Topic by sean.brockest

Posted: 12/2/2004 8:04 PM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

Outrageous was added. I bumped on some bullets and hammer throwers, unfortunately it were not enough to collect 1UP :( New video is here

Posted: 12/2/2004 8:55 PM

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pilif

Joined: 6/15/2004
Posts: 104
Location: Zürich / Switzerland

Hello, first: Just the day before yesterday I played tubular again on my GBA (it's the only level where I still don't have all yoshi's coins) and it was very impressing seening you do it. It looks so easy that way... Well done!

VIPer7 wrote:

Outrageous was added. I bumped on some bullets and hammer throwers, unfortunately it were not enough to collect 1UP :(

It very much looks like you could have hit the last hammer brother which I thnik would have awarded you with that 1UP. But I may be mistaken here. Philip

Posted: 12/2/2004 10:59 PM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

@pilif: Getting the 5 dragon coins in Tubular should be pretty easy with the blue Yoshi, isn't it? And no, I can not hit the last hammer brother in Outrageous, because after I bump on the last bullet I get pushed up so high that only pressing the forward button would get me down sooner (and that costs time...) Funky was really annoying to do. Almost everytime when I bump on an enemy, I get pushed into an obstacle, and if this is not the case, then I just don't get enough height to fly over an obstacle later on. So now I ended up just flying over everything for the first half of the level (staying as close to the ground as possible) In the middle of the level the football chuck blocks the small entrance, so I had to stop the flight and get rid of him. However this method (normal flying -> slowing down -> flying up again) is still a lot faster than using the spin-flight. At the end I tried to collect as many coins as possible, it might not be the ideal, but I was a bit too frustrated to try out every possibility now :P Maybe I'll give it another try tomorrow Anyway, Special World is completed now, if nobody finds a flaw in it I will continue with the Donut Plains secret levels tomorrow. The video can be downloaded here, watch and comment please! :)

Posted: 12/2/2004 11:48 PM

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Michael_Fried

Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

Is it possible to fly over the big pipe?

Posted: 12/3/2004 12:02 AM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

I just checked it in Lunar Magic, the pipe goes up to the very top of the screen

Posted: 12/3/2004 2:56 AM

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Michael_Fried

Former player

Joined: 3/8/2004
Posts: 1107

I just checked it in Lunar Magic, the pipe goes up to the very top of the screen Why does that matter? Can't Mario go above the top of the screen in this level? I just tried using a high jump PAR code and I was able to get over the pipe, so I think you could save a little time by flying over it.

Posted: 12/3/2004 7:41 AM

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Bladegash

Former player

Joined: 3/9/2004
Posts: 484
Location:

No objects can be placed above the top of the level, they'd just loop to the bottom of the next 'screen.' You can even fly over goalposts if you're offscreen like that. =P It would be an interesting way to finish that Choco Island level at least.

Posted: 12/3/2004 3:25 PM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

Ok thx a lot for clearing this up, I didn't know this. I managed to fly over the pipe, that saved 19 frames. Now I'm flying above the visible screen for more than 10 seconds, kinda boring, but I wasn't able to do something interesting at the ground anyway. At the end I collected 4 coins more, that's the best I could get. Lost a few frames in the Star Road beam, so in the end this was a 16 frames improvement I hexed the Special World levels into the complete movie, so now you can download the full movie here. 44 levels from reset till finishing the Special World, more than 35 minutes long :) I'll now start a new movie beginning in Donut Plains 2 b

Posted: 12/3/2004 4:07 PM

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Truncated

Editor, Reviewer, Experienced player (979)

Joined: 4/17/2004
Posts: 3109
Location: Sweden

I have a question. Is flying faster than running at full speed, or are they equal? I'm asking because there are a lot of spinning platforms which you fly over, running on these as they move right could save some pixels. Unless flying is faster than running of course.

Posted: 12/3/2004 4:18 PM

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Josh_the_FunkDOC

Former player

Joined: 3/13/2004
Posts: 706
Location: Elyria/Oberlin, OH

Normal flying is noticeably faster than running. Spinjump flying is the same speed as running IIRC, but it's useful because it allows you to maintain running speed upon landing (whereas the normal flying slows you down after landing).

but then you take my 75 perchance chance of winning, if we was to go one-on-one, and then add 66 and two-thirds ch...percents...i got a 141 and two-thirds chance of winning at sacrifice

Posted: 12/3/2004 4:20 PM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

If the starting sequence is done correct (=> A and forward button released in the exact right frame), then flying is a lot faster than running. Therefore you lose a bit of speed in the landing. Spin-jump flying, flying with an item in Mario's hands or flying with Yoshi is equally fast as running, but therefore it maintains the running speed after the landing (that's why I use the spin-jump flight in Star World 5 b, so I still have running speed when I land on the small platforms and can rise up to the key) ---edit hehe Josh beat me to it :P

Posted: 12/3/2004 5:13 PM

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Editor, Reviewer, Experienced player (979)

Joined: 4/17/2004
Posts: 3109
Location: Sweden

Understood. Thanks for the good explanations.

Posted: 12/4/2004 1:18 AM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

So, Donut Plains 1 b turned out to be more work than expected. I had a great run, bumping on one super koopa after the other, collecting 1UP in the end and still keeping enough height to get up to the key... but, unfortunately, somehow I just couldn't get up there. The problem: This wall of green !- blocks. It's supposed to be a help to get to the key easier, but it makes the hole between pipe and platform smaller and therefore impossible to pass with a flight. So, instead of going under the pipe, I had to fly over it, and now this is another "fly-over-everything" level... at least there are lots of coins to collect (and some stupid obstacles which forced me to neglect several coins...). I finish the level 72 frames (1 timeunit) faster than Alexis Neuhaus (and 145 frames faster than Volkov, he didn't use the fast flying here...). I lose some time because I have to rise up higher at the start, therefore Alexis loses some time because he has to collect the feather, so it's kinda hard to compare our times. But I think mine can't be improved anymore (if at all a few more coins, but I think I collected all that I could) Anyway, here's the video Now on to Donut Secret 1 a... I don't like those water levels :P

Posted: 12/4/2004 8:04 AM

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BoltR

Former player

Joined: 8/12/2004
Posts: 651
Location: Alberta, Canada

Errm, I assume you already know this, but you can go from normal flying to spinning and then back. You can also turn around while flying by spinning. Also I beleive you can land by sliding along the ground (still in the flying pose) then spin jump into the air and continue flying. I've done this a number of times, but it's always by fluke and i'm not to sure how hard it is to replicate/how much it slows you down. This might help you in a case where you need to fly under a pipe like you used to do (before you flew over it). Attached it a movie of me spinning while flying and reversing directions. It might be known to you, but I don't know if other people know you can do this. Here. I don't have a movie of landing then taking off again with a spin jump, as I was too lazy to do it, but I was talking to someone on IRC earlier, who had done something like it (Although I can't remember who :/)

Posted: 12/4/2004 9:41 PM

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xebra

Joined: 5/3/2004
Posts: 1203

That's a kick in the nuts if I ever saw one.

Posted: 12/5/2004 7:09 PM
(Edited: 12/5/2004 10:32 PM)

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

Sorry for being inactive for a day, I had consumed a bit too much alcohole :P Changing the flying direction looks cool, although I don't know if it'll be of use somewhere in my video. Maybe in this one cave where it's going down, I don't remember which level that was.

Boltr wrote:

Also I beleive you can land by sliding along the ground (still in the flying pose) then spin jump into the air and continue flying.

I have tried out several things, but couldn't reproduce it. Doing a spin-jump directly after landing avoids the slow sliding (I've done that for example in Castle #2), but however you lose the running speed and therefore can't fly up again. Or maybe you can try and make a movie to prove me wrong?

xebra wrote:

That's a kick in the nuts if I ever saw one.

I have no idea what you wanted to say with this... Anyway, Donut Secret 1 a has been added. I reach the first pipe in the exact same time as Alexis Neuhaus and Volkov. The cave is exited 7 frames faster than Volkov and 10 frames faster than Alexis. In the following passage where I have to swim up fast I'm 8 frames faster than both Alexis and Volkov. Sometimes I had to avoid smashing a fish and swim under it instead, because otherwise I would have lost the shell. Before the end I swim back for a few frames to have more forward speed to get over the peak. I release the shell 1 frame before I enter the goal, therefore it transforms into a coin instead of a feather and the fade-out sequence is 3 frames faster :) Movie can be downloaded here

Posted: 12/5/2004 8:03 PM

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BoltR

Former player

Joined: 8/12/2004
Posts: 651
Location: Alberta, Canada

Movie here. Now we get to see if it will acually be useful for something... Edit: Here too, this one has a longer flight.

Posted: 12/5/2004 10:39 PM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

hmm so far I can't see any use for this... but who knows, can't be wrong to not know about this :) Donut Ghost House b has been added, I improved my old time by 24 frames, by doing a spin-jump flight up to the ceiling and then directly lifting off again to a normal flight (instead of just one normal flight) Bumping against the 1UP-block before the door did not cost any time, actually I gained 1 frame by starting the kamikaze flight later :) Updated movie can be found here

Posted: 12/5/2004 10:44 PM

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NrgSpoon

Joined: 6/14/2004
Posts: 646

VIPer7 wrote:

The problem: This wall of green !- blocks. It's supposed to be a help to get to the key easier, but it makes the hole between pipe and platform smaller and therefore impossible to pass with a flight.

It's unfortunate. I was hoping it would be possible to dive under the pipe and pull up to get in there, due to the increased height from the dive before.

I like my "thank you"s in monetary form.

Posted: 12/6/2004 12:51 AM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

I thought about those stupid green !-blocks and had an idea. I could make a worldmap route change which would take the exact same time, but do the green switch palace a lot later. Then I could enter the red door in Castle #3 a bit quicker, and not have to fly up into the clouds in Donut Plains 1b (which would also save some time) This would be the adapted route (compare with the old route)

...
6    #1 Iggy's Castle          1   0   0
7    Donut Plains 1 b          1   0   0 
8    Donut Secret 1            1   0   0 
9    Donut Ghost House         1   0   0 
10   Donut Plains 3            1   0   0 
11   Donut Plains 4            1   0   0 
12   #2 Morton's Castle        1   0   0 
...
42   Funky                     1   0   0 
43   Donut Plains 1            1   0   5 
44   Donut Plains 2 b          1   0   0 
45   Green Switch Palace       1   0   0
46   Donut Plains 2            0   1   0 
47   Donut Ghost House b       1   0   0 
48   Donut Secret 1 b          1   1   1 
49   Donut Secret House b      1   0   0 
50   Donut Secret House        1   0   1 
51   Donut Secret 2            1   1   0 
52   Vanilla Dome 1 b          1   1   3
...

I had another look at the full movie, and found 3 places where I had contact with green !-blocks (Donut Plains 3, Castle #2, Star World 5b). So, I think this wouldn't be too much work to fix. A problem could be Tubular, maybe I'd have to wait there longer (or shorter, who knows...) Anyway, I'll try it out tomorrow and then post the results here.

Posted: 12/6/2004 2:27 AM

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Spoony_Bard

Former player

Joined: 8/17/2004
Posts: 377

Well if you could manage to hex it in, then perhaps. But if the only way to do this is to go back and restart from the beginning of the Donut Plains, then I wouldn't, it's not worth it. (Granted I don't know a thing about how the hexing works, so maybe it's not as hard as I think it is) And I haven't commented on this directly myself yet, but you're doing a great job! Keep it up.

Posted: 12/6/2004 7:50 AM

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Volkov

Former player

Joined: 7/11/2004
Posts: 72
Location: Adelaide

Hey it's me Volkov (made the old old SMW vid) And i'm like so much better now i pwnd the old times but i dont have the files now, though...I do have exactly 7 days of free time so im just gonna be bumming around n stuff, thought I might help you guys out on this or even make a run, if you guys help me out on fastest route, cus i can play the levels easy just ened to know fastest ways..anyways let me know what you think... - Volkov ;)

Posted: 12/7/2004 12:31 AM

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VIPer7

Former player

Joined: 10/17/2004
Posts: 226
Location: Bonn, Germany

I spent quite some time doing a new run on Donut Plains 1 b, in the end reaching the keyhole 10 frames faster than Alexis and also discovering some ugly graphic glitches:

These glitches are reproducable, you can download 2 movies of it here and here I'm not really sure whether those glitches are a fault of Snes9x or the game itself... Anyway, then I wanted to hex my old version of Donut Secret 2a into it, but no matter how I adjusted the "enter-level-frame", it kept desynching. Probably because I had entered the level a lot later in the game, with a completely different amount of lives and coins etc... So, nice try, but I'll have to live with the fact that it *could* have been done a little bit better by chosing a better worldmap route, but I'm not going to do all the levels again because of that :P (it would only be a difference of ~ 30 frames, if at all...) Volkov, if you also want to try a 97 levels run yourself, you could maybe pick this slightly better route. Although I must say it would be pretty depressing if you could finish this in just one week, while I've been working on this for almost seven weeks now and have just about completed half of it :S

Posted: 12/7/2004 2:16 AM

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Volkov

Former player

Joined: 7/11/2004
Posts: 72
Location: Adelaide

Sure, gimme the compelte world map route the fastest way you've worked out (this one you say if faster) and i'll give it a go. Also, if you don't mind sending me what you've done already so I can see what im up against or anything you may of discovered, better ways to do stuff etc...we always use to help each other out on the smw runs, lol...back in the day ;) Well, yeah, i'll see it once its released anyways, well, I wait for your reply.. - Volkov

Posted: 12/7/2004 2:35 AM

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