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Posted: 8/15/2009 4:40 AM
(Edited: 9/8/2009 1:33 AM)
Post subject: TASVideos on Streaming media sites.
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adelikat
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3573)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4754
Location: Tennessee
TASer of 2010 NES TASer of 2010 DS TASer of 2010 Arcade TAS of 2010 NES TASer of 2008 NES TAS of 2008 Funny TAS of 2008 TASer of 2007 NES TASer of 2007 Funny TAS of 2007
I've set up a TASVideos group on Viddler. My intent is to provide easy point and click for all TASVideos publications (in addition to high quality avi's via bittorrent). I had originally intended to use a TASVideos channel on youtube. However viddler offers many advantages compared to youtube such as no 11 minute length restriction. The only restriction is a 500mb limit on filesize which nearly all publications fall under. I've added a few videos and added the links to the movie pages, such as: http://tasvideos.org/903M.html I will be asking all publishers to get an account on viddler and join the TASVideos group. I hope to also recruit some additional help getting our massive list of existing publications moved onto Viddler. This is still in the experimental stages. So far I have only uploaded AVI files. I have yet to try to upload a new MKV that takes advantage of brframes & deldup (this causes youtube to freak out).
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Posted: 8/15/2009 6:17 AM
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ShinyDoofy
Former player
Joined: 12/5/2007
Posts: 716
The videos run at ~20fps for me (don't even ask when it's full screen), so really a great quality I must say. If you want to try a "new" mkv file, try both my latest publications.
Posted: 8/15/2009 6:42 AM
(Edited: 8/15/2009 7:44 AM)
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Flygon
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
Its weird, sometimes the videos run at a good FPS (Around YouTube HQ grade), yet at others it seems jittery. Still, its wonderful to have a service not bound by the time restrictions outputted by YouTube. The below post seems to sum it up beautifully. However, I'll still leave some examples. Viddler upload of the most recent SMB TAS. HQ YouTube upload of the SMB TAS. I'll admit that the YouTube one has a different encode that was at 640*480, but the purpose of this is purely showing the frame rate issues.
Posted: 8/15/2009 7:07 AM
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Zurreco
Former player
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
If there is anything I have learned from Viddler, it is that fresh files seem to play at a lower quality than others. If the problem persists/fleets, though, it's probably the source rather than the service. I'm all for this. It's a good step forward.
hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine
Posted: 8/15/2009 9:13 AM
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Warp
Banned User
Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland
The videos seem to play at about 5-10 FPS for me. Especially the ones running at something like 5 FPS are a real pain to watch. I don't know if it's just my system. (I don't have any such problem with any other online video site.)
Posted: 8/15/2009 9:22 AM
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Cheezwizz
Joined: 11/2/2007
Posts: 103
has to be you, then.
Posted: 8/15/2009 9:35 AM
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Flygon
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
Its not just him, its affecting me too.
Posted: 8/15/2009 10:12 AM
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upthorn
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Active player (391)
Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
Sega TAS of 2011 Sega TAS of 2010 Sega TAS of 2008 Sega TASer of 2007
Huh, interesting. It's a shame it's viddler, though. As has already been mentioned, viddler's flash player is a huge CPU hog. But also, viddler has recently been inserting advertisements at the beginning of every video that hits a certain threshhold of popularity. There's one thing that helps a bit with the flash player, though. If you go to http://polsy.org.uk/lp/vidviewer/ paste the video url, and check "use simple player", it's not quite as bad. Unfortunately, it's still nowhere as good as Youtube or Daily Motion in that respect.
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:03 AM
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MUGG
Editor, Expert player (2329)
Joined: 5/15/2007
Posts: 3933
Location: Germany
Gameboy TASer of 2015 NES TAS of 2013 Gameboy TASer of 2011 Gameboy TASer of 2010
I noticed that rogueyoshi and swordlesslink uploaded a few TASes on Youtube and they both don't have that annoying 11 minute limit. Maybe they could go on uploading everything? I can understand that they might not want to have every TAS to be in their accounts, though. I checked out the smb run on viddler and it lags horribly for me, I get ~5 FPS. It's my old computer's fault I suppose?
Youtube • Livestream • Progress 11th TASer of the Decade 2010-2019 !
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:25 AM
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andymac
Experienced player (623)
Joined: 11/30/2008
Posts: 650
Location: a little city in the middle of nowhere
I would say that a suitable video hosting website would need to have these characteristics; * Videos are of suitable quality. (ie do not run at 5 fps) * Advertising is kept to a minimum. * Non restrictive size/time limits on videos. Fortunately viddler and youtube aren't the only video hosting websites, take your pick (taken from wikipedia): I'm sure you will find one that matches all the suitable criteria. * AniBOOM * AtomUploads (part of AtomFilms) * BGVIP.TV * Blinkx * Blip.tv * Break.com * Buzznet * Crackle * Dailymotion * EngageMedia * ExpoTV * Facebook * Famecast (music only) * Flickr * Gawkk * Gubb (Gubb.tv) * Tangle.com (formely Godtube) * Google Video (no new uploads) * imeem (ceased video hosting service) * Kewego * Liveleak * Megaupload|Megavideo * Metacafe * MSN Soapbox * MySpace|Myspace * MyVideo * OneWorldTV * Ourmedia * pandora tv * Photobucket * Rayzz * Revver * Rambler (portal)|Rambler Vision (Russian) * ReelTime.com * RuTube * SAPO (company)| Sapo Videos (only portuguese) * Sevenload * TroopTube * Truveo * Tudou (Chinese) * Twango * Vbox7 (Bulgarian) * Veoh * Vimeo * Vuze * Yahoo! Video * Youku (Chinese) * YouTube * Vidoosh (Iranian) * Viddler * Vimeo * Vzaar * Indiavideo.org
Measure once. Cut twice.
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:41 AM
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Raiscan
Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom
Viddler has a bug report forum. Perhaps our problems with it should be posted there? On my eeepc I get around 1fps.
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:47 AM
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Flygon
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
I've shuffled through the list throughout the week, and trust me, its nearly impossible to get a good video website without having a pre-mid 2006 account or a partners account on YouTube or hosting it yourself. Google Video would have worked decently riiiiiight up until they closed the service.
Posted: 8/15/2009 1:10 PM
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adelikat
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3573)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4754
Location: Tennessee
TASer of 2010 NES TASer of 2010 DS TASer of 2010 Arcade TAS of 2010 NES TASer of 2008 NES TAS of 2008 Funny TAS of 2008 TASer of 2007 NES TASer of 2007 Funny TAS of 2007
Zurreco wrote:
If there is anything I have learned from Viddler, it is that fresh files seem to play at a lower quality than others. If the problem persists/fleets, though, it's probably the source rather than the service.
Has anyone with the 5fps problem actually tried some non TAS videos on their site? Are those 5fps too?
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Posted: 8/15/2009 1:55 PM
(Edited: 8/15/2009 2:07 PM)
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Flygon
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
Custom encoded in x264 upload running in seemingly perfect 30fps+. Possibly important note here, I used an AVI. Anyway, I'll have to find a TAS that has an AVI encode thats short enough (Because my internet is crap) and upload it to see if the laws of frame rates with-hold there. Edit: To those curious minds, its a recording of a ROM hack. A teaser so to say. VERY IMPORTANT EDIT BELOW!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Okay, it turns out there is a way to fix the whole frame rate issue! You have to get the direct player source as I have and well, link to it that way! ANOTHER VERY IMPORTANT EDIT! Well, it only solved my side of the problem, as the poster below points out. Move on with your day *Shuffles you out of my post*. Super Mario Bros. in 'fixed' format for the record.
Posted: 8/15/2009 2:01 PM
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andymac
Experienced player (623)
Joined: 11/30/2008
Posts: 650
Location: a little city in the middle of nowhere
sorry to burst you bubble, but I am still suffering from 5fps syndrome after watching that. EDIT: I might have figured out one source of my 5fps syndrome. I have no problem playing embedded viddler videos on some websites such as failblog.
Measure once. Cut twice.
Posted: 8/15/2009 4:15 PM
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Warp
Banned User
Joined: 3/10/2004
Posts: 7698
Location: Finland
adelikat wrote:
Has anyone with the 5fps problem actually tried some non TAS videos on their site? Are those 5fps too?
I watched a half dozen videos linked from the front page of the site and they played ok for me.
Posted: 8/15/2009 5:59 PM
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Randil
Skilled player (1827)
Joined: 4/20/2005
Posts: 2161
Location: Norrköping, Sweden
I am one of those who has extremely low FPS (about 3-5 fps or so) on all our videos (I've watched all the uploaded ones). I looked at a few other videos on Viddler too, I just picked some at random. If it's relevant, these were the ones I picked: http://www.viddler.com/explore/failblog/videos/220/ http://www.viddler.com/explore/MadeFit/videos/34/ http://www.viddler.com/explore/slowbeef/videos/77/ I don't get great FPS on these (perhaps around 15-25), but still better than our uploaded videos. It should be noted that my computer is very old, so it doesn't have a whole lot of CPU power.
My own page on this site.
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:17 PM
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adelikat
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3573)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4754
Location: Tennessee
TASer of 2010 NES TASer of 2010 DS TASer of 2010 Arcade TAS of 2010 NES TASer of 2008 NES TAS of 2008 Funny TAS of 2008 TASer of 2007 NES TASer of 2007 Funny TAS of 2007
Sounds like Zurreco maybe right based on what I am hearing. I'm hearing that viddler movies get at least decent framerates (20-25 or more) and only our (new) movies get the unbearable 5 fps. This can be as zurreco suggested. Or it could be something about how we encode our movies. Or it could be a combo of both. I will investigate this. Also, andymac left out a key feature that is needed (and a big one for my decision to use viddler): Ability to have a group or a channel that allows sub-users. I need a way to manage the channel that doesn't require me being the sole uploader or giving the same level of access I have to someone else (a security risk).
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:20 PM
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Raiscan
Joined: 11/11/2006
Posts: 1235
Location: United Kingdom
perhaps it's excessive use of b-frames? or decimate? or b-pyramid? or reference frames? those are the things that could do with checking.
<adelikat> I am annoyed at my irc statements ending up in forums & sigs
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:30 PM
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Flygon
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
Tell me how smoothly this runs, and please don't make me run out of bandwidth.
Posted: 8/15/2009 11:56 PM
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arkiandruski
Reviewer, Active player (287)
Joined: 12/14/2006
Posts: 717
Sega TASer of 2018
Was pretty choppy for me.
My favorite movies
Posted: 8/16/2009 12:29 AM
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Zurreco
Former player
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Are you guys letting the runs fully load before running them? adelikat's uploads are fluid for me regardless as to whether it was still loading or not. Everything Randil linked was fluid while loading as well. For that matter, every LP that uses Viddler or Baldurk has been fluid while loading. Flygon's SMB video, though, was really really choppy until I paused and let it load. After that, it was fluid again. I can only assume that this means the service gives priority to older, established videos, rather than newly uploaded ones. Maybe it's a really stupid, roundabout way of preventing users from uploading and/or streaming copyrighted content before it can be located and removed by the admins?
hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine
Posted: 8/16/2009 1:48 AM
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ntclark
Joined: 5/9/2008
Posts: 35
Location: USA
Flygon, that runs really slow (~5fps) for me. Same as on the viddler site (i.e., non-embedded).
Posted: 8/16/2009 2:29 AM
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Bag_of_Magic_Food
He/Him
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Zurreco wrote:
Are you guys letting the runs fully load before running them? Flygon's SMB video was really really choppy until I paused and let it load. After that, it was fluid again.
Nope, that didn't work for me. It was choppy even after I let the bar fill all the way up and started over. It seems to be choppier when there's more motion, like during scrolling.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Posted: 8/16/2009 3:10 AM
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Flygon
Joined: 11/4/2007
Posts: 1772
Location: Australia, Victoria
Okay, this website is beginning to give me back pains. Five failed attempts of uploading the same clip with various encoding settings. Now I'm just uploading it to YouTube to see if it even works. IMPORTANT NOTICE! CLICK THE LINK BELOW! CLICK ME NOW! Tell me, is there frame rate issues?
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