I think everyone's already familiar with Sonic 2, or if they aren't, they should be. I hadn't intended to work on this since Quietust was working on a redo, but I suppose you can blame AngerFist for this submission. It didn't take as much effort as some of the other runs I've done thanks to the existing run (and what little was said about the redo). Going by in-level time units, this turned out to be exactly 2 minutes faster than Quietust's v1. I used Sonic + Tails and (unlike the first run) controlled both of them directly, although a good deal of the the improvement did not involve using 2 characters. The largest improvements came from using new shortcuts and glitches, a couple of them to which I can't claim credit (Chemical Plant 2 and Hill Top 1), with a lesser amount of improvement from playing with more precision.
LevelTimeUnits Improved
Emerald Hill 10:171
Emerald Hill 20:351
Chemical Plant 10:170
Chemical Plant 20:3318
Aquatic Ruin 10:172
Aquatic Ruin 20:362
Casino Night 10:241
Casino Night 20:496
Hill Top 10:2811
Hill Top 20:444
Mystic Cave 10:253
Mystic Cave 20:352
Oil Ocean 10:233
Oil Ocean 20:3117
Metropolis 10:4410
Metropolis 20:437
Metropolis 31:0822
Sky Chase2:060
Wing Fortress1:348
Death Egg0:402
Total13:49120 seconds
Sky Chase is a fixed-length autoscroller, so I got 100% of the rings and killed 100% of the enemies to try to keep it entertaining. Everything else is faster than the previous run, although for Chemical Plant 1 it isn't by enough frames to save any full time units on that level.
Tails is really smaller than Sonic, thus he interacts with the levels differently and I couldn't simply copy all of Sonic's controls to make Tails keep up. Sometimes that means it is impossible for Tails to keep up, as he can't get going as fast on some types of curves. And Tails can't get items, so can't possibly keep up with Sonic when he has Sprint Shoes. But sometimes Tails lags behind simply because he wouldn't be useful and it's more of a stylistic choice to have Sonic always be the faster one.
I confirmed that lag frames do not count toward the in-level timer, so I did nothing to avoid them, as my goal was to minimize in-level time (even the part of it that isn't displayed). Almost anything different to avoid the lag would have been much slower, anyway.
General movie making: Some of the places where I controlled Sonic and Tails at the same time were just getting too tedious to record (especially Mystic Cave 1), so I modified Gens to let me record the Sonic and Tails parts individually, and merge them. Also, as I've gotten used to having a Sonic speedometer available in other runs (for other emulators), I added that too.
Chemical Plant 2: The door for the huge shortcut opens because Tails is lagging behind just enough for him to open the door exactly as Sonic is about to hit it.
Casino Night 1: I was nearly able to improve the end by at least another full time unit by jumping over the last flipper, but it wasn't possible to get going quite fast enough to make it across that gap.
Casino Night 2: Some collision-related glitches here saved a decent amount of time (going through flippers and skipping a stopper).
Hill Top 1: Getting Sonic to zip that far was really hard, I don't know how Quietust found it so quickly. After hundreds of failures I wrote a simple random input generator and it happened to find something that worked, eventually.
Hill Top 2: Those platform jumps are difficult and would not have worked if I had lost any frames anywhere else earlier in the level.
Oil Ocean 1&2: I was pleasantly surprised at how nicely these worked out. Oil is better than solid ground in some ways...
Wing Fortress: I duck at the optimal time at the end to make the barrier sprite disappear so I can dash through it before the camera goes back, ending the level without waiting for it to fade away. Those sliders let you perform or store spindashes while on them. I found a related bug that lets Sonic hover across almost anything in the level (including over or under or into the boss fight), but it disables spindashes and only works at a location most of the way into the level, and so couldn't save any time.
Metropolis 1: Sometimes it's faster to let Tails fly to catch up with Sonic than it is to slow down Sonic enough to keep Tails onscreen, especially after double-jump slope speedups which Tails is too small to do.
Metropolis 2: The trick at the start is the same concept as the Hill Top 1 trick. It saved about 2 seconds.
Metropolis 3: Finally, a conveniently-located crusher. I exploit the way that Sonic can't usually be crushed right after he starts jumping. Normally, doing this trick drops you into the spinning tube/cage, which is slow but still worth the large shortcut, but I found a way to zip past that before falling.
Death Egg: The back-and-forth dash between the doors before Eggman actually saves time. The third hit against Eggman is almost impossible to replicate. The running through the tunnel after the movie ends is faster than normal because of hitting the ceiling in a spindash jump at the last moment that Sonic has control.
  • No death
  • Aims for fastest (primarily in-level) time
  • Ignores delays caused by bonus effects
  • Takes damage to save time
  • Abuses programming errors in the game
  • One player controls two characters
  • Emulator used: Gens Movie Test 9h (works with 9f, etc.)

Truncated: Well, no sense in waiting here, this is accepted for being a first-class movie.


TASVideoAgent
They/Them
Moderator
Joined: 8/3/2004
Posts: 15603
Location: 127.0.0.1
This topic is for the purpose of discussing #1198: nitsuja's Genesis Sonic the Hedgehog 2 in 19:55.43
Nsm
Joined: 5/26/2004
Posts: 39
HOLY SHIT! =O
Quietust
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Former player
Joined: 7/14/2004
Posts: 250
Looks like you beat the hell out of my improvements, so I'm officially scrapping my run in favor of this.
* Quietust, QMT Productions P.S. If you don't get this note, let me know and I'll write you another
Mitjitsu
He/Him
Banned User
Joined: 4/24/2006
Posts: 2997
I'll watch this run shortly, I've only read the first paragraph and table and I'm amazed that you made a two second improvement although I must ask how many frames were saved by using tails, because I didn't think it was possible to save any more than 30 frames without tails. Although using tail could definitley save the very minimum of a second. EDIT: Was any frames lost to the previous run at any point? EDIT: Sorry for the mistake, I always look at the table and make an assumption that the author is refering to frames saved as opposed to seconds saved.
Emulator Coder, Skilled player (1310)
Joined: 12/21/2004
Posts: 2687
AKA wrote:
I must ask how many frames were saved by using tails
I really don't know, but I would guess that about 30% of it was from using Tails.
AKA wrote:
Was any frames lost to the previous run at any point?
Not that I know of. I was always comparing them. (But it's hard to compare when I take completely different routes...)
Former player
Joined: 6/15/2005
Posts: 1711
nitsuja, Please accept this declaration of my undying mancrush on you. Your "buddy", Fabian
Zoey Ridin' High <Fabian_> I prett much never drunk
Skilled player (1410)
Joined: 5/31/2004
Posts: 1821
How the hell do you produce these runs in such a short amount of time? Either way, great run, voting yes.
Joined: 7/26/2006
Posts: 1215
Holy shit this was some good stuff. My favorite level was probably Mystic Cave 1 for always keeping tails on screen. And Oil Oceans (especially 2) for being so broken. The use of tails throughout Metropolis was great as well. A clear yes!
Former player
Joined: 3/23/2006
Posts: 211
wow very noticably faster than the old version
do not forget to *ENJOY THE SAUCE*
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
You took completely different routes, went through walls, ala nitsuja style!, glitched with the spikes and whatnot.. You sir, are now officially my number one hero in this community (used to be SprintGod, he's second now on my list ^_^) Now here is the thing what really amazes me: I encouraged you to try improve the current published run about 1-2 weeks ago.. You are not human, not human! Congratulations on your highly well deserved Ninja rank status. I hardly need to mention this but voting yes and of course a shiny star :)
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
Senior Moderator
Joined: 8/4/2005
Posts: 5777
Location: Away
An improvement that big in that ridiculously small amount of time? Dude, you are magical. :D And your current rank really is well deserved, congratulations. This run is rather short and very entertaining, the waiting sequences are even interesting to watch, the technical side is top notch. As good as a star run can get. Yes vote without any hesitating. P.S. On a somewhat related note… What do you think about improving Sonic 3 to beat the crap out of every main Sonic title once and for all? ;D
Warp wrote:
Edit: I think I understand now: It's my avatar, isn't it? It makes me look angry.
Active player (437)
Joined: 4/21/2004
Posts: 3517
Location: Stockholm, Sweden
moozooh wrote:
P.S. On a somewhat related note… What do you think about improving Sonic 3 to beat the crap out of every main Sonic title once and for all? ;D
haha, do I also dare even ask the same question? :) Anyway, this submission also works with Sonic The Hedgehog 2 (JUE) [!].bin
Nitrogenesis wrote:
Guys I come from the DidyKnogRacist communite, and you are all wrong, tihs is the run of the mileniun and everyone who says otherwise dosnt know any bater! I found this run vary ease to masturbate too!!!! Don't fuck with me, I know this game so that mean I'm always right!StupedfackincommunityTASVideoz!!!!!!
Arc wrote:
I enjoyed this movie in which hands firmly gripping a shaft lead to balls deep in multiple holes.
natt wrote:
I don't want to get involved in this discussion, but as a point of fact C# is literally the first goddamn thing on that fucking page you linked did you even fucking read it
Cooljay wrote:
Mayor Haggar and Cody are such nice people for the community. Metro City's hospitals reached an all time new record of incoming patients due to their great efforts :P
JXQ
Experienced player (761)
Joined: 5/6/2005
Posts: 3132
Mystic Cave 1 was awesome for racing with Tails. Several crazy glitch-shortcuts were very unexpected. I never would have thought this much improvement could be squeezed out of this game. I'm glad to see you finally got ninja rank. Overdue, in my opinion.
<Swordless> Go hug a tree, you vegetarian (I bet you really are one)
Former player
Joined: 8/1/2004
Posts: 2687
Location: Seattle, WA
Yessin' dis.
hi nitrodon streamline: cyn-chine
Mitjitsu
He/Him
Banned User
Joined: 4/24/2006
Posts: 2997
OK just watched but despite what others and Nitsuja might say. I thought I saw areas that weren't optimally done although I could very well be wrong. Aquatic 2 Casino 2 Metropolis Wing Fortress Come to mind Hill Top 1 was my favourite stage. Both in the TAS and personally. Its also very simalar to Star Light Zones which are also coincidently my favourites. How come when I tried simalar stuff in Sonic_1 I simply died. I never said this before but now you see why glitching under Green Hill 2 is pointless because you'd simply die after passing the signpost. This can be done normally in Star Light 1 i.e. pass the sign post and die. This is of course relation to Oil Ocean 1. I also think this run makes the previous run much worse than it really was. I still respect it equally even after seeing this. It was certainly surprising to say the least. Although can any of the glitches be replicated relistically in real time? I'll have a ago at doing them on a console I definitley agree with the descision to kill and collect all rings in Sky Chase. Even though I can easily do it on a console in real time. I can't remember the exact stage (Aquatic 2 maybe), but I think when you did the mirrored movements was the best form of entertainment you did during the idle time, although I feel more syncro style dancing could of been done. I also liked the fact that you tried to help Tails keep up with Sonic rather than just leaving him in his wake. I have to admit that when Quietrust played Sky Chase, I thought he did that to avoid lag, which most likely wasn't true. So take it as you will. I don't think this run is worthy of shiny gold star status. It more worthy of Platinmum status. So vote yes of course I'll try nit pick and be more specific over the coming days. One final question. How come you never kept Sonic on screen after the first stage? I know that the game does a ground check to move Sonic along in auto pilot. Although its much more difficult in this game since Sonic needs to jump late and very high to be able to stay on screen.
Experienced player (614)
Joined: 4/24/2005
Posts: 612
Wow, you plan movies really well with speed and entertainment. Yes vote and congratulations on such an achievement, Ninja nitsuja (does it get any better!?).
Player (81)
Joined: 3/11/2005
Posts: 352
Location: Oregon
Thanks for raising the (already high) standards around here. I watched Quietust's run right before this one, and I think you found every improvement I suspected might exist (plus a dozen others). Excellent work.
ideamagnate| .seen aqfaq <nothing happens> DK64_MASTER| .seen nesvideoagent * DK64_MASTER slaps forehead
Twisted_Eye
He/Him
Active player (409)
Joined: 10/17/2005
Posts: 635
Location: Seattle, WA
I KNEW this run was an improvement. I KNEW this was a Nitsuja run, and I KNEW you controlled Tails. AND I STILL was completely blown away by this run.
adelikat
He/Him
Emulator Coder, Site Developer, Site Owner, Expert player (3574)
Joined: 11/3/2004
Posts: 4754
Location: Tennessee
Big, giant, fat, grade A yes vote.
It's hard to look this good. My TAS projects
Former player
Joined: 8/15/2004
Posts: 422
Location: Minnesota
Um, sure.
Joined: 5/3/2004
Posts: 1203
Do me a favor and TAS S3C so I can die in peace. Superb work, by the way.
Sir_VG
He/Him
Player (40)
Joined: 10/9/2004
Posts: 1913
Location: Floating Tower
ZOMG YOU ARE L33T NINJA. I demand you officially change your name from nitsuja to ninja. Yet ANOTHER Sonic game completely OBLITERATED. No wait, NINJARATED. Any vote but a YES vote would demand immediate seppuku.
Anyway, this submission also works with Sonic The Hedgehog 2 (JUE) [!].bin
Of course, because JUE = W.
Taking over the world, one game at a time. Currently TASing: Nothing
Spacecow
He/Him
Joined: 6/21/2004
Posts: 247
Location: New Hampshire
Ohhhhh shit, this is a surprise. You really are one of this site's greatest assets, nitsuja :)
Joined: 5/15/2006
Posts: 102
OMFG!! Amazing, as usual!! Yes²!
Joined: 11/30/2004
Posts: 83
Location: Basement
Dude, I think you broke my game. Sonic's not supposed to be able to do those things...