Wind magic might even do more damage to him. I did about 40 some damage to him with the Large Cutter attack.
I tried out wind but I couldn't take 40. The only thing that really took damage was fire. I will give some more tests to wind though, taking 40 would be pretty shweet. o-o
edit: Large cutter does take between 29-32 normally. Thank you so much for pointing that out! I think it will simply be faster...using fire 3 took almost that much and limited it to 9 turns. Large cutter brings that down to 8 turns if I do it right...and it might save me earlier on with some enemies. Very awesome. Looks like I have to do another test...heheh...
Edit 2: I tested out wind and it seems like all of the enemies I use on the way to level up my wind is resistant to it. Seems like no point to save one turn on Solvering if I have to gain 5 in normal battles to get elements strong enough. Gonna stick with fire.
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
DonamerDragon wrote:
power staff is totally useless unless you actually use a staff...unless I am doing it wrong...heh...
I thought Power Staff charges your melee (since you melee with the staff, afterall). Confirm/Deny.
I eagerly await a new test run using Wind, but I'll still watch this one.
e: Well, at least we know that Earth isn't the way to go up to this point! So how much damage does melee incur on Solvaring?
power staff is totally useless unless you actually use a staff...unless I am doing it wrong...heh...
I thought Power Staff charges your melee (since you melee with the staff, afterall). Confirm/Deny.
I eagerly await a new test run using Wind, but I'll still watch this one.
e: Well, at least we know that Earth isn't the way to go up to this point! So how much damage does melee incur on Solvaring?
I tested wind, which will be slower because the enemies on the way to Solvering are resistant to wind, making it slower in the end. I didn't even bother finishing the test. I was on the first enemy and it took five turns instead of 4...and I still had to fight that enemy 5 more times with unpowered fire or earth which normally defeats them well enough. What melee are you talking about though? I played this game a lot and I don't even know what you're talking about...
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
When you walk up to an enemy, the staff icon appears above you or them. You press a button, and your character swings the staff at them, causing direct non-element damage. That is a melee attack.
Like I said, I remember it doing a lot more damage than most spells in the beginning of the game. I could be wrong, since I don't think I ever dumped all my points in to one element before Solvaring like you are, but it's worth at least seeing how much damage it does (un/modified).
When you walk up to an enemy, the staff icon appears above you or them. You press a button, and your character swings the staff at them, causing direct non-element damage. That is a melee attack.
Like I said, I remember it doing a lot more damage than most spells in the beginning of the game. I could be wrong, since I don't think I ever dumped all my points in to one element before Solvaring like you are, but it's worth at least seeing how much damage it does (un/modified).
Fortunately having Cheat Engine is saving me ungodly amounts of time in testing. If I want the elements to be different all I have to do is change them..so I've tried a lot of combos. I also tried melee attack on the first enemies. Requires a third turn on the enemy because of 1 HP :(
Fire is fastest so far. I am going to go with it. I think I will begin the optimizing process. I will save several turns on the field leveling up fire. Then I think I will level up earth so I can get avalanche and shield...at least shield will be needed later on because some attacks from bosses seem completely unavoidable. I will test this though...
Alrightie! Here is the first official optimized WIP. It's about 10 seconds faster then my last test, so I must have done something right..heh. Everything was pretty smooth going until the Solvering battle. No matter what I did I couldn't get that darn lvl. 3 fire to hit all three times every time! If I could have I would have saved one turn. Big deal right? It bothered me so much! I came to within 9 HP of saving that turn, but it's like the game knows I am going to do it or something. I can't crack this game when it comes to boss battles. Everything is predetermined for quite a few turns. The only thing that effects things it getting hit. Not even entering the battle at different frames did any good.
In the end I went for entertainment. I think I could have gotten 15 fire spirits and only had lvl 2 fire for Solvering. That I think would have taken me 14 turns or 4 more then I took...versus the 7 battle turns I took to get the extra spirit. Solvering is such a boring battle that I don't think there will be any objections to taking entertainment over speed. I could be wrong of course. Taking one route versus the other might save 10 seconds or so, but you have to admit that seeing Solvering get obliterated in 10 turns is much more entertaining? I also went for dramatic effect with HP and MP. I could have gone without going down to 1 HP and I sacrificed 3 frames to use my last 3 MP. Who wants to see someone with magic left? Heh. Well I hope you guys enjoy! Please tell me what you think!
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/5536/Quest64USAOP1.m64
were there no wings available at that first inn?
I seem to remember most inns giving out wings so you can warp back faster then suicide.
I'm fairly sure you have to be out of the forest to use them. Therefor it is faster to death warp. He did that in the SDA run, actually got the wings and never used them.
I watched it and I'm deeply confused about the choices made. How come you miss enemies on several occassions? initally I thought the game has desynced but it came apparent that it wasn't the case. Is all that weird movement in field areas to avoid battles or to manipulate a better battle in the near future?
One time, I accidentaly bumped this game, and it froze. The next time I played, the file was still there. I entered it, and right when I started, it let me choose about 20 spirit gem powerups. I was still near the beginning of the game. I can't remember where I was, what I did, and how many gems I got to choose. My game is really old, though. I hope you can even do this on an emulator.
Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
Sounds kind of crooked-cart-esk.. if thats the case, there is no way to emulate that at all.
Besides, the whole point of a tas is to use tools to play a game at its limit leaving the world in tact. this would violate this to some extent.
I watched it and I'm deeply confused about the choices made. How come you miss enemies on several occassions? initally I thought the game has desynced but it came apparent that it wasn't the case. Is all that weird movement in field areas to avoid battles or to manipulate a better battle in the near future?
Misses in this game seem totally unavoidable in boss battles from what I can see. As hard as I tried and for as long as I tried that was the best possible thing I could get. I can't even believe I got Solvering in 10 turns. Initially I couldn't get fire lvl 3 to land all three more then one time!
My seemingly crazy movements avoid enemies and also make the battles faster to escape from later on. Without some of those crazy movements it would have taken 3+ turns to escape that battle.
The misses on the death warp battle were strange. Seems like if I missed them they would hit me. Those missed hits were on purpose though because the enemies were able to kill me faster.
One time, I accidentaly bumped this game, and it froze. The next time I played, the file was still there. I entered it, and right when I started, it let me choose about 20 spirit gem powerups. I was still near the beginning of the game. I can't remember where I was, what I did, and how many gems I got to choose. My game is really old, though. I hope you can even do this on an emulator.
As cool as that would be to be able to find a glitch like that, I doubt shaking my hard drive will make the game mess up that nicely...That is awesome though. o-o
AKA man, I'm so glad you decided to join in and question my tactics! It was bothering me so much that I kept missing that I tried again...and again...and again...and again. Finally after about 6 hours I found one more way of manipulating luck and it became the only way I was able to shorten the battle by one turn! Awesome dude. The Solvering battle is now one turn shorter! I obliterate him in only 9 turns. To top it all off I was able to avoid one more enemy battle on the field. This saved about 2 seconds or so. This new run is 9.7 seconds faster.
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/5583/Quest64USAop2.m64
Testing both routes, getting the 5 or 6 spirits costs about a minute and a half. Given my low earth level and the fact that I need it decently high, I think I'm gonna go for it. Path chosen. Seems as though the thread is dying off. If anyone has any input let me know, otherwise I will just continue. :)
Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA
Don't worry, the only dead threads are the Castlevania ones in need of "necromantic revivals"
Having never played the game before I can't offer input... watched the test run and looked pretty good, I'll most likely watch it if submitted, and you probably know how supportive I am of N64 TASing :-)
Don't worry, the only dead threads are the Castlevania ones in need of "necromantic revivals"
Having never played the game before I can't offer input... watched the test run and looked pretty good, I'll most likely watch it if submitted, and you probably know how supportive I am of N64 TASing :-)
Hehe, well that makes me feel better. It's certainly nice to know someone has watched it. >_>
I'm am very sure by now that this will at least be a decent TAS because I think everyone and their brother knows how sucky the battles are and how many there are...
I'm am very sure by now that this will at least be a decent TAS because I think everyone and their brother knows how sucky the battles are and how many there are...
Ha. No doubt. I rented this damn thing 5 times and never beat it, so I'll definitely be looking forward to seeing the game get trounced. I can't even run Mupen, so I haven't been following the thread.
Good luck, though. :)
*wanders off*
Joined: 5/2/2006
Posts: 1020
Location: Boulder, CO
I look foreward to seeing a run like this go heavy on fire, since the most practical thing to do if you are plaing in real time is focus on earth/water.
I dont even think I have seen the higher lever fire spells.
Ha. No doubt. I rented this damn thing 5 times and never beat it, so I'll definitely be looking forward to seeing the game get trounced. I can't even run Mupen, so I haven't been following the thread.
Good luck, though. :)
*wanders off*
*laughs* Yeah my parents actually bought this game for me, it took me forever to beat! TASing this game is taking just a little longer then it takes to beat the game normally. It doesn't even feel like I'm wasting my time manipulating battles...heh
Twelvepack wrote:
I look foreward to seeing a run like this go heavy on fire, since the most practical thing to do if you are plaing in real time is focus on earth/water.
I dont even think I have seen the higher lever fire spells.
I decided to keep going with Earth as the realtime run did. The earth higher spells are very highly effective against later monsters. I overkill on fire in the beginning to pound on Solvering who takes forever with rock lvl 1 x-x
Ugh, miner setback. Finished Glencoe forest exactly how I wanted, and even picked up an extra spirit that I didn't see the SDA runner grab. I needed it anyway. The setback comes when I head toward the darn ship. I spent a few hours TASing in the wrong direction! I went in an entire circle and ended up back at conner forest. Man this game sucks for that, even knowing the route and still getting turned around. Oh well, so I'll start again when I can. I'll show a WIP when I get to the ship, as it's a good ref point to the SDA run.
Whew, thanks for the support Zurreco. I worked on this for quite a long time...I can't get it any better. I tried for at least 7 hours to get only two enemy encounters from Glencoe Forest to the ship...but man did I fail. My luck manipulation I think is getting pretty good. The game eventually puts your chance at A battle to 100% when I get to a certain coordinate. I can switch the battles up and get any battle I want but avoiding them no matter how much I manipulate becomes IMPOSSIBLE. This is my run so far, Optimized to the ship toward the West Carmagh area.
My time up to this point: 21m 15s
Time to this point on SDA run: 40m 14s
47.2% faster. I still think I will finish the game at 1H 45M. I want to see how close I actually get...heh
http://dehacked.2y.net/microstorage.php/info/5742/Quest64USAop3.m64
