This is NES Super Mario Bros. 3, completed in 10:26.42 (37647 frames), an improvement of 1.6 seconds (96 frames) over the previous run, and 3.1 seconds (186 frames) faster than the alternate run which, like this run, acquired 99 extra lives magnificently™.

Goals

  • As fast as possible
  • Obtains 99 lives
  • Emulator Used: FCEUX 2.0.4-interim, default settings
  • Rom Used: Super Mario Bros. 3 (U) (PRG0) [!].nes

Mitjitsu's comments

I first noticed the site three and a half years ago when I watched Genisto's run on archive.org. There was a link to the site where I read through the Why and How section and lurked on the forums occasionally as well. I've always wanted to do a run on this game, but for a long time didn't know or suspect improvements. I had occasionally tried to TAS various parts of the game to no avail. Over the years as I got steadily better, I was able to question things more from a frame by frame point of view. Rather than just an ignorant viewers point of view. After the previous run had been published. I found a way to save a frame at the beginning of 8-1, and a 15 frame improvement in the first autoscroller by taking damage.
I knew based off one of Nitsuja's WIPS that 1-1 was improvable by 4 frames, but it wasn't enough to avoid increased hammer bros movement in the over world. I realised that Nitsuja hadn't taken advantage of the fall through block glitch at the beginning which is enough to save a frame. Unfortunately I had to sacrifice too many pixels in order to make it a bankable saving until...
Randil posted one of his WIPS on the forum. With his improved start it meant no pixels needed to be sacrificed to make the fall through glitch work and I was able to incorporate the improvement into the rest of the level. From earlier testing via Game Genie, I knew that it would add up to increased savings in later levels because less delays would be required to in order to get good hammer bros movement.
In the first autoscroller I stumbled on a way to fall through blocks at very low speeds. Unfortunately, I had great problems trying to replicate it and it caused the project to stall for a long time. Until Lord Tom mentioned on the forums that he had found a noticeable improvement in Bowser's Castle. He mentioned a clear desire to do a new run, he probably wasn't aware of the improvements I knew at the time so I decided to PM him and show him my current WIP. He was also able to fully unlock the logic behind the slow speed block glitch, because of this, not only could the first autoscroller be done quicker, it could also be done with more lives allowing us to hopefully of course, manage to get 99 lives magnificently™
Apart from a couple of other things. Everything else is mostly 1-2 frame improvements via greater precision. Detailed improvements are listed below. One thing I would like to note is that any future improvements will be problematic, mainly because you would need to be about 10+ frames faster in the first world in order to get the correct boomerang bros routine at the end of the first autoscroller.
Hope everyone likes the run :-)
P.S. In relation to the rom issue, I personally couldn't care less about whether PRG0 or PRG1 is used. I used PRG0 for consistency sake, as I prefer to use the orginally released rom across all games.

Lord Tom's Comments

I first discovered this site in '07 when a forum on speeddemosarchive referenced something "the guys at nesvideos" had done. I'd only been following speed-running for a few months at the time, and being a technical person with modest console skills, I jumped right in.
Super Metroid, Zelda and (Genisto's) SMB3 run were among the 1st TAS' I watched. Being able to nudge SMB3 a step further towards perfection is a treat.
I first got interested in SMB3 after re-watching the published run one day and reading the author comments. Realizing that I had no idea what all the passing through walls was accomplishing, I looked at a map of Bowser's palace online. Being a lover of route-planning, I scanned for alternatives, and the route using the 1st door seemed promising. I was crushed for all of 2 minutes to discover there was a thwomp in the way which couldn't be killed by fireballs. Then I remembered the star... There were some other difficulties in figuring out the wall jump (described below), but I ended up confirming the new route was faster and being contacted by Mitjitsu (who more fully optimized the new route). Five months later, and here we are with a new submission!
It was definitely fun working on my first team-TAS. Mitjitsu has style and a sharp eye for stray frames, while I enjoy high level planning and teasing out the technical details behind glitches, so we complemented each other pretty well.
Thanks to the authors of the previously published runs for efforts that had me bursting out laughing at times, to Nitsuja and Randil for early work on an improvement, and to Carrie and Geoffy for being a supportive and indulgent audience.

World 1

As Mitjitsu alluded, obtaining "bankable" time savings can be very complicated in SMB3. This is because world 1 is a virtual minefield of de-facto mini-frame rules, due to the need to optimize overworld hammer brother movement, which is done by adjusting the frame on which levels are finished either by adding delays (easy) or finding improvements (hard). Carrying over world 1 savings into world 8 is further complicated by the need to manipulate the fastest movement pattern for the hammer brother at the end of the 1st tank autoscroller -- the fastest pattern is faster by about 15 frames, and only occurs every 10th frame or so.
Initially, we had saved 9 frames based on Mitjitsu's efforts, but found all those juicy frames wiped out by the need to wait 10 frames for the world 8 hammer. Some debugger work revealed that saving just *1* further frame in world 1 would yield the fastest pattern without waiting. Thankfully, we found a way to save 5 frames in the world 1 fortress, giving us a bankable world 1 savings (after all the math) of about 12 frames.
The improvement occurs toward the end of the fortress, when Mario runs and ducks underneath a spinning ball. We start sliding earlier, at higher speed, to get past the ball more quickly. Then, we jump at the last possible moment to get up the stairs. This is important, because the timer for P-speed running out doesn't start until you jump. Jumping later means that we keep P-speed right up until the door to the whistle, whereas the published run loses P-speed several frames before the door.

Getting 99 Lives

Being able to get 99 lives without losing time was made possible by 3 things: being able to glitch into blocks at less than p-speed, careful planning to avoid lag while maximizing lives gained, and discovering that it was possible to bounce on some cannonballs off the left side of the screen.
The falling into blocks at low speed only works in the auto-scrollers and makes use of their odd physics. Mario has different horizontal velocities while in the air depending on whether he jumped from the ground or from a moving platform/tank -- jumping from the ground makes Mario faster going right, and slower going left. This state is unchanged by bouncing on enemies. Hence, by jumping from the ground and bouncing off a cannon-ball. we're able to get into the platform at the end of the 1st autoscroller without p-speed, giving us more time earlier on to be magnificent™. We've performed this at speeds as low as 32 (max walking speed is 24, max running speed is 40, max p-speed is 56).
The published run breaks a sequence of 1-ups toward the end of the 1st autoscroller to float right and tail-flip a bomber that is off-screen to the right. Although we're not sure, it seems this must have been done to avoid lag, since it clearly reduces the number of 1-ups achieved without other obvious benefit. We found that changing up the stomping just beforehand, in particular killing one of the manhole dudes before he throws his wrench, avoided lag and allowed us to greatly extend the sequence of 1-ups.
Finally, we discovered that with very careful timing, it is possible to stomp cannon-balls that are fired just as the cannon goes off the left side of the screen. This increased the number of 1-ups both by adding additional targets and increasing flexibility in the stomping pattern.
Our target was to finish the 1st autoscroller with 92 lives, which would let us reach 99 just by getting the 7 lives obtained in the published run on subsequent levels, so we were very happy when we ended up with 94.

8-2

Mitjitsu chopped off a few more frames here with 2 discoveries. First, running down slopes does not increase Mario's speed as reported by memory addresses, but it *does* increase the speed Mario actually moves at; by 1/8 pixels/frame on a shallow slope, and 1/4 pixels/frame on steep slopes. Second was a new route past the bouncy music boxes which allows full speed to be maintained all the way through them.

Bowser's Fortress

Most of the time savings came from the new route, but we also saved 2 frames on Bowser.
Apart from using the star, the new route is made possible by using a low-speed wall-jump. A wall jump requires speed of no less than 33 (with perfect sub-pixel positioning, this is the lowest speed which enables Mario to embed himself far enough into the wall to jump off it before he is ejected). Unfortunately, after entering the 1st door in the palace, Mario falls down a narrow chute with only enough room to accelerate to speed 32. BUT, Lord Tom discovered (by accident) that about every 15th frame, some strange collision-detection thing happens which allows Mario to accelerate for 1 extra frame, thereby permitting a wall-jump without losing time walking left to make extra running room. So, when Mario falls, we push left to hit the wall with optimized subpixel placement, then wait for the correct frame to start accelerating right.
The Bowser fight is faster because, for reasons which are unclear, killing Bowser on certain frames causes the exit door to open faster or slower. So, delaying the final fire-ball a few frames actually ended up finishing the run 2 frames faster.

adelikat: The authors have provided a new submission file that includes commentary via subtitles. Enjoy!
Also, accepting for publication as an improvement to the published movie.

ShinyDoofy: Processing...

adelikat: Replacing the submission file (again). The authors used 4 score input which left null input for controller 3 & 4 for the entire movie. The new submsision file removes that extra data. The movie playback is unaffected by this, but the filesize is cut approximately in half.


Joined: 3/11/2008
Posts: 583
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I enjoyed much. I'd vote yes on both counts. The playing during Tank and Super Tank was good (99 lives yay) but the boat stage was kind of meh. Nicely done on new route through Bowser's Castle and the playing after killing him. Questions: On 8-fortress, did the prior run do as long a run-slide under the spikes as you? Did it matter? Worry: Please tell me that you can't tailthwack to kill the Boomerang Brother. Or that it'd be slower to.
Mitjitsu
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eternaljwh wrote:
Worry: Please tell me that you can't tailthwack to kill the Boomerang Brother. Or that it'd be slower to.
It's slower because the boomerang bros flies up in the air instead of going directly down, plus you must wait for the boomerang to go off screen. Hence the routine talk behind throwing the boomerang as early as possible while backing off.
Joined: 5/2/2009
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alden wrote:
Also, I'm excited to update this.
Oh, didn't know this existed Ow, it sure bring me memories
My first language is not English, so please excuse myself if I write something wrong. I'll do my best do write as cleary as I can, so cope with me here =) (ノಥ益ಥ)ノ
Joined: 3/11/2008
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Mitjitsu wrote:
It's slower because the boomerang bros flies up in the air instead of going directly down, plus you must wait for the boomerang to go off screen. Hence the routine talk behind throwing the boomerang as early as possible while backing off.
I was guessing the former might be the case- I haVen't looked at SMB3 discussion much (Or at least not old discussion.). Thanks for the answer, it's the only thing that looked suspect.
Skilled player (1827)
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Here's a Youtube link to this run, for those who are interested (I did not upload it, I just found it).
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Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Skilled player (1827)
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Sorry, I should have read through the topic before posting. Oh, well.
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
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Location: Uppsala, Sweden
What is the correct and exact time for this run? The submitted topic states: Lord Tom & Mitjitsu's NES Super Mario Bros. 3 in 10:26.42 While in the description the authors state: 10:27.42 (37647 frames) Thanks in advance.
/Walker Boh
adelikat
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10:26.42 is NVA's reported time based on 60.1 fps 10:27.42 is FCEUX's reported time based on 60.0 fps
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
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Fair enough. I should know this but.. thanks anyway. Awesome run none the less!
/Walker Boh
Mitjitsu
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adelikat wrote:
Holy crap! When did the question get changed?!
The question used to be... Vote: Should this movie be published? (Vote after watching!) But was changed to... Vote: Did you like watching this movie? (Vote after watching!) So his post does indeed answer the question. /sarcasm
Joined: 11/11/2007
Posts: 242
Location: the 1950s
Just watched the Youtube encode. Love the wall tricks and airship levels. An improvement of 8 secs; damn. Definite Yes vote from me.
Currently working on: -Possibly the Wily Tower (Mega Man the Wily Wars)
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kchrules wrote:
An improvement of 8 secs; damn.
You got the number wrong; damn.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Mitjitsu
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moozooh wrote:
kchrules wrote:
An improvement of 8 secs; damn.
You got the number wrong; damn.
I think he was thinking of Genisto's run, while being unaware of (or forgetting about) Jadelignboardx's run.
Expert player (2566)
Joined: 12/23/2007
Posts: 830
It's a impossible mission, but you did it, great movie!
Recent projects: SMB warpless TAS (2018), SMB warpless walkathon (2019), SMB something never done before (2019), Extra Mario Bros. (best ending) (2020).
Zakatos
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moozooh wrote:
Kirkq wrote:
Also I found it humorous that SMB3 and SMW are within ~0.23 seconds of each other in completion time now - http://tasvideos.org/1115M.html
This is actually a good point you are bringing up. It should be possible to create a bigame run that ends both games simultaneously.
Yup, thougth exactly the same. How about a SMB3 All-Stars Version + SMW run?
The eyes of a machine are wonderful, but there's nothing like the the eyes of the heart – Old Cid, Cybercop
Post subject: Movie published
TASVideoAgent
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This movie has been published. The posts before this message apply to the submission, and posts after this message apply to the published movie. ---- [1286] NES Super Mario Bros. 3 "warps" by Lord_Tom & Mitjitsu in 10:26.42
Skilled player (1326)
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Now, what about the 'warpless' run?
Joined: 2/21/2008
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I enjoyed the subtitles. Would be a nice addition to any/all future encodes(and movie files, if format permits).
"The guy was fatally injured and wants to be covered by God's tears (rain) before he dies. God is too busy to bother because it wastes frames." Frames 16:26
BigBoct
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The only other emulator I know of that supports subtitles in movies is ZSNES, which IMO is only suitable for low-level TASing at this point. ALSO: Good improvement time-wise and entertainment-wise.
Previous Name: boct1584
Mitjitsu
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Is it possible to change the colour of the text via changing settings in VLC? Also I would have preferred if the text was positioned at the top.
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For mplayer it's -subpos <0>. No idea for VLC.
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If any editor wants to add the Archive.org mirror, here is the link.
Gone.
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Can anyone please encode (preferably mkv) this movie without subtitles?
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
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AngerFist wrote:
Can anyone please encode (preferably mkv) this movie without subtitles?
The subtitles aren't saved with the video stream, they're a separate stream in the container, you should be able to disable them. In fact, I know I'm not able to enable them. It is trivial to remove the subtitles stream with some MKV manager software anyway... I just did that, if you really want I can send you the file in private, though I still think you can just disable the subs from your player.
Gone.