The only thing that buggered me was that you used Taco's Ceres, instead of starting your own. Well, you altered it to your liking, but it still bothered me that you were so lazy ;p. I take you started to record after the first room?
He not only used his Ceres, he used my entire Zebes until pre Torizo as well. But I don't see what is so bad about that. If the fastest strategies are already known, why intentionally use the slower ones especially in a serious and high qualitative run that Cpadolf currently works on?
Joined: 6/13/2006
Posts: 3300
Location: Massachussetts, USA
Saturn wrote:
He not only used his Ceres, he used my entire Zebes until pre Torizo as well. But I don't see what is so bad about that.
Of course you don't see anything bad with that, because it's your work he's copying. Now, if he done all that on his own, you might be having a huff since it wouldn't have been you that created the "currently perfect" strategies for that room.
Now, if he done all that on his own, you might be having a huff since it wouldn't have been you that created the "currently perfect" strategies for that room.
Absolutely not true. Those who know me can tell that I always appreciate any improvements that are unknown to me, no matter of the author.
He not only used his Ceres, he used my entire Zebes until pre Torizo as well. But I don't see what is so bad about that. If the fastest strategies are already known, why intentionally use the slower ones especially in a serious and high qualitative run that Cpadolf currently works on?
I think you misunderstood:
He used Taco's smv, and started building upon that. I know this since I accidently loaded a savestate I usually use when watching Taco's runs; I don't want to watch the intro all the time ;]. There is nothing wrong with it though, since I daresay he did not copy more than 1 room.
The only thing that buggered me was that you used Taco's Ceres, instead of starting your own. Well, you altered it to your liking, but it still bothered me that you were so lazy ;p. I take you started to record after the first room?
I did start a version from the very begining at first just copying the intro delay, though in the second room I noted that I was 3000 something subpixels behind taco which lost me a frame and at that point all good savestates was gone. I got annoyed and bored and I was tired (did the start of ceres very late one night) so I ripped the first two rooms from tacos first 49:17 run because of lazyness or maybe better phrased as lack of motivation since the end result would pretty much end up a copy anyways even if I did not directly rip it or even look at it.
I also would not call my pre torizo work a copy of Saturn's, I did most things by myself though naturally using his strategies which I could not find improvements to.
Naturally my motivation for this run was not at top when I started it as I know already what kind of a reciving it would get here by the general public so I worked on it somewhat lazily in the begining (though not sloppily), basically only doing it because I "had" to do a 00:23 run. After my first substantial improvement (diagonal crateria room) it went up though and now it is very high because I find improvements everywhere which is fun.
I would also very much like to know how you saw that I ripped the beggining of tacos run.
EDIT: Ah, I see.
I plan to be finished in roughly 1-2 weeks, then I think I'll try to make a 100% run.
To bad I can't watch the video and compare the length of phantoons death animation to mine.
I have to say this argument is ridiculous. Of course he is going to copy/recreate the fastest routes and movements known... that's the entire point of a TAS. Not doing so = no vote.
I have to say this argument is ridiculous. Of course he is going to copy/recreate the fastest routes and movements known... that's the entire point of a TAS. Not doing so = no vote.
Since Taco has perfected Ceres already (I think), there is no other way than copying, since perfection cannot be recreated. The movements are going to be the same no matter what you do, except the waiting time before Ridley. And no, this is not the point of TASing.
And I think it's better if you define "this argument", since you could mean several.
creaothceann made a video of my WIP, it can be found on youtube Here or for higher quality There
I have only been able to watch the video in youtube without sound so far because I'm not at my own computer (this on has issues...) so I don't know how it is yet.
I also would not call my pre torizo work a copy of Saturn's, I did most things by myself though naturally using his strategies which I could not find improvements to.
Cpadolf, you know exactly that this statement isn't entirely true. Many of the strategies in my new demo required deep analyzing and some weird techs that are very unlikely to be found by a casual TASer. Best example is the "in-door mockball" after the 1st Missile pack, or the completely different OMBR strategy on the way back (not to mention the revolutionary OTES). You very likely (to 99%) wouldn't get this ideas without seeing my smv, and you know that best. I realize that for most people it's just not easy to admit when they copy existing work frame by frame, but as said before, there is nothing bad about it because it's naturally for a TAS to aim for fastest time, as Mlandry already said. The only bad thing is when one can't stand to his actions when he actually did it.
Also nice vid you did creaothceann. Looks very clean. 60 fps effect on YouTube ftw. ;-)
Did you use any additional filters (maybe new deinterlacers or other stuff to smooth the picture even more) besides the "Weave" feature to merge 2 frames to 1? I wonder because your video seems to look a bit different on YouTube than mine.
Fano wrote:
when did you start the any% Saturn?
Mid August 2006, 2 days before releasing the 3rd RBO teaser. Worked on it until beginning of February 2007 where I cancelled it at Draygon.
Joined: 11/21/2007
Posts: 94
Location: United States
Saturn wrote:
Cpadolf wrote:
I also would not call my pre torizo work a copy of Saturn's, I did most things by myself though naturally using his strategies which I could not find improvements to.
Cpadolf, you know exactly that this statement isn't entirely true. Many of the strategies in my new demo required deep analyzing and some weird techs that are very unlikely to be found by a casual TASer. Best example is the "in-door mockball" after the 1st Missile pack, or the completely different OMBR strategy on the way back (not to mention the revolutionary OTES). You very likely (to 99%) wouldn't get this ideas without seeing my smv, and you know that best. I realize that for most people it's just not easy to admit when they copy existing work frame by frame, but as said before, there is nothing bad about it because it's naturally for a TAS to aim for fastest time, as Mlandry already said. The only bad thing is when one can't stand to his actions when he actually did it.
I think he means that he took your strategies, but he did most of the rooms without frame-by-frame copying.
Saturn wrote:
Fano wrote:
when did you start the any% Saturn?
Mid August 2006, 2 days before releasing the 3rd RBO teaser. Worked on it until beginning of February 2007 where I cancelled it at Draygon
thanks.
Current TAS Project:
SMR 100% TAS - 12.5% of the way done with the initial route (I'm going to then release it for further improvments)
The fact that I might not have found a strategy without your smv does not make my work a copy of it. I never copied you frame for frame therefore I naturally don't say that I did, yes in some cases I had to watch your smv closely to understand what you did differently and indeed some of the things you found are weird and was probably very hard to find, but really what difference does it make?
Well, the frame by frame thing was a bit exaggerated, and it doesn't make a difference of course, I just wanted to note that this stuff was not as easy to find as it seems to be, and that there is no need to hide the fact when a TASer copies existing work. You showed to be independent of others to make top quality work in later parts of the game though, so I believe you in this case.
Thanks for the comments. I've always wanted to use Player One since TorZelan suggested it. ;)
Saturn wrote:
Looks very clean. 60 fps effect on YouTube ftw. ;-)
Yeah, it's definitely worth the effort IMO. :)
Saturn wrote:
Did you use any additional filters (maybe new deinterlacers or other stuff to smooth the picture even more) besides the "Weave" feature to merge 2 frames to 1? I wonder because your video seems to look a bit different on YouTube than mine.
I dumped the SMV to an uncompressed AVI (9.81 GB in 6 segments) for editing, and combined them with AviSynth. I used its own command for reducing the height (see test.avs).
In VirtualDub, you need to make sure that the frame rate matches the audio duration if you want to use the original audio. I removed it later because of the small gaps created by removing the door/elevator transitions. (The AviSynth command "KillAudio" can reduce the data rate immensely.)
After editing I made sure that the frame rate is exactly 30 fps, not 30.019 fps. It might be possible that YouTube uses only every other frame from a 30.019 fps video. :p
The final video (still 256x224) was encoded with the VP70 codec at 1000 kbps and in two passes (best quality), down to 66 MB. You might say that's total overkill, especially because of the time required, but I just wanted a small file size. :)
XkyRauh, could you be more detailed and tell which avi are you talking about?
There is quite good information about codec problems in FAQ section http://tasvideos.org/CodecProblems.html I recommend to read that page first.
