to make the door transition align and stuffs like that. It's pretty strange, for example, when going for Speed booster in an any% run, it always looked sloppy to me to see samus not ledge grab in that bubble room with the bugs pipe, going to the big corridor before Speedbooster.

Posted: 1/27/2012 5:07 AM

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Reeve

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hum... i didn't quite understand... Would it be for another CWJ? Edit: Can you guys save at least 2 or 3 frames here? This smv is 2 frames slower than Cp's run, though it looks more entertaining due to the Door CWJ. If at leastt 2 frames can be saved so it will be equally fastt and can be used.

Posted: 1/27/2012 4:00 AM

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Reeve

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I don't know, Hero. In one test i did, don't know if it is the one posted, I managed to hit The eyed door 1 frame earlier than Saturn in his In-game time any%, though i think it was the first frame to hit the eyed door, so getting there with a spinjump will probably be the same as you have to wait for the eye to open anyway. Btw, Cpadolf, thanks for testing that grapple damage strat. It was really cool. Edit: Crazy smv, hero. You really think out of the box. The extra damage may not be a problem if you manipulate the Big Hoppers to give you health, as you probably won't have problems with ammo refill using Wave/Charge/Spazer. If health is not a problem, you could take a little more damage and get it from the hopper if it's faster. Regarding that Eyed Door to Kraid's lair, I got to the plaform with speed to shoot the super straight into the eye of the door, but it doesn't make any difference, cause as i said, you have to wait for the eye to open. smv

Posted: 1/27/2012 3:00 AM

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Reeve

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That's even better. With this CWJ it's possible to reach the Eyed door without the need to morph. Don't know if it would be faster though... smv This looks better. But probably just the same speed as the usual strategy.

Posted: 1/27/2012 1:59 AM
(Edited: 1/27/2012 2:02 AM)

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Reeve

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That's very cool, dude! Is there any specific requirements for this trick to work? Edit: I'll assume it only works going to the right, right?

Posted: 1/25/2012 10:17 AM

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Reeve

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Great!!! Now it's 4 frames faster than Saturn's GravityKagoTech. Btw, I had this idea some time ago and made a smv, though it was, iirc, 10 frames slower than Cp's strat. Now, i know that the smv is improvable, but can you guys improve it enough to beat the current 100% run strategy? Edit: Ok, I tested it again and it's 9 frames slower. Good luck!

Posted: 1/25/2012 2:38 AM

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Reeve

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Nice SMVs dude, though i don't know if the early tube blast would really save time, since you usually charge the shinespark while the Power Bomb is exploding, so you can quickly shinespark up for the Maridia Mainstreet Missile.

Posted: 1/24/2012 10:15 PM

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Reeve

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Cpadolf wrote:

Tested this out and managed to get it about 30 frames faster than my initial test (and although that was improvable, it's definitely not improvable by 30 frames). Theoretically it should be possible to do a jump that's one frame shorter, or jump slightly earlier, but your vertical position has to be incredibly precise, and the lower you jump the better your position must be. The minimum falling speed you need is 2.5120, and with that speed your vertical position has to be greater than or equal to 363.60416, but less than 363.65535. I got extremely close at one point (1/16th of a pixel away), which would have saved another 3 frames, but had no luck getting closer. Anyway. Smv.

Awesome, if Charge Beam early was not justified yet, now it is for sure.

Cpadolf wrote:

I also managed to improve your test at the Gravity Statue by 7 frames, so it's faster than Saturn's strategy. Smv

I wished so bad this strat would be faster! Amazing Job!!!

Posted: 1/23/2012 11:31 AM

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Reeve

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Btw, now that early Charge Beam has some chance of happening, that pseudo Screw + Charged Shot has more chances of beeing usefull. Though i didn't think about anything yet. Also, something i was trying but couldn't find yet: When going to LN norfair, two rooms before the LN elevator, the room with the blue gate, it should be possible to land a power bomb next to the gate, in some spot where it would reach the yellow door, so you'd have no delay when you reach the ground. The blast seems to even reach the door sometimes. I don't know much about technical issues involving the game, so maybe you guys could find the magic spot for this to work (if even possible). Edit: Damn, i just realized that the last link i posted is not openning. Reason is i copy pasted the wrong information and didn't notice. I'll post the smv when i get home. Though, as hero and forensic said, it could not be the same spot for Wave/Spazer. Edit 2: Btw, i did a small test using the charge beam to break the blocks behind the chozo statue in ws gravity room and compared it to Saturn's strategy. Saturn's strat was 9 frames faster. The way i did is probably improvable by some frames, i just don't know if it's possible to gain enough to be at least equally fast to Saturn's strat and avoid the PB option. Here is the smv i compared to Saturn's. Edit 3: Managed to make the Charged Shot option 3 frames faster, so now the difference is 6 frames. The smv is already updated. Edit 4: Don't know if you guys knew about it or not, but it's possible to keep a charged shot while morphed for some time without desabling the Bomb. I think it doesn't work if you have spring ball though. Anyway, don't know if it would be usefull but here is the smv. Edit 5: Just an addition to the information i posted before regarding the comparison between Saturn's Strategy and the Charged Beam: Although Saturn's strat is faster by 6 frames (maybe less if better optimized), it is slower 7 frames due to the lag caused by the Power Bomb. Edit 6: Here is a "maybe" better spot for the wrap around in the landing site. This time recorded using the Wave/Spazer. I get the wrap around in the fourth attempt, be patient. Edit 7: Here is a better example of the wrap around. It seems you need a specific position and some falling speed/forward speed for the beam to go in the right angle. Don't know if this would be faster compared to the way Hero found, but it's worth testing.

Posted: 1/23/2012 12:30 AM

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Reeve

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Don't know if it would be possible. The problem is the spot you have to shoot to open the door is close to the right door, so if you charge the shinespark there, it will take much time to run to the ledge and then there is the problem of the distance from the spot Samus would jump to the spot where she activate the shinespark. As you have only three seconds to activate the shinespark, i'm afraid you wouldn't have time enough. There's a spot close to the door, the way we do on realtime, but you would need a small jump to make the beam go in the right position. A short charge could be done while reaching the spot where too jump, and then a run to the left. I'll try to find an old smv. Edit: Here is the way it is done in realtime. Btw, after recording it i realized i was using Plasma instead of Spazer, but it's probably the same spot. Also, the jump probably can be done lower or maybe it doesn't even have to be done. I'm not familiar about this tasing stuffs.

Posted: 1/22/2012 11:53 PM

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Reeve

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Thanks, man! I was just curious about how it would look like. It seems the next run will be quite different of what most people thought it would be. It's good that you can get the charge beam without any addiction of a door transition too.

Posted: 1/22/2012 11:10 PM

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Reeve

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Cpadolf wrote:

A quick test suggests that the landing site wrap around should save about 1:40, though you need 1 more E-tank to do it (this is probably not a problem). So early Charge does look pretty good now.

Is there any smv, cp? if so, could you post?

Posted: 1/22/2012 8:26 PM

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Reeve

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Regarding that Shinespark outside of wrecked ship, two rooms before the Statue, it saves 1:17 seconds from the unmorph position, but i didn't discount the time needed for the Super Short Charge before the small passage. If it's possible to charge the shinespark loosing at most 45 frames, it would still save half second, but if you need the health for the Shinespark in the Landing Site, it can be sacrificed for getting some health drops. If not, that will be even better.

Posted: 1/22/2012 1:09 PM

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Reeve

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I'd still like to see a run completing every stage how they're suposed to be, but if the run is going to use gliches anyway, i'd be in favour of not backtracking just to get goal spheres and get them only in stages where they can be acquired. It seems the Yoshi wings glitch can not be used in all stages too.

Posted: 1/22/2012 6:28 AM

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Reeve

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That was pretty cool, dude! But if you're going to take it seriously, i think the best would be do something like that infinite combos for the first fight, to gain the audience's attention, and in the other fights do somethings different like play around or something like that. A 2 player would be great to change the characters and show different combos, maybe three or four challenges would be good.

Posted: 1/22/2012 6:03 AM

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Reeve

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I think i'm fine with the yoshi wings stuff. What kills me is that backtrack for the Chuck too, but if you can use a Chuck in the current level you are without having to go to another stage to get it, i think it's fine. Or there'll be too much overworld map in the run, imo.

Posted: 1/22/2012 5:05 AM

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Reeve

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This is the best spot i could find to break the first blocks behind the Statue. I don't think there's a better spot than this one. Not optimized smv Edit: Places i can think are: The door that leads to the ki-hunters area, the same area where you collect the missile pack going for Kraid. I remember Saturn openning that oor with a charged shot before reaching it. I don't know if it really saves time or he did it just for a change. There could be a way to open that Dachora room exit door (the first room in pink brinstar area) with a charged shot after a jump and before a mockball. Maybe not. This one is more a question. Isn't there a way to open that pink brinstar E.T gate from a lower position using a Charged Spazer?

Posted: 1/21/2012 11:39 PM

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Reeve

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Fucking cool, man!!! A Charged Shot can probably save time somewhere else we don't remember now. Btw, regarding the smv you posted, it was just a test and you didn't want to use the kago power bomb or you forgot about it? The one Saturn found long time ago. After placing the bomb on the ground, jump on the statue doing a kago trick, then place the power bomb while falling inside the statue in the right spot to clean the shootable blocks, unmorph and jump to the small passage. Also, there's the possibility of shooting the blocks earlier, maybe using charge. Anyway, this last part needs testing. Great SMV Also, i thought it would be possible to do the trick without using the charge beam, just shooting, but it seems i was wrong. :( Edit: Sorry. You said the old strat is improvable by the use of the wave beam, you're probably talking about clearing the blocks next to the statue, but anyway, if that is improvable, this last one you posted is too using the same strategy, which would make it the same amount of time faster anyway, imo. Unless i'm missing something.

Posted: 1/21/2012 5:07 PM

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Reeve

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Double post for a change. I managed to record the trick. Two smvs, in one i was just trying to find the spot where i could shoot the robot and in the other i kinda tried to see if it was possible to shoot the robot while keeping the speed. Also, i shoot one different robot in each smv just to show that it's possible to shoot both (maybe not in one trip). WS Robot WS Robot 2

Posted: 1/21/2012 5:16 AM

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Reeve

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Carl Sagan wrote:

I think posting the test run was a great idea. My opinion on backtracking is immediately "no way" after watching that. The overworld time, and repeating the same orb grab over and over and over really kills entertainment, imo.

Same here.

Posted: 1/20/2012 6:23 PM

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Reeve

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Cpadolf wrote:

Shockingly enough, it's almost a full second faster. Couldn't find an smv of it so I made one here.

Shockingly indeed. But thinking about that it makes sense. Think about it. You go all the way to the pink door and then come back for the super missile and go all the way to the right again. The way we usually clear that room, getting the Super Missile first is already a big backtrack, it just doesn't seem because you backtrack in the top of the room visiting a different area. Reentering the room is much uglier than the traditional way but it's more eficient. Edit: The only run i remember using this is the late RBO done by hero, kriole and taco, the unfinished one before they found that early blue Brinstar E.T trick. But they didn't get the two missile packs in the back of the chozo statue. Edit 2: Regarding what hero said about the gravity statue room, i managed to make the first robot to go to the hole before getting to the Gravity Statue shooting from the spikes. Problem is i couldn't record it. When i was not recording i got it twice, but then i tried to record and couldn't make it work. Maybe it's because the robots position or something as when i thought about recording i had to reenter the room. I'll keep trying to record at least a sloppy attempt.

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