Post subject: Tails' Adventures
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
I'm going on vacation for a little over a week, so I wanted to post what I have learned about this game! I don't know if I want to run the whole game myself, but I at least want to share some cool tricks. Here is a rough test run of the first level: http://www.filespace.org/BagOfMagicFood/Tails_Adventures_U.mmv Now, I think the real interest in this game is in seeing what you can skip, since it's an adventure. I think the only items you absolutely need to finish the game are Remote Robot, Remote Bomb, Napalm Bomb, Large Bomb, Mine, Anti-Air Missile, Extra Speed, Rocket Booster, and 3 Chaos Emeralds or so. I know 4 Chaos Emeralds is enough to withstand the mines in the low path of Lake Rocky without Extra Armor, and I know you can also withstand them with 3 Chaos Emeralds and the Spark, but I haven't managed it with just 3 Chaos Emeralds and not the Spark yet. Maybe when I get more time... So those Chaos Emeralds should probably be Red, Green, and Purple, since Red and Green aren't out of your way at all, and you're forced to collect Purple. Now as far as speed-up items go, you can get the Speed Boots early on. Either backtrack from the Remote Robot right away, then go right back to the exit, or just exit, re-enter, and go back out the entrance, depending on whichever path is shorter; I didn't test yet. I don't know how much the Speed Boots help, though, since they only work on the ground and leave you defenseless. (The Sonic item lets you jump and attack while maintaining your speed, but it's much too far along--there's nothing essential in Caron Forest anyway.) I was considering getting the Teleport Device for levels where you just collect something and leave the way you came in, but it may lose its value due to an interesting glitch. You see, when you collect an item with the Remote Robot rather than with Tails himself, you're still allowed to use your button-1 recall function to return to Tails while the item is flashing its name. This can have some strange effects on the scenery depending on where you use it, and it can even allow Tails to fall through the scenery and exit the level, since a pit counts as an exit! There's another glitch that works against you a little bit, though. When you collect your first three items other than Chaos Emeralds, they automatically assign themselves to the next empty use slot, so you don't have to go back to your house to equip them. However, it stupidly also equips submarine items that you can't use as just plain Tails. So as you go through Cavern Island, starting with just the bare necessities of Regular Bomb, Remote Robot, and Remote Bomb, you can get the Mine, then the Napalm Bomb, but the Mine assigns itself to the fourth item slot, so the Napalm Bomb is stuck in your large inventory back at home, and worse still, the Mine still isn't assigned to the submarine yet. (You even have to equip the Vulcan Gun manually, even though it comes with the sub!) So you could either skip the Mine, get the Napalm Bomb, then backtrack to the Mine and finish the level for the Anti-Air Missile so the Napalm Bomb is equipped right away; or you could just equip the Napalm Bomb at your house, which is probably faster anyway. But if you're using Speed Boots, then none of this matters, since you picked your fourth item already. So, go ahead and have fun with this game, and tell me if you come up with a new idea.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
N._Harmonik
She/Her
Joined: 8/27/2006
Posts: 502
Location: Canada
Wish you'd post this on YouTube. I adore this game!
Why, oh, why do I even <i>try</i> to understand my own species?
Joined: 8/27/2006
Posts: 883
The playback works great, but I found that somewhere you just jump and grab the border to get up instead of flying, is it normal ?
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Yes, you can't fly over because of inconvenient wind currents. This game does that, sticking arbitrary wind in certain places to prevent you from flying across. But feel free to try that stuff out yourself; you might find something I missed. Hmm, I forgot to explain the "fast flying" trick. Basically you tap 2 to start flying right after starting a jump, but do NOT hold Up at all for a while. I think this makes you take off faster because when you start flying in mid-air, you start off with the same motion vector you just had, but during flight you tend to accelerate or decelerate toward the normal maximum flight speed in whatever direction you're pressing, or towards zero if you're not pressing any direction, rather than simply losing vertical velocity as during a jump. And I guess that its tendency toward zero is slower than its tendency toward your usual upward speed, so for a while it's better not to hold Up. That reminds me of another good strategy. Flying close to the ground is a good way to get past backwards conveyor belts quickly, so the Wrench may not be useful at all. When you're the robot, you can fly through a thin passage without landing if you stay right up against a ceiling, but you have to be careful not to get bounced back too low. This could be used to avoid having to pull out the propeller extra times. Other good things to do are to jump at corners whenever possible, since they shove you ahead if you're close enough, and to not hold Right on downward slopes because it makes you go a teensy bit faster for some reason.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Okay, big discovery. http://www.filespace.org/BagOfMagicFood/Tails_Adventures_U.mmv Notice anything strange about how I collect the speed shoes?!? So I've figured out most of the stuff you can do with the glitch; I just need to really understand it and optimize it all. However, I also did this glitch today that I don't understand at all: http://www.filespace.org/BagOfMagicFood/strangeexit.mmv Why does Tails exit the level just because he touched a corner a certain way? Is it some kind of rare 1-frame zip?
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Joined: 6/7/2006
Posts: 53
I am anxiously awaiting tricks and whatnot for this game - and a full run if someone else does it - as I plan to do a normal-speed 100% run of the game for Speed Demos Archive. (I actually tried to once, and still have that video, but I was asked to try again mainly due to my boss fights.) I could have sworn you needed the Proton Torpedo at some point in order to access Coco Island. If it turns out you do, I seriously recommend getting the Sonic powerup - those spindashes help immensely. If there's another method of destroying the blue pipe with the birds in the underwater sequence before entering Coco Island, I REALLY want to know (it'd only save ME a second or two though).
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Dude, you can just use the Vulcan Gun on that pipe thing. I'm not sure who started the rumor that you need the Proton Torpedo for it, but you don't. So since you can fall through floors and climb over ceilings with the "control both Tails and Mecha Tails" glitch, you can get the Rocket Booster without the Great Bomb, which means you can skip a whole bunch of stuff. Thus, along with the Regular Bomb, Purple Chaos Emerald, and Vulcan Gun items that you always get along the way, you only need to collect the Remote Robot, Rocket Booster, Mine, Red Chaos Emerald and Green Chaos Emerald in order to complete the game. The Speed Boots and Spark might speed up the run a little, but I need to do a couple of test runs to find out. At least I've confirmed that the Spark isn't necessary for avoiding any damage in Lake Rocky; having 40 rings is sufficient for survival. I did notice one odd thing about having the Rocket Booster early. When I finished Coocoo Island, the door to the Battle Fortress was already flashing, as it should have been. But I couldn't actually move Tails onto the level door! I had to visit his house one extra time to be able to actually enter the level. What's up with that?
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Active player (304)
Joined: 8/8/2005
Posts: 296
Location: NSW, Australia
From what I remember about playing the game myself, you have to go to Tails' House every time you switch between the ship and regular modes. The Rocket Booster level is with the ship and the next level isn't, IIRC.
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Actually, some levels switch you between modes after beating them, and Coocoo Island is one of those levels. So you're already in the Sea Fox and should be able to enter the first Battle Fortress level. Then that level takes you out of the Sea Fox to begin the next one.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Player (122)
Joined: 8/11/2009
Posts: 73
Location: Texas
Here is my attempt at the first stage (also on YouTube). None of Bag of Magic Food's links work anymore, so I am not sure if my attempt is faster. I was not able to find any glitches that allow Tails and his Remote Robot to move at the same time, nor was I able to find a glitch that allows Tails to warp by touching a corner. However, I did figure out the glitch with recalling the Remote Robot after collecting an item, and I found another way to activate it. If you release down while the Remote Robot is on an edge, it will warp back to Tails almost instantly. Different glitches will hapen depending on the distance between them, but I am not yet sure of the exact distances.
  • If Tails was on-screen or very close, the Remote Robot will reappear near him as if you used it normally. (This cannot be done by recalling it after collecting an item.)
  • At certain distances, Tails will appear where he was, but the background will be the same as it was where the Remote Robot was.
    • One time this happened, Tails was warped through a wall he was near.
  • At certain distances, usually farther than the last, Tails will be warped to near where the Remote Robot was.
  • If they were very far apart or the Remote Robot was a certain distance above Tails, he will be warped out of the stage. (I was never able to do this after recalling it from a collected item).
I also found another glitch -- on certain, seemingly random frames, you can begin flying by pressing Button 2 once. Not only do you keep more speed from your jump, but it also allows you to accelerate horizontally one frame sooner! Here are the important memory addresses I have found:
  • 0xD517 and 0xD516 are horizontal speed.
  • 0xD519 and 0xD518 are vertical speed.
  • 0xD557 and 0xD556 are the Remote Robot's horizontal speed.
  • 0xD559 and 0xD558 are the Remote Robot's vertical speed.
  • 0xD3AF and 0xD3B0 are flight stamina.
  • 0xD726 is the first boss's health.
  • 0xD8A6 is the second boss's health.
Other things to note are that Tails's horizontal speed is set to 0 when he begins flying, his vertical speed will be set to -1 if you hold up while he is flying, and it will be set to 1 if you hold down instead. The Remote Robot's horizontal speed is set to 0 when it lands after a jump, and it causes a lot of lag when it flies. The Speed Boots double Tails's speed, but they can only be used on the ground. Sonic allows Tails to move at four times his normal speed, but only if you jump immediately after using it. It would be faster to immediately go back for the Speed Boots, but glitching out of the stage does not count as beating it. I am not sure if skipping the Remote Bomb will save time. Also, I was not able to find a way past this part of Cavern Island without it.
N._Harmonik
She/Her
Joined: 8/27/2006
Posts: 502
Location: Canada
100% please! You may not get anything after the game is through but having lots of items, including the six flight-lengthening and life-meter-enlargening Chaos Emeralds shall come in handy.
Why, oh, why do I even <i>try</i> to understand my own species?
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Filespace! Noooooooooooooooo! Well, I do have some .mmv files on my hard disk still, but they desynch on choosing the first level, and I don't remember which version of Dega I used. I shouldn't have just overwritten it like that!
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Player (122)
Joined: 8/11/2009
Posts: 73
Location: Texas
If I do a 100% run, I think it would be best to glitch into Caron Forest and collect Sonic as soon as possible. We just need to find a way past this wall, but nothing I have tried has worked. (You can get through those walls by flying into them, but you will get stuck in the second block unless it was only one block wide.) Also, I forgot to mention another glitch I found before. When you push an object, it will keep moving in the same direction as long as you hold left or right. You can also push things behind Tails if he is right next to them. (The Remote Robot can only push things while it is touching them, though, and it will always push them in the direction it is moving.)
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
I might have learned something like that too, but my memory of this game is so hazy now. I had this great plan for the shortest route with least item collection thanks to glitches, but now I can hardly remember where to go or what the items do! I should at least try to track down that old version of Dega, though, so you can see what I did.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Player (122)
Joined: 8/11/2009
Posts: 73
Location: Texas
If you use the Remote Robot right after Tails collects an item, you will have control of both of them. Is that the glitch you found before, Bag of Magic Food?
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Yeah, that sounds like it. It leads to stuff like climbing into walls and falling straight out of levels, I recall. I found this list in an old text file that might help:
Normal Regular Bomb: start with
Red Chaos Emerald: Polloi Forest
Mecha Tails Remote Robot: Polloi Forest
Radio: Polloi Forest, need Mecha Tails Remote Robot
Speed Boots: Polloi Forest, need Mecha Tails Remote Robot
Pikkon Hammer: Volcanic Tunnel, need to clear Polloi Forest through straight exit
Remotecon Bomb: Volcanic Tunnel, need Mecha Tails Remote Robot and to clear Polloi Forest through straight exit
Green Chaos Emerald: Volcanic Tunnel, need Remotecon Bomb
Helmet: Polly Polly Mountain 1, need to clear Volcanic Tunnel through straight exit
Knuckles: Polly Polly Mountain 1, need to clear Volcanic Tunnel through straight exit
Super Glove: Polly Polly Mountain 1, need to clear Volcanic Tunnel through straight exit
Purple Chaos Emerald: Polly Polly Mountain 1, need to clear Volcanic Tunnel through straight exit
Vulcan Gun: Tails's House, need Purple Chaos Emerald
Mine: Cavern Island, need to clear Lake Rocky through straight exit
Napalm Bomb: Cavern Island, need to clear Lake Rocky through straight exit and Remotecon Bomb
Anti-Air Missile: Cavern Island, need to clear Lake Rocky through straight exit and Remotecon Bomb
Spark: Polloi Forest, need Napalm Bomb and Normal Regular Bomb or Remotecon Bomb or Triple Combo Bomb
Yellow Chaos Emerald: Cocoa Island, need remocon and a bomb, same for teleport
Great Large Bomb: Polly Polly Mountain 2, need to clear Lake Crystal
I can't tell if it's supposed to be the list of minimum items needed to clear the game with glitches, or just information on the items in general, but there you go. Maybe it's just the items I thought might have been helpful, but I didn't get around to pruning the list.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Player (122)
Joined: 8/11/2009
Posts: 73
Location: Texas
It seems to be an incomplete list of items and their requirements. It is missing the Blue and White Chaos Emeralds, Triple Bomb, Wrench, Teleport Device, Night Vision, Item Radar, Sonic, Fang, Proton Torpedo, Extra Speed, Extra Armor, and Rocket Booter. Many of the items on it are unnecessary, so I have no idea what it was for.
Over two years ago, Bag of Magic Food wrote:
Thus, along with the Regular Bomb, Purple Chaos Emerald, and Vulcan Gun items that you always get along the way, you only need to collect the Remote Robot, Rocket Booster, Mine, Red Chaos Emerald and Green Chaos Emerald in order to complete the game.
I think this is correct.
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
Okay, I should have just looked at my own posts then. I knew it was something like only 3 or 4 Chaos Emeralds you needed to survive that underwater place where you're supposed to have that... thing that lets you survive.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Player (122)
Joined: 8/11/2009
Posts: 73
Location: Texas
Because low% is the simplest route, I think I will do it first. This is the route I have right now:
    1: Poloy Forest
      Collect Red Chaos Emerald. Collect Remote Robot. Complete the area normally.
    2: Volcanic Tunnel
      Collect Green Chaos Emerald. Complete the area normaly.
    3: Polly Mt. 1
      Collect Rocket Booter. Complete the area normally. Collect Purple Chaos Emerald.
    4: Tails' House
      Get into the submarine without equipping anything.
    5: Lake Rocky
      Travel to Cavern Island.
    6:Cavern Island
      Collect Mine. Immediately glitch out.
    7: Tails' House
      Get into the submarine and equip Vulcan Gun / Mine / Rocket Booter / Nothing.
    8: Lake Rocky
      Travel to Coco Island.
    9: Complete the rest of the game normally.
The only changes I can think of are not using the Vulcan Gun at all or equipping things in a different order, but I have not tested them yet. I have two ideas for the any% route. One of them is just low% with a few more items, and the other one involves glitching into Caron Forest to collect Sonic and the Proton Torpedo and skipping the Mine. Unfortunately, simply shooting a torpedo at the blocks that you normally need the Mine for will not work -- we need to find a way to get an enemy near enough to curve a torpedo into the blocks (or maybe we could hit it while it is near enough for the explosion to hit the blocks). I have not finished a 100% route yet, but I did notice that the Remote Robot cannot be used in most boss rooms, which means it is not possible to skip the boss guarding the Extra Armor. In other news, I have to redo Poloy Forest because I entered it seven frames later than I could have. However, I could save one more frame by playing in Japanese (though I have no idea why, because it is the same ROM). I assume I could save one extra frame per stage selection, but I have not checked yet. Should I continue to use the English version, or should I switch to Japanese?
Player (121)
Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522
I would vote for English, unless you think Japanese will save some significant amount of time or if there is not a significant amount of text...
I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs
upthorn
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Emulator Coder, Active player (391)
Joined: 3/24/2006
Posts: 1802
I agree with alden
How fleeting are all human passions compared with the massive continuity of ducks.
Player (206)
Joined: 5/29/2004
Posts: 5712
The main difference would be the item names when you collect them, right? I guess it would be nice to English-readers to know what things are called rather than only guessing their functions from the icons.
put yourself in my rocketpack if that poochie is one outrageous dude
Player (122)
Joined: 8/11/2009
Posts: 73
Location: Texas
The only other differences I have found are that the item names, stage names, and options in Tails' House (besides "EXIT") are in Japanese, and the rectangle that appears behind an item's name when you collect it is blue. Switching to Japanese would only save about 10 frames in low% and any%, and about 25 frames in 100%. I probably should play it in English; I just thought I should mention that playing it in Japanese saves a few frames.
Player (121)
Joined: 2/11/2007
Posts: 1522
Any progress? :)
I make a comic with no image files and you should read it. While there is a lower class, I am in it, and while there is a criminal element I am of it, and while there is a soul in prison, I am not free. -Eugene Debs
Player (122)
Joined: 8/11/2009
Posts: 73
Location: Texas
Yes, but I want it to be a surprise. And you just ruined it I hate you. In other news, I think I found Bag of Magic Food's "jump into a corner and warp out of the level" glitch, but I have no idea why it happens.