Thanks to BrianRuleZ's discoveries (which you never credited him for)
Yep, I admit, we forgot to thank him for the wallkick in BitFS. He didn't find anything else, so it isn't plural. His trick didn't save the majority of the time.
Thanks to BrianRuleZ's discoveries (which you never credited him for)
Yep, I admit, we forgot to thank him for the wallkick in BitFS. He didn't find anything else, so it isn't plural. His trick didn't save the majority of the time.
We did thank him for helping out with the run, we just weren't specific.
I think you all are nuts. I really enjoyed the camera angles. At the very least it was a refreshing experience over the past use since it was all backwards for the most part. The only one I didnt enjoy was when he wasnt visible in BitFS, but as someone stated I can imagine a newb being impressed by the invisible navigation, so I can hardly fault it. It was a nice improvement, and I actually enjoyed the camera angles, and I would be legitimately upset if this were not published over camera angles.
yes vot... post[/i]
I think you all are nuts. I really enjoyed the camera angles. At the very least it was a refreshing experience over the past use since it was all backwards for the most part. The only one I didnt enjoy was when he wasnt visible in BitFS, but as someone stated I can imagine a newb being impressed by the invisible navigation, so I can hardly fault it. It was a nice improvement, and I actually enjoyed the camera angles, and I would be legitimately upset if this were not published over camera angles.
yes vot... post[/i]
Different doesn't always mean good. I thought most of it was good until we started playing a game I'd like to call Super Brick Wall 64.
51 frames of improvement is not worth a submission. Chances are that there are no more 'Not another bowser level improvement', so I suggest you go back and refine what you have done. My guess is that this game has about 5000-6000 frames of optimized/unhexed input, so this shouldn't be such a big deal.
And IF you find some wtfomglolzbbq improvement that hottifies the run by a million times but saves like 10 frames, I doubt it will be accepted for publication alone. Unless, ofc, every naïve and ignorant mind that dwells this site goes 'dude this sucked BUT NICE IMPROVEMENT'.
51 frames of improvement is not worth a submission.
Don't state it like that is a concrete fact.
Sorry, I stated it as common sense.
Oooookkkkayyyy......... (you should be aware it's actually 102 frames)
So regardless of the game, length and percieved optimalness of the current run. We shouldn't accept any improvements that are less than 2 seconds. Yep, that makes perfect sense.
Silent Slayers, I wish more posters had your attitude. zOMG seems to come off bitter in every post, even if unintentionally, and I can easily see how he could have offended Swordless Link or anyone else.
On the other hand, I also find it interesting that the part where this submission chooses to hide Mario behind the wall was the area where the most interesting and aesthetic improvement was made in the current publication. I wonder if this was intentional, and I'm thinking there could have been a better part to choose this kind of camera view than in that part with intense action. Perhaps there wasn't, and it won't hurt to have it in a published submission for a while. It will get replaced in a few months anyway.
As superjupi said, if a run with only a frame of improvement was accepted, then I think this shoud to. I find it neat that all these small optimizations were found.
Sorry, I stated it as common sense.
How is that common sense? That's just your opinion. Other people, like myself enjoyed the video. I'm not saying your opinion of not liking movie is wrong, but saying 51 frames is not worthy of submission is a little harsh when some new stuff are implicated and I found the camera new and exciting.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Satyrium wrote:
These are so incredibly boring in my opinion.
Indeed. SM64 submissions all suffer from the same essential gameplay as their predecessors. Even though the same can be said of most (if not all) of the Mario submissions, at least other Mario game seems to have some leeway for author-dependent entertainment.
There is no real point in voting, though. It seems that I am one of a very few who doesn't appreciate such a tiny increase on what is essentially the same run that has been submitted ever since 0star was confirmed. What this submission accomplishes in shaving frames, it loses in being too similar to the old run, at least in my eyes.
Oh, and the camera angles were pretty bad in this one.
I think you all are nuts. I really enjoyed the camera angles. At the very least it was a refreshing experience over the past use since it was all backwards for the most part. The only one I didnt enjoy was when he wasnt visible in BitFS, but as someone stated I can imagine a newb being impressed by the invisible navigation, so I can hardly fault it. It was a nice improvement, and I actually enjoyed the camera angles, and I would be legitimately upset if this were not published over camera angles.
yes vot... post[/i]
Different doesn't always mean good. I thought most of it was good until we started playing a game I'd like to call Super Brick Wall 64.
51 frames of improvement is not worth a submission. Chances are that there are no more 'Not another bowser level improvement', so I suggest you go back and refine what you have done. My guess is that this game has about 5000-6000 frames of optimized/unhexed input, so this shouldn't be such a big deal.
And IF you find some wtfomglolzbbq improvement that hottifies the run by a million times but saves like 10 frames, I doubt it will be accepted for publication alone. Unless, ofc, every naïve and ignorant mind that dwells this site goes 'dude this sucked BUT NICE IMPROVEMENT'.
Different doesnt always mean good, but because I objectively enjoyed the new camera angles, my enjoyment was only compounded by the fact that it was a refreshing new experience of a submission that has been largely the same over the past 3 submissions.
Regardless bottom line: I though the camera angles were excellent.
Sorry, I stated it as common sense.
How is that common sense? That's just your opinion. Other people, like myself enjoyed the video. I'm not saying your opinion of not liking movie is wrong, but saying 51 frames is not worthy of submission is a little harsh when some new stuff are implicated and I found the camera new and exciting.
Uuh... common sense as in 'waste of time', or 'come back later with further improvement'. Because as it is now, this is just another 0-star run, which eventually will be obsoleted by someone else.
If we have accepted smaller improvements before it doesn't automatically mean that this has to be accepted. Try to be rational.
Well, I was going to post but I see someone already posted exactly what I was going to say so I'll just quote.
XIF wrote:
I think you all are nuts. I really enjoyed the camera angles. At the very least it was a refreshing experience over the past use since it was all backwards for the most part. The only one I didnt enjoy was when he wasnt visible in BitFS, but as someone stated I can imagine a newb being impressed by the invisible navigation, so I can hardly fault it. It was a nice improvement, and I actually enjoyed the camera angles, and I would be legitimately upset if this were not published over camera angles.
yes vot... post
Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA
Kriole wrote:
51 frames of improvement is not worth a submission.
So Mr. Super Metroid TASer Kriole, who deals in minuscule frame improvements in rooms in SM, doesn't find 51 frames worth submitting in a hotly competed frame war? Explain that one to me please.
Also, your argument that 'just because a 1 frame improvement was accepted doesn't mean this one should be' reeks of phail; if the 1 frame one was accepted, why shouldn't this one? A non acceptable improvement might be making a ROM change for faster scrolling text, but in a run that receieves a lot of competition, every frame counts.
Zurreco wrote:
Indeed. SM64 submissions all suffer from the same essential gameplay as their predecessors. Even though the same can be said of most (if not all) of the Mario submissions, at least other Mario game seems to have some leeway for author-dependent entertainment.
Shouldn't every single run of any game that has improvement movies made suffer from the same thing in the way you describe, not just super mario 64? Your mario bias here makes no sense; once a new movie of any game is submitted, any improvement movie is going to have the same gameplay as its predecessor. Also, SM64 has room for author dependent entertainment, despite what you say. The fact that we're all arguing about camera work is proof.
51 frames of improvement is not worth a submission.
So Mr. Super Metroid TASer Kriole, who deals in minuscule frame improvements in rooms in SM, doesn't find 51 frames worth submitting in a hotly competed frame war? Explain that one to me please.
Way to generalise. Not all SM TASers are frame hunters.
51 frames of improvement is not worth a submission.
So Mr. Super Metroid TASer Kriole, who deals in minuscule frame improvements in rooms in SM, doesn't find 51 frames worth submitting in a hotly competed frame war? Explain that one to me please.
Way to generalise. Not all SM TASers are frame hunters.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Comicalflop wrote:
Zurreco wrote:
Indeed. SM64 submissions all suffer from the same essential gameplay as their predecessors. Even though the same can be said of most (if not all) of the Mario submissions, at least other Mario game seems to have some leeway for author-dependent entertainment.
Shouldn't every single run of any game that has improvement movies made suffer from the same thing in the way you describe, not just super mario 64? Your mario bias here makes no sense; once a new movie of any game is submitted, any improvement movie is going to have the same gameplay as its predecessor. Also, SM64 has room for author dependent entertainment, despite what you say. The fact that we're all arguing about camera work is proof.
First of all, there is no Mario bias here. Otherwise, I wouldn't rate the SMW publications so high/wouldn't have said that the other games have more leeway/etc. You can say that I have an SM64 bias, sure, except I rated the 120star submission fairly high, whereas I put everything after the first 0star fairly low in entertainment.
Secondly, no, not all improvements use the same gameplay method as its predecessors. The 0star improvement was a great leap forward. However, now that we have brought it down to this level of non-completion, there really isn't anything in between to really truly discern one run from another. If I showed someone Viper7's 100% SMW run, then the next, and then the most recent one, people would see obvious improvements in entertainment and technical quality. If I showed someone the first 0star, then the next, and then the most recent one, most people would be hard pressed to see any real differences between them, save a hop here or there.
In other games where there are "frame wars" going on, there are still some portions of the submission that are handled differently than others. SMB3 runners will 1up-farm in different ways. Super Metroid runners will add little quirks to their attempts to shave time. It just strikes me as odd that people get all giddy about shaving so few frames off of a run where so little actually changes from one submission to another. People didn't have the same vocal response to slight frames being saved on Atlantis No Nazo or the few (shady) frames that Phil took off of SMB1 by ending input earlier in Mario's jump.
51 frames of improvement is not worth a submission.
So Mr. Super Metroid TASer Kriole, who deals in minuscule frame improvements in rooms in SM, doesn't find 51 frames worth submitting in a hotly competed frame war? Explain that one to me please.
Way to generalise. Not all SM TASers are frame hunters.
I think these "Super Metroid frame war" comparisons made by Comicalflop are largely invalid, because the last time a new SM submission didn't improve the previous by more than 30 seconds was this.
The last few years, we're mainly talking 1+ minute of improvement with every iteration. That can hardly be called frame wars.
So yeah, let's drop it and stop brewing the shit to take from one argument to another.
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Thanks to ducksandfish, I've just had a chance to watch this.
I actually think the close-ups worked well when Mario was moving slowly - at the start of the first and 2nd stages particularly - there isn't much in the way of 'skipped routes' or far-away stuff to look at in those 2 sections, so a close-up just makes it more obvious what Mario's up to - always nice.
I'm just some random guy. Don't let my words get you riled - I have my opinions but they're only mine.
