Ladies and gentlemen, we present you with Tasvideos' first Quadruple run! A fcm file stores what buttons are pressed on every frame. A specific sequence of input can complete a game. It is however also possible to complete two games with a single movie file... or three games, or four. The goal of this movie is to complete Mega Man 3, Mega Man 4, Mega Man 5 and Mega Man 6 as fast as possible. It can be compared to playing four games with one controller; all games respond to the input of that single controller. Input is stopped after all four games are beaten, which happened after 140815 frames, or 39 minutes and 7 seconds. The longest currently published movie of those games is Mega Man 4, completed in 34 minutes and 34 seconds, so completing the other three games also only took 4 minutes and 33 seconds longer. Even more remarkable might be comparing this movie with the first Mega Man 4 run which completes the game in 39 minutes and 45 seconds, or the first Mega Man 5 run which completes the game in 40 minutes and 28 seconds.
Our goal wasn't just to produce a movie file which completes all four game, we gave our total commitment, heart and soul to make all games "fast as possible". Sometimes we had to deal with desyncs (when for instance the movie only played back three games correctly) and had to redo a segment. We played segments of 4000 frames each time, and then it was the others turn to play. After each segment we checked for desyncs, and luckily we seldom ran into desync issues. There were also sometimes difficult situations in the games, but these were all dealt with in their own ways (check the 'Techniques' section for how we avoided some of these difficulties). Even though we made this TAS ourselves, we often seem to notice new things when watching it again. This is probably because when making the movie, we had to do everything frame by frame. You will probably also see stuff you didn't notice the first time, when watching it a second time.
  • FCEU 0.98.16
  • Aims for fastest time
  • Takes damage to save time
  • Four games in one movie
  • Manipulates luck
  • Uses no passwords
  • Abuses programming errors in the game
  • Genre: Action
  • Genre: Platform

Movie playback

To play back the movie on the emulator, you must do the following:
  • Download FCEU 0.98.16
  • Open the emulator four times, and align them
  • Load the four Mega Man games and pause them
  • Enable Background Input (at config), if it was already enabled when FCEU started, disable it first, and enable it again (it
will automatically enable Run In Background
  • Load the movie file at all FCEU's (note that it will only give a correct ROM checksum for one of the games)
  • Unpause (with a hotkey... background input will make all games unpause at the same time)

Why this?

We have thought about what game we were going to do for quite some time. There was this idea floating around at the time of a single movie which completed all six Mega Man games. It was probably more like a joke than a serious idea. We wanted to do a big project, since we can both be very productive when we put our minds to it, so completing all six Mega Man games in one movie was one of the ideas we considered. At first it was also as a joke, but then we thought it would be pretty cool if it actually happened. There are however several reasons why we didn't include Mega Man 1 and Mega Man 2 in this TAS.
First of all, a single movie which completes multiple games is only meaningful if the games actually look like each other. If a single movie plays Pinball and Adventures of Lolo it will not be visible that it is the same input which completes the games. Watching them at the same time would be pointless, because the movements don't correlate. You might as well watch them separately, and then you would just be watching two runs that are less optimal as they could have been. Mega Man 1 and Mega Man 2 are different from the other four NES Mega Man games for several reasons. For instance, the currently published Mega Man 1 run takes about 15 minutes to finish, and the currently published Mega Man 2 run about 25 minutes. This is a lot less than the other four, which all take over 30 minutes.
Another big difference is the fact that Mega Man 3 through 6 are able to slide, which makes the gameplay quite different. The gameplay is quite different anyway, since Mega Man 1 and Mega Man 2 TASes are based on glitches. Then there is the option of pressing select in Mega Man 1. Select doesn't have a function at other Mega Man games, so the select button would be used all the time, resulting in something that won't be pretty to watch. We must admit that even in this movie, with four games it is sometimes difficult to spot that it's all from a single sequence of input... but this would even be worse if the other two Mega Man games were added.
Then there is a practical reason for not doing six games; it would be even harder to watch than four games. Four games can form a grid of two by two. With six games, the grid would have to be three by two, which would make it absolutely improssible to pay attention to the rightmost and leftmost games at the same time. When watching on full screen, the bottom and top of the screen wouldn't contain anything, so then it would be a lot smaller too.
Another good reason for not doing all six Mega Man games is the fact that the more games you add, the crappier the gameplay will become. The more games you add, the less perfect the movie will turn out. The movies will be less accurate and longer. Lastly, we must admit, it would also be more difficult to TAS six games at the same time. It would require concentrating on six runs at the same time. We also had more knowledge of the Mega Man 3, 4, 5 and 6 glitches and tricks than we did for Mega Man 1 and Mega man 2. This is however not the reason why we didn't do all six, those reasons are listed above ;)

Techniques

This section discusses techniques that are specifically for multiple Mega Man TASing. How certain specific game tricks and glitches work won't be discussed here.
Lag is a key factor that made it possible to do certain actions without interfering with other games. Lag is created when too much is happening on the screen. The game will freeze sometimes for a frame, and during this frame, no input will be accepted for that game. During this frame, we are able to stuff like stopping a jump, shooting, or pressing start to go to the menu, without affecting the game where the lag occured. Lag can be experienced in normal playing by the game slowing down. We sometimes deliberately created lag, by shooting, or moving a lot, in order to perform certain actions like switching to the start menu.
Another great help were the cutscenes. In between the levels, or when a room is scrolling, the game is obviously not affected by any input given. These were especially useful to move left or right in some games when needed. Also for switching to the item menu obviously. It is nearly impossible to create lag for 3 games, and not for the fourth game, in order to go to the item menu in that game. Often, a combination of lag and cutscenes was used to go to the start screen. Sometimes our strategy allowed multiple games to go to the menu, which also made it easier. Mega Man 4 provides another option, since this game won't be affected by pressing start when Mega Man is sliding.
Of course, completing an entire 'left-room' takes longer than it takes for a screen to scroll. Often, we tried to make the game that has to move left face left, while the others face right. This can for instance be done in a frame of lag at other games. When dropping down into a 'left-room', it is good to face left for a frame, right before the screen starts scrolling.
When the screen is scrolling down, the other games are able to progress to the right. After the screen is done scrolling, it is possible to move left in the left-room, and still move right in the other games, with sliding by pressing down+A. This doesn't change the direction of megaman, which makes it possible to move in different directions in different games. A nice example of this comes early in the run, when Mega Man 5 drops down in the second room of starman (the first level). It doesn't always work however. When Mega Man needs to jump in such a room, left will have to be pushed, which is why sometimes the other Mega Mans are affected. Mega Man 6 can avoid this a little, since megaman6 will move left when you press left and right at the same time. The other Mega Man games won't move, so it is easier to movie left with Mega Man 6 than with other Mega Man games. If you stop walking, Mega Man will take a few frames to get in his final standing position. During these frames, it's also sometimes possible to press left without changing megamans direction.
This short time it takes for Mega Man to position himself after running was also used in other occasions. For example when one of the games has to jump to the left, and it was possible to keep another Mega Man which didn't need to move to the left on the ground. If pressing left is skipped for a frame, the Mega Man on the ground will position himself for like ten frames, so he won't move to the left. The Mega Man who is moving to the left will only stop moving for one frame since he is on the air. It was also used at instances where Mega Man had to move on a rushjet to the left, and a lot when multiple boss battles where going on at the same time.
There are also several ways to make differences in jumping. If two games have to make a big jump, we tried to do them both at the same time, since you can't start a new jump when the other is still pressing the A button. Often though, when only one game has to make a big jump, it is better not to jump with the other games. The game that has to make a big jump will reach a ladder or a platform, and can move on. The other games will be high in the air at that point. If they avoid the jump, they can make a slide right after that one game is done jumping, since they are on the ground then, instead of in the air. Avoiding a jump can be done for instance if there is a frame of lag at the game that has to do the jump. Not pressing A at this frame will stop the jump for the other games, while the jump continues for the game that has to jump, if A is pressed right away after the frame of lag. If the others are already on the ground, such a frame of lag in the game that jumps will allow the other games to make a slide. Differences in the height of a jump can also avoid jumping in certain games. Mega Man 3 will generally land sooner for instance. Jumping from a slide will also sometimes allow not jumping in certain games. Mega Man 6 will not jump right away from a slide. If Mega Man 6 has to jump, and the others not, you can press A for 1 frame, then release, so the others will stop jumping. They are still in the air, but megaman6 will be on the ground, since pressing A only stopped the slide. If you now wait a frame, you will be able to make a big jump with megaman6. Similarly, megaman6 can avoid a jump when it's sliding. Megaman3 also has a differences in sliding than the other games. Mega Man 3 will not make a jump right after the sliding has started. The only way to stop the slide is to walk in the opposite direction. This also is an easy way to avoid a jump in megaman3. After Mega Man 3 is over this first half of the slide where you can't jump, there is a second part of the slide where everything will make megaman jump, even pressing down+A. This is why megaman3 sometimes accidently jumps when the other megamans start a new slide (good thing that megaman3's one frame jump is very short though). This however also creates a great chance to make a jump with megaman3, and not with the others. Pressing down+A will make megaman3 jump if it's in the second part of its slide, while all other Mega Man games will never start a jump when down+A is pressed. As you can notice from this, Mega Man 4 and 5 move pretty much the same.

(Baxter) Thanks

  • I'd like to thanks everyone who showed interest in this run. The people on the irc channel, the ones who posted in the forum topic, and even those who just followed the topic. Every new reply caused hundreds of views to the topic, which showed many people were interested. This was a great motivation.
  • DeHackEd, for encoding the wips we released at the start of this run.
  • Most of all, I'd like to thank AngerFist. I can say without a doubt he is the most enthusiastic member of this community. He was constantly motivating, and I couldn't have made/finished this movie without him. He is a great TASing partner, and a very good friend.

(AngerFist) Thanks

The long journey is finally over. I have literally no words to express how greatful I am that this huge project is finally over. Of course I will first thank and bow down to my very special friend and partner, Baxter. I wholeheartedly cannot imagine how I would have done this without you. Folks, Baxter did not only contribute to the run, he also helped me go through that very dark and depressing week when we initially began working on this run. Would also thank the people who showed true support during that week. You know who you are: moozooh, Fabian, Vatchern, Vandal, Asteron, Truncated, Cardboard etc. Secondly, I would love to take this opportunity and dedicate our run to the 3 communities who have inspired me incredibly a lot in so many positive ways. They have always kept and still keep producing fine and entertaning runs during these years. I salute TASVideos, Speeddemosarchive and Metroid2002.com. Much love and respect for these communities. Stay strong!
More elaborate, the people I look up to, respect and enjoy watching their respective runs are: Baxter, Mike Uyama, Paul 'Bartendorsparky' Evans, James 'Psychochild' Conway, Patrik 'Cremator' Salonen, Silent Echo, kip, Megatherium, Marshmallow, Shin, JXQ, Fabian, Shinryuu, Phil, adelikat, Genisto, Bisqwit, FODA, Spezzafer, Stanski, DjGrenola, Kazooie, Atma, SprintGod, flagitious,hero of the day, Arc, Arne the Great, Walker Boh, DeHackEd!, Sleepz, NITSUJA :) Finalfighter, I can go on and on...

adelikat: The votes have been numerous and heavily on the yes side of things. It is a run that is unique and required immense effort to make. I am accepting this movie for publication.

DeHackEd: This movie will be published pending a way for me to break the site's publication rules without angering Bisqwit too much.


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Former player
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 1711
I watched 7 or 8 minutes of this. I didn't like it personally. If this was to be published as a concept demo, I'd be voting yes. I don't see that happening, all things considered, so I'm voting no. It's a nice accomplishment though, Angerfist and Baxter. Also, the other megaman dual run should be moved to concept demos, bla bla you've already heard this I know.
Zoey Ridin' High <Fabian_> I prett much never drunk
SXL
Joined: 2/7/2005
Posts: 571
taken individually, the 4 runs are not that interesting, but since I don't like the megaman series, I won't vote because of that. though, I did not like the quad run, because it does not look enough that the games share the same input. if more movements were synchronized, or if the input was clearly displayed, it'd be worth publishing, but as of now, I will not vote. if no input is displayed, I will vote no.
I never sleep, 'cause sleep is the cousin of death - NAS
Joined: 11/15/2004
Posts: 804
Location: Canada
I just watched the AVI. The MMX1 and 2 run is one of my favorites. I can watch both games at once and easily see that Mega Man is doing the same things in both games. This quad game run is another story. I can't watch all four games at once, so I have to pick whether I want to watch the top, bottom, left or right two games. Now that there are four games, at any given time Mega Man may be facing left in the top two games and right in the bottom two, so it's hard to tell that they're even being played from the same FCM. They no longer synch in a way that makes it obvious, so I have to take it on faith. I find that I just can't watch and enjoy this many games at once. It's an astounding technical accomplishment, but I can't say that I find it entertaining. Sorry. I think I'll sit this vote out.
TASing or playing back a DOS game? Make sure your files match the archive at RGB Classic Games.
Ren
Joined: 12/20/2005
Posts: 46
As a concept... incredible. Entertainment value? Excluding the horrible sounds (how about mixing & matching (like, say, pick one stage music to play with and then change to the first boss that comes along. It would really help with perceiving this to be a joint-TAS). I still have to join my voice with those who think this doesn't really look like it's being played with a single input. Mostly it looks like 4 megaman games being played like a race... with the occasional getting stuck to a wall and jumping randomly. :P Maybe an animated NES pad in the center with lights to display when a button is being pressed? I was thinking about this when I saw the megamanx+megamanx2 one.
Joined: 3/15/2007
Posts: 131
Could I make a suggestion that in the published run the controller input is shown? I think that if people can see the single controller doing everything they might be more interested or engaged.
Joined: 5/22/2006
Posts: 58
Location: Denver, CO USA
well, i just watched this one, and I have to say this, if I had the dedication to achieve something of this caliber, then I would be a completely different person that I am. Regardless of what actually happened on screen didn't even seem to matter while I was watching it, all I could think about was "wtf, i can't believe they actually carried through with this all the way to the end." That said, I didn't quite carry on all the way to the end, but I'm going to go ahead and vote yes simply for admiration of your determination and patience. It's almost like publishing the work of two really hard working scientists who managed to clone the world's first human, only it was a fat chick. I know it's really fucking cool and a testament to your talent, skill, creativity, etc....but i don't really wanna look. That doesn't mean the work shouldn't be documented in some journal for others to learn from and admire.
What would Mr Belvedere do? Probably eat some butter.
Former player
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 1711
"It's almost like publishing the work of two really hard working scientists who managed to clone the world's first human, only it was a fat chick." :) This is awesome <3
Zoey Ridin' High <Fabian_> I prett much never drunk
Former player
Joined: 8/17/2004
Posts: 377
After finally watching the movie (thanks so much for the AVI, DeHackEd) I'll have to vote yes just on the merit of it being a marvelous achievement. The movie DID become very hard to follow, it was difficult to may attention to more than two windows at once. It was almost impossible to tell it was all from the same input, and I really wouldn't have been able to tell if I didn't KNOW it to be the case. It kind of falters here compared to the MMX1-2 movie which did make it easier to see it was from the same input. Then there's the audio, but really, NOTHING can be done about that. It's just a shame that the four final bosses couldn't be lined up at the same time, it was a bit distracting to see all the other three games end, with MM4 still fighting Wily, but it's enough that this worked out as well as it did. Anyway, bravo on the achievement.
nesrocks
He/Him
Player (247)
Joined: 5/1/2004
Posts: 4096
Location: Rio, Brazil
If this had been done by me, I would have done some fooling around and funny stuff on the faster games so they would all end on the same exact frame. I think that ending each one as fast as possible is a waste of entertainment possibilities. But the movie was VERY impressive as a TAS, and must be really great to megaman fans. It is of course a YES vote.
SXL
Joined: 2/7/2005
Posts: 571
a simple test to see if the movie is worth publishing. show it to other, non TAS-familiar people. try to explain them that this movie is interesting because it shares the same input for the 4 games. you will end up with questions like : "are you sure ?" or "it's not obvious, too bad it does not show more" or even "if you didn't tell me, I wouldn't have known, so it's not that interesting", etc. therefore, I vote for a forced input display on every 4 screens : it will show that it's the same for the 4, even if the person did not read the description (and assume people never do, as most views are from outside the site), and it could be read from any screen (an unique input display would be difficult to follow).
I never sleep, 'cause sleep is the cousin of death - NAS
Joined: 12/28/2004
Posts: 210
My only advice is to put it on full screen, sit reeeeeally far back, and put the volume at a faint whisper. The less peripheral vision that you have to use, the better. There's alot more times where all 4 megamans do identicle moves than you think. Yes vote for me, I'm gonna watch this one plenty of times.
KennyMan666
He/Him
Joined: 8/24/2005
Posts: 375
Location: Göteboj
I'm giving this a yes vote. It was very impressive. I found that if I concentrated on any two games, I could more often than not see that it was the same input. I think I'm going to have to watch this five more times, though - four times concentrating on one game each with the other in peripheral vision, and the fifth trying to watch the thing as a whole again. But, yeah. Awesome work, Fisty and Bax.
Det man inte har i begåvning får man ta ut i energi. "I think I need to get to Snoop Dogg's level of high to be able to research this post." -Samsara Read my fanfic, One Piece: Pure Corruption
Skilled player (1410)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
Thanks for all the responses. I agree that the movie is hard to follow, and I can fully understand the people who voted no because of this (no to the question, "Did you like watching the movie?" that is).
SLX wrote:
a simple test to see if the movie is worth publishing
To me, this sounds like suggesting it shouldn't be published, which kinda saddens me. Saying it's not worth publishing is something I don't quite understand.
Fabian wrote:
If this was to be published as a concept demo [...] Also, the other megaman dual run should be moved to concept demos
I agree that both runs should be in the concept demo section (as well as some other runs which aren't right now).
Tub wrote:
avi that contains only the sound-effects
That would be awesome... but impossible :(
Tub wrote:
display the input, maybe somewhat like this
Yeah, that looks about what I was thinking off. It would have to be made first though
Tub wrote:
explain the concept in more detail prior to the movie. This is not a regular speedrun and (imho) warrants an introductory paragraph.
I'm not really sure, but I think the concept is explained pretty well in the first paragraph. Is there anything specifically you wanted to see added?
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1286
Location: Finland
Baxter wrote:
Saying it's not worth publishing is something I don't quite understand.
The purpose of the site is to produce entertaining movies, not showcase experimental concepts that are not entertaining. I can see why people think that not entertaining = not worth publishing.
Former player
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 1711
Baxter, you don't understand how someone can think this is not worth publishing, really? I don't think it's worth publishing. That's why I voted no. I don't know what to tell you if you really don't understand how I can think this. (Note: Make it a concept demo and I think it's worth publishing)
Zoey Ridin' High <Fabian_> I prett much never drunk
Skilled player (1410)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
Kyrsimys wrote:
The purpose of the site is to produce entertaining movies, not showcase experimental concepts that are not entertaining.
There are 35 yes votes, and 5 no votes to the question "Did you like watching this movie?" (at this point). I think that should be considered when you say the movie is not worth publishing. Saying it shouldn't be published ignores that over 85% of the people liked watching the movie.
Fabian wrote:
I don't think it's worth publishing. That's why I voted no. I don't know what to tell you if you really don't understand how I can think this. (Note: Make it a concept demo and I think it's worth publishing)
Err... All I read here is that you do think it should be published, just like me, since I also agree it should be in the concept demo section... Like I said, I fully understand people voting no, but saying it shouldn't be published is something quite different.
Former player
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 1711
Baxter wrote:
Kyrsimys wrote:
The purpose of the site is to produce entertaining movies, not showcase experimental concepts that are not entertaining.
There are 35 yes votes, and 5 no votes to the question "Did you like watching this movie?" (at this point). I think that should be considered when you say the movie is not worth publishing. Saying it shouldn't be published ignores that over 85% of the people liked watching the movie.
Fabian wrote:
I don't think it's worth publishing. That's why I voted no. I don't know what to tell you if you really don't understand how I can think this. (Note: Make it a concept demo and I think it's worth publishing)
Err... All I read here is that you do think it should be published, just like me, since I also agree it should be in the concept demo section... Like I said, I fully understand people voting no, but saying it shouldn't be published is something quite different.
If that's all you read, you missed the part where I said I don't think it should be published. Sorry to sound like a dickhead but I don't know what else to say here.
Zoey Ridin' High <Fabian_> I prett much never drunk
Skilled player (1410)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
Fabian wrote:
If that's all you read, you missed the part where I said I don't think it should be published.
If it is in the concept demo section, it doesn't count as published?
Former player
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 1711
Baxter wrote:
Fabian wrote:
If that's all you read, you missed the part where I said I don't think it should be published.
If it is in the concept demo section, it doesn't count as published?
Yes. However, it's not in the concept demo section. Presumably, that is.
Zoey Ridin' High <Fabian_> I prett much never drunk
Former player
Joined: 4/16/2004
Posts: 1286
Location: Finland
Baxter wrote:
There are 35 yes votes, and 5 no votes to the question "Did you like watching this movie?" (at this point). I think that should be considered when you say the movie is not worth publishing. Saying it shouldn't be published ignores that over 85% of the people liked watching the movie.
I don't base my opinion on whether something should be published on its popularity, the only thing I think about is whether I think it's good enough to be published. Here's a totally unrelated question: if (when) this gets published, do you think that the site should accept (quality) quadruns in general? Or is this a special case?
Joined: 2/16/2005
Posts: 462
Kyrsimys wrote:
Here's a totally unrelated question: if (when) this gets published, do you think that the site should accept (quality) quadruns in general? Or is this a special case?
This site already has a precedence for publishing multi-game runs. In my opinion whatever criteria was used to accept dehacked's X+X2 entry should be applied to this run as well.
This signature is much better than its previous version.
Skilled player (1410)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
Kyrsimys wrote:
Here's a totally unrelated question: if (when) this gets published, do you think that the site should accept (quality) quadruns in general? Or is this a special case?
I think this can only be judged for every movie seperately. But of course it is possible that if a (other) quadrun is good enough, that it is published. It would be stupid to say no other quadrun movies could be accepted, since even you might be voting yes to a quadrun movie (well, it's theoretically possible ;) ). It should obviously make sense that it should be a quality movie, and generally liked by the audience.
Asteron wrote:
In my opinion whatever criteria was used to accept dehacked's X+X2 entry should be applied to this run as well.
There is quite a difference. If I'm not mistaken the main goal of the X+X2 run was to have 1 movie file which completes both games. The goal of this run is to complete these four games as fast as possible.
Joined: 10/31/2004
Posts: 62
I was originally going to say no but if you take the idea of concentrating on 2 movies at time then it is entertaining. Setting up the movie or focusing on which windows to watch is something the viewer has to solve on their own and shouldnt be included in if the actual run is entertaining.
SXL
Joined: 2/7/2005
Posts: 571
to me, publishing a movie in the concept demo section does not really count. namely, this movie is interesting only if you have been told that it shares the same input for the 4 games, not because you can see it, which it too hard to do in my opinion. casual viewers will have trouble to understand the concept. just watching this has fewer chances to entertain them. the audience of this movie seems limited to me. that's what the concept demo is for, and I never voted no for this destination, in fact I'm ok with that, just that it's not enough entertaining. just imagine some random guy watching this on youtube (intro probably cropped...), will he understand ?
I never sleep, 'cause sleep is the cousin of death - NAS
Player (217)
Joined: 2/12/2006
Posts: 373
Location: Oregon
SXL wrote:
this movie is interesting only if you have been told that it shares the same input for the 4 games, not because you can see it, which it too hard to do in my opinion. casual viewers will have trouble to understand the concept. just watching this has fewer chances to entertain them. the audience of this movie seems limited to me. that's what the concept demo is for, and I never voted no for this destination, in fact I'm ok with that, just that it's not enough entertaining. just imagine some random guy watching this on youtube (intro probably cropped...), will he understand ?
Quoted for truth. I also voted yes, but only because I think it's an interesting concept demo. Some people may like sensory overload, but I can see from the posts here that there are some people who think that there's too much of that in this run. And yeah, it oftentimes looks like there's different inputs being made in the four windows, so it just looks like four badly done runs. It's easier to keep track of what's going on in DeHackEd's two-game run, and there isn't quite as much of that "sensory overload" that some people don't like. Four games simultaneously is a bit much, though.
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