Goals

In contrary to the "Warped" Arkanoid run, this run does attempt to be an improvement to Genisto's full Arkanoid movie. The goals are not exactly the same though. The warped Arkanoid run's only aim is to complete the game as fast as possible. Genisto's movie aims mainly for entertainment. If you look at his run, you'd say the goals of his run are using no warps, and losing no balls (and of course doing this as fast as possible). It is however clear that many of his levels can be improved by using the Laser powerup. The Laser powerup was however only used in three levels, since clearing levels when juggling aroud three balls looks a lot cooler. When using the Laser powerup in a TAS, it doesn't look very different than using it when you play at 100% speed. It would be easy to 'improve' Genisto's movie by just using the Laser powerup in a lot of levels. This would however take away nearly everything that made the previous movie cool (in fact, I even doubt whether such a movie would be accepted to obsolete Genisto's movie). Luke, who had a wip which completed about 13 levels also realized this, and only used the Laser in the levels where Genisto had also used the Laser. This is however a completely arbitrary restriction. A better restiction is not using the Laser at all, and only using the 3-ball powerup. This is a clear, logical goal, which will keep the aspect that made Genisto's movie entertaining. When I proposed this at the [/Forum/Topics/153&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=33|forum], only DrJones disagreed with this (although I have to admit, there was not a lot of response). The goal of not losing any balls was also preferred... so the goal of this movie is to complete Arkanoid as fast as possible, only using the 3-ball powerup, and not losing any balls (and obviously not using the level-skip code).
This goal is a more stricter goal than Genisto's, since he using Laser three times. In two of the three levels where he used laser, he is faster than me... on one I am faster with using 3 balls (although this doesn't mean that using laser couldn't have been faster here). In every other level however, I saved time, and sometimes quite a lot. In the end, this movie turned out 14620 frames faster, or nearly 4 minutes and 4 seconds faster than Genisto's movie.
  • Aims for fastest time
  • Uses the 3-ball powerup only
  • Uses no warps
  • Manipulates luck
  • Genre: Action

TASing Arkanoid

TASing Arkanoid is quite different from TASing any other game. There are several things that would make it seem like it's an easy game to TAS. There is no lag. You only have to use the left and right buttons, and the A button once when shooting the ball at the start of the level. Sometimes you don't have to do anything for quite some time, if all balls are at the top of the screen. Then there are also the parts in between levels where no input whatsoever is needed (and since there are 36 levels, there are 35 of these 'cutscenes'. Even with all of this, the game is extremely difficult to TAS.
The main reason for its difficulty is the amount of options you have. You have over 100 different positions at the start where the ball can be fired from. You obviously want to get the 3-ball powerup somewhat quickly, which decreases the options by a huge amount... but there are always still quite a few good options left from where to fire the ball, and firing it one frame more the to right or left will create a completely different game.
If there are enemies at the level (nearly all levels have enemies), the moment at which you fire from this position will also affect the game, since the enemy will have a different location if you wait a little to fire.
Each time a ball hits the paddle (and this happens quite a lot, considering there are 3 balls in the game), you have 6 basic angles in which you can shoot the ball (depending on what position of the paddle it lands). If you 'run into' the ball from the side though, it will have one of the six angles, but will be shot from a slightly different location, which also produces something different. This means that there are over 6 options each time you shoot the ball.
Then the spot where the enemies appear can be influenced. If you are at the left of the screen, they will appear at the left, if you are at the right of the screen, they will appear at the right.
You can look at this as if there are many possibly roads, that all lead to a certain completion time, and you have to find the fastest. When you shoot the ball, you will be at a large intersection with many possible routes. Each time you bounce off a ball, you will come at an intersection with over 6 routes to choose from. Each time an enemy appears, there is another intersection with 2 options. In the end, you will end up with an extreme amount of options, which makes it pretty hard.
Since you can obviously not test all options, some of them must be discarted. You can often see that bouncing it off at a certain angle will make you unable to keep all three balls in the game. If it's impossible to save a ball, this option can be ignored right away. Then there are also angles which will just send the ball in a pointless direction. Mostly these angles can be ignored also for that bounce, but you must be careful with this. Making a useless bounce might enable you to shoot from a really good position the second time it comes back, so that must always be taken into account. You must notice that each ball you bounce will affect all other balls. A ball literally changes the level, and if one ball makes a good sequence, you must avoid another ball messing that up. Just like messing it up for another ball, a ball can also improve the route for the other ball. Each new choice that is made will affect all previous choices that were made.
It is obviously good to clear a lot of blocks very fast (:P), and this can be done most of the time by getting a ball 'trapped'. It is convenient if a level has a small opening somewhere, and if a level doesn't, then it's good to focus on one particular spot, in order to form a cavity in the level, where a ball can be trapped in.
This obviously hard to do, since, even though there are an extreme amount of possibilities, you can still 'only' bounce the ball in 6 directions. While this creates lots of possibilities it also limits you a lot to certain angles. You can't shoot a ball exactly where you want. At the start, you can decide the position where you shoot from, but later on, and aspecially at the end it becomes quite appearant. At the start, shooting in any direction might clear something, but at the end, there aren't that much targets left. With only a few angles to choose from, it can easily happen that you are just unable to hit the last block, even though you cleared the rest of the level very fast. This is sometimes where Genisto's movie suffered. In this movie, I tried to plan as much ahead as possible, and make sure to in the end clear ALL blocks as fast as possible. This might result in a few strange shots at the end, but I think that in most of the levels, the ending comes pretty fluently.
I want to add that there are a total of 36 levels, which is a LOT. I don't know if I would have started the run (about 2 years ago) if I knew how tedious it was. I often took very long breaks from it, but I'm really glad it's finished now.

Levels

This table will list at what time the screen turned black after each level. It are rough estimates, and the real number can be a second higher of lower. It should still give a good image of at what levels the time was saved.
LevelGenisto's timeMy timeLevel differenceTotal difference
0100:5500:31-00:24-00:24
0201:3100:54-00:13-00:37
0301:5601:10-00:09-00:46
0402:2301:29-00:08-00:54
0502:4701:56+00:03*-00:51
0603:0902:11-00:08-00:59
0703:3902:30-00:10-01:09
0803:5002:39-00:02-01:11
0904:1002:54-00:05-01:16
1004:3003:12-00:02-01:18
1105:2103:46-00:17-01:35
1205:3804:02-00:01-01:36
1305:5304:15-00:02-01:38
1406:2104:34-00:09-01:47
1506:5805:08-00:03*-01:50
1607:2705:24-00:13-02:03
1708:0305:43-00:17-02:20
1808:2405:59-00:05-02:25
1908:4206:16-00:01-02:26
2008:5906:30-00:03-02:29
2109:1606:42-00:05-02:34
2209:3606:58-00:04-02:38
2310:0607:25-00:03-02:41
2410:3007:46-00:03-02:44
2511:0408:11-00:09-02:53
2611:3808:28-00:17-03:10
2712:3209:00-00:22-03:32
2812:5509:20-00:03-03:35
2913:1809:52+00:09*-03:26
3013:5710:21-00:10-03:36
3114:2810:44-00:08-03:44
3214:5211:02-00:06-03:50
3315:2711:31-00:06-03:56
3415:5211:52-00:04-04:00
3516:1512:11-00:04-04:04
3616:3012:2700:00-04:04**
* At these levels, Genisto used the laser ** You might notice that the difference between 16:30 and 12:27 isn't 04:04 but 04:03, but Genisto's time was rounded down, and my time rounded up, so the difference is closest to 04:04.
Some comments on individual levels:
Level 01: I saved the more time on this particular level. The main reason for it being faster is that I focussed on getting to the top of the level at the start, and I focussed on getting all blocks at the end, without having to do bounces that weren't needed. I saved time at lots of other levels by doing these things.
Level 03: I am extremely pleased with how this level turned out. Every ball has its own purpose the entire time, and it just seems like this level was made to be cleared like this.
Level 05: Genisto used the laser on this level. I ended up only being 3 second slower, but the cool thing about not using laser here is that at the end (since the level is pretty long), the balls move pretty fast :). It was not really possible to create a big cavity in the level.
Level 07: It was possible to create a cavity in this level pretty good. That's why everything is cleared as fast all of a sudden.
Level 09: A very hard level, both because of the blocks at the top, which can't be cleared fast, and the blocks in the middle, where no cavity can be formed.
Level 11: This is an interesting level, since there is no non-grey block. This means no powerups can be collected, so the level needs to be cleared with one ball. I think this level turned out VERY well.
Level 14: This level is cool, since the enemies were used at the end.
Level 15: Genisto used laser, but in the end, this version turned out 3 seconds faster. The level is cool, siunce because of its length, the balls travel really fast at the end.
Level 23: Again a very long level. At the end, the score counter keeps counting a little. This happened since a few grey blocks were cleared at the end, which give many points.
Level 26: This level is the prime example of using enemies. I wait a little till the right frame to shoot the ball. After shooting it, I never touch it anymore. The enemies keep the ball at the top of the screen the entire time!
Level 27: This level was perfect for trapping balls in the center. The blocks are cleared so extremely fast, (not that the grey blocks in this level need to be hit 5 times), it's hard to even understand. The level changes all of a sudden, and during the course of the entire level the score counter is running like crazy. Evem after all blocks are cleared, it keeps running for some time.
Level 29: Genisto used laser at this level and gained 9 second on me. This is due to the fact that the level is perfect for using laser. There is nearly no spot to create a cavity, and the blocks at the top are annoying too. Even if a ball clears a lot at the top, or even everything, you want your ball back if it's done, but sometime it remains at the top, leaving you with 2 balls. I tried to avoid these things obviously, and dealt with the level as good as I could.
Level 33: It's somehow a hard level, since the grey blocks need to be hit a lot, and they always remain at the end. It's hard to clear a room if only a few blocks, that need to be hit often, remain.
Level 36: To be different than the warped version, I went for input time. This meant a similar strategy as Genisto. When you can stop the input is determened by when the boss fires its last shot. After you avoid being hit by that shot, input is ended.

Ending

I ended the movie at the first frame ending input was possible while still completing the movie. This is different from my warped movie of this game, which aims for the fastest AVI time. I chose going for input time now for three reasons. Genisto also did this, it looks cooler, and it shows something different than the warped version. It also suits this kind of run better probably.
I'd like to thank Genisto for his previous run, and also everybody who showed interest in the run, it really helped me get motivation to continue working on it.

NesVideoAgent: Hi! I am a robot. I took a few screenshots of this movie and placed them here. Here goes! Feel free to clean up the list.

Truncated: Accepting. I think the goals of this movie are well thought-out and that this should accept our current all-level famtasia movie.

Bisqwit: Processiŋ...


JXQ
Experienced player (761)
Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132
This is technically impressive, but does get old to watch after a while. The game is just too long for its own good - TASing or otherwise.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
Former player
Joined: 6/4/2006
Posts: 267
Location: CO
I found this movie quite entertaining, yes vote. Also, let me say excellent choice in goals/restrictions, it made the movie much more enjoyable.
Lord_Tom
He/Him
Expert player (3143)
Joined: 5/25/2007
Posts: 399
Location: New England
Wow. Excellent. Even in real-time, I could sense the planning that went into each shot. I initially thought the occasional paddle wiggles were to manipulate capsules into not appearing, but you said they don't appear anyway with three balls on-screen. Manipulating enemy movement?
Skilled player (1827)
Joined: 4/20/2005
Posts: 2161
Location: Norrköping, Sweden
Very nice run, and I think you chose the goals well too. Yes vote. I noticed a small typo in the comments: "This goal is a more stricter goal than Genisto's, since he using Laser three times."
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1286
Location: Finland
I watched Genisto's run right after watching this one and I have to say that this is a vast improvement over Genisto's movie. How someone can prefer Genisto's movie over this one, I have absolutely no idea. I'm glad the goals of this movie are consistent and that you don't use the laser at all, good job! I feel, however, that this movie should not get the star that Genisto's movie has. In my opinion the star has been outdated for a long time and should be given to a movie that has more variety from beginning to end and is less repetitive.
Skilled player (1410)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
FreshFeeling wrote:
If I had one minor complaint it would be that the paddle/ship/player/thing moves occasionally when no balls are nearby or approaching - it looks as if the game is controlled by a normal player who is unsure of his immediate movements.
and
Lord Tom wrote:
I initially thought the occasional paddle wiggles were to manipulate capsules into not appearing, but you said they don't appear anyway with three balls on-screen. Manipulating enemy movement?
A valid point. Sometimes, it was indeed to manipulate where enemies appeared. But a lot of the time, I also moved where it wasn't really needed. I had a hard time figuring out what was more entertaining (to me)... moving a little, moving a lot, wobbling, and so on. In the end, I decided that moving a little was probably the best option. Not moving at all sometimes even seems like the input has stopped, and I didn't like it that much, so I tried to move a little, and also make short pauses. I tried to make the movement somewhat entertaining, but I'm aware that some people like different things than others.
Upthorn wrote:
I actually find Genisto's movie more entertaining -- it uses twice as wide a variety of powerups, it also does a variety of cool things like making sure to kill every alien on certain levels, and beating one level in between missing the ball and losing a life.
A wide variety of powerups? You mean using Laser three times, and using the sticky ball once where it isn't needed? I don't know what you are thinking... but 32 out of 36 levels in this run are played with the same weapons as Genisto did in his run, and you claim the 3-ball powerup is overused in this run, while Genisto uses a wide variety of powerups? Who are you kidding? Killing every enemy on certain levels? I also kill every enemy on certain levels. This was however neither Genisto's goal, nor it was mine, since it seems quite trivial. If you kill one enemy, the next one will appear moments later. Since most people chose for a run that was in full control and didn't lose a single ball, I didn't semi lose a ball, right before the end. This wasn't a goal though, and I didn't lose any time by not doing it. Although this point, I could understand. So, what are you suggesting for goals? A run that uses more powerups than laser and 3-ball powerup with logical goals can't be formed. And you can't possible be serious about setting a goal as "kills all enemies at the end of the level, and finishes the level before they reappear". How can something with clear goals obsolete Genisto's movie? I hope you realize that using the Laser tool assisted looks quite similar to using laser in real time. And also that you realize, that I picked my goals in a way that the Arkanoid movie would be as similar as possible to your beloved Genisto's movie. Going for speed only and using laser all the time will only make the run a lot more different than Genisto's, and most certainly not in a good way.
Joined: 4/3/2005
Posts: 575
Location: Spain
So, what are you suggesting for goals? A run that uses more powerups than laser and 3-ball powerup with logical goals can't be formed.
- Aims for entertainment. - Aims for speed when doesn't conflict with the first one (which is superfluous, as speed adds entertainment) - No warps. - Manipulates luck. There is it. I understand that using lasers most of time is less entertaining, but I think is a mistake not using them while aiming for time. You should aim for entertainment instead, which allows you to use these "arbitrary" choices. Isn't entertainment the reason you skip the laser powerup? Though maybe Arkanoid II would work better for that purpose.
No.
Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
DrJones wrote:
Aims for speed when doesn't conflict with the first one (which is superfluous, as speed adds entertainment)
I wish this were true, even just this one time.
Has never colored a dinosaur.
Joined: 3/15/2007
Posts: 131
Twelvepack wrote:
DrJones wrote:
Aims for speed when doesn't conflict with the first one (which is superfluous, as speed adds entertainment)
I wish this were true, even just this one time.
Watching three balls bounce around in seemingly random but actually highly coordinated order is extremely entertaining, imo. Use of the lazer upgrade would detract greatly from the entertainment of the run, especially if it were to be used repeatedly.
Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
I couldnt agree more. The goals for this movie lead to a really entertaining conclusion. I see no reason to complain about them.
Has never colored a dinosaur.
Joined: 7/28/2005
Posts: 339
I'd rather watch 12 minutes of something happening rather than 10 minutes of not much happening. Yes vote. This is excellent.
Joined: 1/23/2006
Posts: 31
I voted yes, I enjoyed watching the movie and it was very well executed. I prefer the frenzy of 3 ball play over using a laser any day, and personally that added to the enjoyment factor for me. It is an updated submission of an old game, and it's done faster. In my personal opinion it's publishable on that. Entertainment is in the eye of the beholder, but I found it more entertaining as well. The only thing that throws me is the star - I remember watching the original way back when fam was current, and being blown away someone stomped "break out" like that. Years later, it's not quite so impressive. For improvements, I'd like to see this game become bot controlled. Give bisqbot it's first submission! :) Some of the fastest ways through the game would probably be rather unexpected. If something off the wall was done to that sort of extent, I could see "Arkanoid for NES" becoming something to promote as a "must see" video here. Having a bot-controlled fastest time without losing a ball (regardless of powerups) would be very cool. Side note : on round 33, it takes a few colored bricks before the powerup for 3-ball even starts coming down. You couldn't manipluate it to be on one of the first bricks? Or was it just longer overall?
Skilled player (1410)
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Posts: 1821
Banarak wrote:
Side note : on round 33, it takes a few colored bricks before the powerup for 3-ball even starts coming down. You couldn't manipluate it to be on one of the first bricks? Or was it just longer overall?
Only particular blocks are able to give powerups. These blocks will ALWAYS give you powerups. Others will never give you powerups. So in level 33, I had to clear a few blocks first, to get to a blocks which gave me a powerup. You won't get a powerup though, if either another powerup is falling down, or if more than 1 ball is on the screen. This is also why no other powerup can be combined with the 3-ball powerup. Which powerup you get from the block that gives you the powerup can be manipulated by the paddle position. I'm glad that nearly everyone likes the movie :)
Joined: 3/7/2006
Posts: 720
Location: UK
Jesus christ, you said 'powerup' a lot in that post. Powerup, powerup, powerup. Powerup. Yes, by the way. A great deal of fun to watch. Some levels were incredibly fast.
Voted NO for NO reason
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Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 7469
Location: Arzareth
Nice. I especially liked the level 26. I'm not 100% sure the decision to only use 3 balls and no other powerups was a wise one, but it didn't bother me enough. Yes vote. The movements of the paddle were a good combination of modesty and liveliness. It worked out satisfyingly. It didn't distract from the main show, but it wasn't apathetic waiting either. So, seven of the ten doors remain closed for the entire game? How disappointing :)
Player (31)
Joined: 9/23/2006
Posts: 207
Location: Moreno Valley, California
You beat round 21 so quickly that one of the silver blocks is still glowing in round 22. Yesness vote.
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AnS
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Joined: 2/23/2006
Posts: 682
At first it was even more impressive than current movie, but towards the end everything became kinda repetitive and predictable. I'm still voting Yes, but sure addind some veriety with Laser powerup would make this run much more interesting (esp. considering that entertainment is main goal of the movie).
Experienced player (828)
Joined: 11/18/2006
Posts: 2426
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Very fun run, and very impressive. I'd say this should easily receive the old movies star.
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Post subject: Movie published
TASVideoAgent
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This movie has been published. The posts before this message apply to the submission, and posts after this message apply to the published movie. ---- [961] NES Arkanoid "warpless" by Baxter in 12:26.80
Banned User
Joined: 3/10/2004
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This is one of the coolest tases I have seen in a long time. It could be interesting to see an "anything goes, without restrictions (except no warping)" run which aims for the shortest time (without using warping), but I think that restricting to use the three-ball powerup was a good idea in this case. Edit: Btw, some people complain that the game is too long for this kind of TAS. Quite ironically I actually felt it was too short! I could have watched that juggling for a couple of dozens of levels more. :)
Tub
Joined: 6/25/2005
Posts: 1377
just watched it, most excellent. Liked the levels where you cleared the last three blocks at the same time :) I completely agree on the choice of no laser. Was a bit surprised to see the boss that soon.
m00
Lord_Tom
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Posts: 399
Location: New England
As I said before, I think the submitted run is outstanding. I've been wondering why so many seem fixated on the laser, and think I have a reason from my own experience playing the game in the arcade... I was always excited to get the laser because it is so precise and (on some levels) powerful. Every time I saw that red capsule I'd have visions of rocking level after level with it only to get distracted and lose the ball (I'm terrible at real-time gaming). In contrast, I never really considered the 3 ball bonus cool because I'd lose 2 of them almost instantly. I agree with Baxter that 'variety' is a bogus reason for accepting a future 'shortest time, any items used' run that employs the laser. But even if laser is a misnomer anyways (plasma cannon?), it has its irrational attraction. If interesting firing patterns/paddle movements could be used, it might even be entertaining...I guess we'll have to wait & see if someone actually makes a run using it to its fullest.
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Thank you all for the nice comment :)
Lord Tom wrote:
I agree with Baxter that 'variety' is a bogus reason for accepting a future 'shortest time, any items used' run that employs the laser. But even if laser is a misnomer anyways (plasma cannon?), it has its irrational attraction. If interesting firing patterns/paddle movements could be used, it might even be entertaining...I guess we'll have to wait & see if someone actually makes a run using it to its fullest.
What I don't really understand is that people are somehow fixed on seeing Laser in this game. From what I understand, the powerups in Arkanoid 2 (on NES) and Arkanoid Doh it Again (on SNES) don't have items that are manipulatable that easy. This means a run with using only 1 type of powerup is not even really possible (or you would have to de large parts without any powerup). So a run on either of these games which just aimed for fastest time, and used all powerups would be logical. The good thing about a game like Arkanoid Doh it again would be too that also other powerups, besides laser and multiball would be able to save time, for instance the ball that just travels through all blocks, without bouncing on them. I think these games would be a lot more suitable for a TAS which used all powerups, instead of a third movie of this game, where Laser would be overused.
Joined: 7/7/2007
Posts: 161
Congratulations on obsoleting the oldest TAS in my archive and one of my favorites. You absolutely destroyed this game and in a most artistic manner. Each level tells a story with the climax being that every ball is exactly where it needs to be at the last frame. The most exciting levels are where it looks doubtful you can pull it off cleanly. Surely you'll need to waste a little time excessively bouncing balls to get the correct angle(s) on the last block(s), right? Not here. What a pleasure to watch. Obviously, I'm a fan of the three-ball-only method. Why lasers may be faster, they're also boring to me. I doubt it'd look all that different from actual skill runs; back in the day, the best tournament players could clear levels in seconds with button mashing. Also, without three balls, the return of random powerups would ruin the run's aesthetic beauty. My favorite glitch is that the moving obstructions don't stop moving until the game catches up with tallying the score.
nesrocks
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Baxter, don't forget to mention that multiball means 10 balls (right?) on arkanoid 2. If people enjoyed 3...