Joined: 3/10/2014
Posts: 25
Location: United States
scorpianman42 wrote:
Alright so I noticed an odd side effect of selecting the tile while at 7a. the second start screen is glitched (as found before). the screen looks like it has been taken over by rings.
also, If I select the last ring I have and hit right, which should bring me back to the first item, it instead goes to another ring. I can scroll through a huge list of random rings, most of which are the friendship ring. I can equip any of the rings and gain the effects of the ring. I have seen the pegasus ring, and the power ring LVL 3. I don't know what determines what rings are in the giant list, but will look into it on another file and see
Edit: trying to access the ring list through Vasu crashes the game after this glitch
It seems that the rings in the glitched list depend on what rings you currently have in your actual list (the normal one accessible through Vasu), if you appraise a ring after getting the glitched ring box it will change the rings in the glitched list (assuming it's a new ring)
I also got an odd effect after trying to access my list through Vasu, I was on 3DS and the game toggled my restore points to OFF, and then crashed back to the console menu. when I went back the restore points were still toggled off, and remained that way until I toggled them back on
I'm trying to get Vasu to not crash the game. Here's what I know about the ring box level.
If you have visited the top-left area of symmetry city in the present, the results will be less interesting. So, that tile should be blacked out on your map screen.
Assuming you've never visited there, and you've restored the tuni nut (which is probably necessary), there is one more factor which affects the ring box level - your shield level. Level 1 shield gives you the ring box level 10 (0x0a). Level 2 shield gives you ring box level 15 (0x0f). You don't need to have a shield, just check the shop to confirm the shield level.
The level 10 ring box seems to crash in a consistent way.
The level 15 ring box usually crashes the game, but in many different ways... one time, it actually let me go to the ring screen, though it was graphically glitchy. I can't figure out how to do it again.
The level 11 ring box (0x0b) doesn't crash, but I don't think there's a way to get it with the glitch - only through memory editing.
If I could talk to vasu without it crashing, I could probably manipulate the RAM past the ring list. I'm not entirely sure what it contains, though.
scorpianman42 wrote:
It seems that the rings in the glitched list depend on what rings you currently have in your actual list (the normal one accessible through Vasu), if you appraise a ring after getting the glitched ring box it will change the rings in the glitched list (assuming it's a new ring)
I think one of the rings is the same as the number of unappraised rings you have. If you have 2 unappraised rings, it should be the power ring level 2.
Pokota wrote:
SBD wrote:
If the majority of people wants to see a linked game TAS, it could easily be changed right now since the run needs to be redone from scratch anyway.
In a linked game TAS we wouldn't bother with the Gasha Trees and just get the rings we need from the Ring Secret.
I don't know if that's such a good idea... did the Seasons TAS even pick up any rings?
Joined: 3/10/2014
Posts: 25
Location: United States
Drenn wrote:
I'm trying to get Vasu to not crash the game. Here's what I know about the ring box level.
If you have visited the top-left area of symmetry city in the present, the results will be less interesting. So, that tile should be blacked out on your map screen.
Assuming you've never visited there, and you've restored the tuni nut (which is probably necessary), there is one more factor which affects the ring box level - your shield level. Level 1 shield gives you the ring box level 10 (0x0a). Level 2 shield gives you ring box level 15 (0x0f). You don't need to have a shield, just check the shop to confirm the shield level.
The level 10 ring box seems to crash in a consistent way.
The level 15 ring box usually crashes the game, but in many different ways... one time, it actually let me go to the ring screen, though it was graphically glitchy. I can't figure out how to do it again.
The level 11 ring box (0x0b) doesn't crash, but I don't think there's a way to get it with the glitch - only through memory editing.
If I could talk to vasu without it crashing, I could probably manipulate the RAM past the ring list. I'm not entirely sure what it contains, though.
The shield values of 11 (0x0b) and 14 (0x0e) both give a lvl 11 ring box, however I don't see a way to get that value on the shield.
a few more levels of the ring box give a way to access the list without it crashing, but nothing interesting seems to happen.
The sixth ring in the ring box always seems to be a pointer to the ring you currently have equipped, however trying to equip it just unequipped the ring.
I also was able to find a few ring box levels that had various trade items in the ring box, although equipping them just sets the equipped ring value to somewhere between 0 and 255
So, the data that would be manipulated is event data, followed by map data. You wouldn't be able to trigger most new events, but you could re-trigger old ones, which might lead to other glitches. Using rings, you could re-trigger old events by overwriting stuff with the friendship ring. Also, somehow I moved the pirate ship to the forest by zeroing out the events... not sure how that happened.
Then there's the map data for the present starting at address 0xc700. Each byte is a "sector" of the map. You can seriously screw up some areas by setting bit 0 of these bytes, but there may not be much point, this late in the game. Though I did manage to get into the cave of ordeals by doing this (non-linked game), there was no escape from it.
Unfortunately, the more interesting and useful data is just before the ring list. Oh well, this is hypothetical anyway.
Oh, and scorpianman, it would be great if you could figure out how to semi-consistently reboot into GBA mode. I haven't been able to - the save file probably makes a difference.
Joined: 3/10/2014
Posts: 25
Location: United States
So I was messing around with moving a block created by the cane of somoria, and found a few interesting results
all of these happened when the block was on the top-right black tile and being pushed right.
- the sound that happens when you are caught by palace guards played, and after exiting the map, two exclamation points appeared near link, nothing happened after that.
- the game played the electrocuted music + animation, then crashed
- the same as the first one, however after the exclamation points disappeared, thee sequence when twinrova spawns (after rescuing nayru) played, they went through the entire animation and flew off screen, but the music did not stop
- a few sound effects went off, then invisible walls were loaded on the screen, they went away after exiting and re-entering the screen
- the game went to a glitched start screen, after saving and quitting, then re-entering the file, the game placed me exactly where I was (out of bounds) and the cane of somoria was glitched
- same as the first, but when I exited the map screen, I was on tile A5 (or somewhere near there) the game played fine afterwards
- the game acted as if I had just selected the file, and put me back into the cave where you text warp to OOB
- sometimes, the game booted into GBA mode
I cannot tell what affects each outcome, but I assume it is based off the block and link's X position.
I have not been able to reliably reproduce any of these results
If you throw a scent seed, the glitch will have different results
edit:
- same as first one, however the second form of Vire spawned, defeating him did nothing
Okay... I would advise extreme caution doing this glitch on a 3ds. Somehow, I rendered oracle of ages permanently unplayable. I wiped the SD card and redownloaded it, and still, I couldn't boot it. Luckily I use a hacked 3ds with emunand, so I was able to roll back my system to a previous state. Someone doing this with an unmodified 3ds may not be able to fix it...
Anyway, I noticed a potentially useful effect of the glitch in gambatte. It glitches link's position so that he is stuck on the left end of the screen... yet somehow he can scroll both left and right? Anyway, this lets him re-enter the map. I haven't gotten it to work on real hardware, though, only with gambatte. The way I did it, was I didn't move horizontally at all, and I moved up to the correct row of the map. I played the harp on the second tile from the bottom to go to the past. I activated the glitch, closed the map, then quickly opened it and did it again. Then link was stuck on the left side of the screen. I was able to glitch over to the eighth dungeon, and I cancelled the effect by playing the harp.
Apparently, bizhawk uses gambatte's core. This could save time travelling to dungeons 7 and 8, though it doesn't seem to be consistent with real hardware.
Edit: actually, this works on other emulators if you simply equip the ember or pegasus seeds with the seed shooter... it might work on a real cartridge, but I can only test with a flash cartridge at the moment, which may be more prone to crashing on bad memory writes.
Joined: 3/10/2014
Posts: 25
Location: United States
Drenn wrote:
Okay... I would advise extreme caution doing this glitch on a 3ds. Somehow, I rendered oracle of ages permanently unplayable. I wiped the SD card and redownloaded it, and still, I couldn't boot it. Luckily I use a hacked 3ds with emunand, so I was able to roll back my system to a previous state. Someone doing this with an unmodified 3ds may not be able to fix it...
Anyway, I noticed a potentially useful effect of the glitch in gambatte. It glitches link's position so that he is stuck on the left end of the screen... yet somehow he can scroll both left and right? Anyway, this lets him re-enter the map. I haven't gotten it to work on real hardware, though, only with gambatte. The way I did it, was I didn't move horizontally at all, and I moved up to the correct row of the map. I played the harp on the second tile from the bottom to go to the past. I activated the glitch, closed the map, then quickly opened it and did it again. Then link was stuck on the left side of the screen. I was able to glitch over to the eighth dungeon, and I cancelled the effect by playing the harp.
Apparently, bizhawk uses gambatte's core. This could save time travelling to dungeons 7 and 8, though it doesn't seem to be consistent with real hardware.
Edit: actually, this works on other emulators if you simply equip the ember or pegasus seeds with the seed shooter... it might work on a real cartridge, but I can only test with a flash cartridge at the moment, which may be more prone to crashing on bad memory writes.
What exactly were you doing when you broke the 3DS?
also, do you have a video of the positioning glitch?
Video
I was messing around with the glitch, just to the left of the leftmost black tile. Twice, it booted me into gba mode... usually it did something else. Then once, my restore point disappeared, and I tried to exit, but the 3ds froze when I hit X to close the software. Then I couldn't boot it...
If you want help, you can try recording the input for it while doing it on emulator so others with better knowledge of the game's memory can see what's going on.
Joined: 3/10/2014
Posts: 25
Location: United States
Drenn wrote:
Video
I was messing around with the glitch, just to the left of the leftmost black tile. Twice, it booted me into gba mode... usually it did something else. Then once, my restore point disappeared, and I tried to exit, but the 3ds froze when I hit X to close the software. Then I couldn't boot it...
I was able to recreate the positioning glitch, both on emulator and 3DS. I think it may have something to do with the items you have equipped to your A and B buttons. anyway, the setup is to go to any tile that you can access the glitched tile from, and make a portal to the past on the tile 2 below the bottom-right middle tile. (as in the video) then equip the seed satchel with pegasus seeds in the A slot (yes the seeds matter), and the seed shooter with pegasus seeds in the B slot. then select the glitched tile, exit out of the map screen, and walk to wherever you want to go.
Edit: I just timed moving from 6 to 7 and from 7 to 8 using this glitch, theres not much difference between the normal way to go from 6 to 7, but the 7 to 8 route seems a bit more than 40 seconds faster than going through normally. my timing probably isn't all that accurate though.
I don't think it matters what you have equipped - the important thing is that the pegasus or ember seeds are loaded into the seed shooter (whether or not it's equipped).
Also, check your ring box. You now have the like-like ring. Congratulations. (the ring obtained is based on in-game events which I don't think can be manipulated at this point.)
By the way, I mentioned earlier you need to visit a specific tile on the map for this glitch to work. That tile is actually in ambi's palace. The quickest way to do this is to enter the palace through the front door, then go to the 3rd underwater screen in the secret passage, then savewarp back to the entrance. This takes 26 seconds. But in total, by my calculations, it saves a bit less than a minute if you use the glitch to reach dungeons 7 and 8 (most of the saved time is for D8).
I guess this is an alternative to the cutscene glitch discussed on page 29. An advantage to this method is that you don't need to watch the cutscene where you get the bombs, assuming you do the toilet warp very early to get a bomb chest.
jlun2 wrote:
If you want help, you can try recording the input for it while doing it on emulator so others with better knowledge of the game's memory can see what's going on.
In this case it's not difficult to duplicate, though I could share my save file, which certainly seems to affect things.
Joined: 3/10/2014
Posts: 25
Location: United States
Dang, I forgot about visiting that tile, it probably on't save much time (if at all) now, because the any% route uses palace skip
The fastest way I have found to visit the tile is to go right from the tile your video starts the glitch on, and past the odd tiles filled with doors (hold a bomb to not enter them) and then go up.
Does anyone know how much time getting the red ring right before LVL 7 would save? it might be worthwhile to grab the red ring if the route already activates the glitch
I timed getting the red ring, it seems like it would only take about a minute extra. If getting the red ring is faster, it might also be faster to do Level 8 early, then go back to LVL 7
It should take less than a minute to get the red ring. It's still possible to get the positioning glitch without a time portal on the screen. It would be even faster if there were a way to get the glitched ring box with a time portal on-screen, but I haven't been able to do it.
Is it not slightly faster to travel to level 7 with the glitch (ignoring the time needed to visit the tile)? Remember, you can scroll to the right side of the screen as well. Four screens up, two screens right, dive (cancelling the glitch), visit king zora.
Also, it should be faster to visit the area from ambi's palace, rather than from out of bounds, since you'd get stuck in a wall.
Joined: 3/10/2014
Posts: 25
Location: United States
Drenn wrote:
It should take less than a minute to get the red ring. It's still possible to get the positioning glitch without a time portal on the screen. It would be even faster if there were a way to get the glitched ring box with a time portal on-screen, but I haven't been able to do it.
Is it not slightly faster to travel to level 7 with the glitch (ignoring the time needed to visit the tile)? Remember, you can scroll to the right side of the screen as well. Four screens up, two screens right, dive (cancelling the glitch), visit king zora.
Also, it should be faster to visit the area from ambi's palace, rather than from out of bounds, since you'd get stuck in a wall.
Oh I forgot about going right to the left of the map :P (you meant it is slightly faster, correct?)
After timing going through the palace the "normal" way, compared to the guard skip and visiting the tile from OOB, I believe guard skip + OOB is about 25 seconds faster.
Alright so after messing with the game for a bit, I found out that you can temporarily Override the portal's X-value by using the roc's feather. This allows you to get both the red ring and activate the glitch on the same screen. - dang too slow, Drenn beat me to it
Hitting the switches is slower, I think the fastest way is to enter the passage from inside the castle, then savewarp. Note that both the 3rd underwater room, and the area above it, both set the "been here" flag. The underwater room is closer, so you'd savewarp there.
Oh, and I found a way to do the ring glitch with a portal on-screen. You need to get into the correct x-position to trigger the ring box glitch, and go close to the top of the screen (I don't know why this is necessary). Use the rocs feather and pause on a frame where the shadow is displayed. The shadow overrides the time portal's x-position.
Then walk down to roughly the y-position of the portal and trigger the glitch again. This saves travelling through time twice to get the red ring. (Or the pegasus ring. Whatever floats your boat.)
Joined: 3/10/2014
Posts: 25
Location: United States
So I noticed that if you use the cane right after executing the glitch, then select the tile again, it will let you use your "A" button item, there were a few other effects when using various items, such as the sound for getting an essence playing. I'm not sure if these are useful, I will keep looking
also, if you use the harp while the glitch is active it will let you play, and you will be able to move left and right.
Yes, it warps straight to veran's final form. There's no seasons equivalent... you can't do the text warp to get out of bounds, as far as I know.
mabdulra is posting a highlight on his twitch for a setup to warp to veran. It's not 100% consistent, but I'm sure it would be a piece of cake in a TAS.
This skips dungeons 7 and 8 entirely. Most of dungeons 4 and 5 can be skipped - you just need the switch hook and the cane of somaria. Dungeon 6 must be completed to save Nayru and get the tune of ages. Then you can warp straight to veran.
Also you can get the red ring while you're at it, for a quicker final battle.
Also you can get the red ring while you're at it, for a quicker final battle.
Can you get any ring you want? Because in that case the Dbl. Edged Ring would be a lot faster. (The Whimsical Ring could be even faster than that but the luck manipulation is really difficult.)
Also you can get the red ring while you're at it, for a quicker final battle.
Can you get any ring you want? Because in that case the Dbl. Edged Ring would be a lot faster. (The Whimsical Ring could be even faster than that but the luck manipulation is really difficult.)
The rings you obtain are based on a bunch of event flags and "present map visited" flags. I don't know if they can be manipulated to get that particular ring. The red ring just happens to be there without us doing anything special.
Edit: turns out you can one-cycle veran with the red ring anyway.
http://www.twitch.tv/sockfolder/b/514947219
not listening to audio but look at around 2:50:00, does that look like total control?
edit: nevermind it just more thinking through it.
