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Skilled player (1094)
Joined: 9/15/2013
Posts: 116
Worked up to the first teleport back to Olrox's. Getting a feel for using the bat; movement is awkward in outer wall because I have a healing item on both hands at the time. I'll continue to do testing as to whether fairy's gift can possibly be worth it, otherwise I'll continue work on a different take that gets elixir instead of high potion. Link to video
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Having to go through library and outer wall without a shield equipped turned out to waste more time than I thought after I compared it, costing almost 3 seconds. Since fairy is slow and completely useless for actually trying to do anything she's supposed to be doing to help you, and after testing it takes a very long big toss for a big toss to be faster than IWS, I think it's worth it to just skip out on fairy's gift entirely. I'll have to scrap all of the progress I've made since the WIP I posted in the WIP section for the fourth time to get another potion so fairy can heal me before i pick up bat. Hell, it would probably even still save time over going shieldless to just do fairys gift then pause a second time and equip a shield over the high potion. I feel as though I have been damned to optimize bat through marble gallery for all eternity
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
Man, I missed the WIP you posted on the 29th. That's pretty awesome. I can believe that optimizing bat movement is a pain, but the results look great!
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Skilled player (1094)
Joined: 9/15/2013
Posts: 116
I changed the resource page for SotN to be less awful. And by that, I mean a made a resource page for SotN. Lots of important stuff that could still be added, but I tried to cover everything that you couldn't learn from regular speedrunning tutorials first. Also, I realized that I can just do fairy's gift and get the toadstool at the same time, so that solves that mystery I guess.
BigBoct
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Joined: 8/9/2007
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That "0 bosses" TAS was a really good watch. You should submit it, seeing how the Moon tier is friendly to esoteric goals. There's definitely enough unique content to set it apart from the other runs of SOTN, and defeating Dracula to give the run a definite endpoint is the same in my mind as the Zelda "Swordless Challenge" collecting the Wooden Sword so it can defeat Ganon and beat the game.
Previous Name: boct1584
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boct1584 wrote:
That "0 bosses" TAS was a really good watch. You should submit it, seeing how the Moon tier is friendly to esoteric goals. There's definitely enough unique content to set it apart from the other runs of SOTN, and defeating Dracula to give the run a definite endpoint is the same in my mind as the Zelda "Swordless Challenge" collecting the Wooden Sword so it can defeat Ganon and beat the game.
It's more interesting than most arbitrary categories for this game, but I don't think it's worth submitting personally. You have to really understand the mechanics of the game to even understand why any of what it does is impressive, and it eliminates all of the combat. It also seems just like an any% run that gets bat, only it makes a brief detour in the first castle. Not to mention, http://tasvideos.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=11427, which has similar goals and themes to 0 bosses makes me wary about submitting it. These runs are mostly just demonstrations to say, "yep, you sure can do this!". I'd have to see multiple people who agree with you to convince me that it's entertaining to casual viewers, basically. Unrelated, but reading that thread again it's really entertaining watching some random guy trying to explain to arukAdo how to do a glitch that arukAdo found
Patashu
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Joined: 10/2/2005
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The clear solution is to make a romscout% TAS (again)
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
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I was requested to make a 3rd WIP post once I got to a good milestone, so here you go: Link to video Massive route change what with leaving the entrance/caverns circuit halfway through. This is the only route that allows me to do the half blood after leap stone, saving two laps all the way around the keep, and getting leap stone sooner is nice because it allows me to move on foot without a shield without wasting major time and because it makes downward movement look awesome as shit.
Patashu
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Loving it so far! Leap Stone movement is already looking sexy~
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
Yeah, keep it up! It's too bad the list of requirements needed to make boss fights last more than two seconds would basically boil down to "no equipment and no spells", but oh well. Go go fire shuriken!
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Skilled player (1094)
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Derakon wrote:
Yeah, keep it up! It's too bad the list of requirements needed to make boss fights last more than two seconds would basically boil down to "no equipment and no spells", but oh well. Go go fire shuriken!
I actually think that there's a sort of art to optimizing incredibly fast kills like this. The manipulation to get crits alone is already plenty work for me, at least. Also, I'm backtracking a ways in making this. I found a trick that allows you to shorten the length of any screen pause that occurs on the ground, and that adds up too quickly for me to pass up.
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I was actually able to hex in the instances of override fairly quickly. Granted, I worked my ass off for basically two days straight just doing it, but it was a lot less painful than I thought it would be: Link to video Saves a second just on shortening the screen pause each time, and saves over another half second if you do it while you have to wait on something such as a boss' dieing animation. Not 100% certain that it was implemented perfectly optimally into the old inputs, but I've had enough setbacks that I'm done starting from square one again.
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Coming up on where I have to decide whether to fight Richter. Can I get some opinions on whether or not I should get Holy Glasses and save Richter?
Joined: 7/2/2007
Posts: 3960
If you're doing an All Bosses run then you have to go into the fight, IMO. So unless there's a way to kill Richter but still access the second castle, you'll have to get those glasses. I don't think glitching out of the fight really counts as doing all the bossfights.
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
Skilled player (1094)
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Posts: 116
Derakon wrote:
If you're doing an All Bosses run then you have to go into the fight, IMO. So unless there's a way to kill Richter but still access the second castle, you'll have to get those glasses. I don't think glitching out of the fight really counts as doing all the bossfights.
The only way I know of to kill Richter without getting the bad ending requires having the Holy Glasses anyway, so I already knew I wouldn't bother with that. I was more asking about whether Richter should be skipped entirely or not. I'm leaning towards no at the moment, but seeing as how RTA runs skip him in all bosses this obviously isn't a unanimous opinion.
Patashu
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What were you thinking of doing instead? Kill Richter and library card out so the bad ending doesn't start?
My Chiptune music, made in Famitracker: http://soundcloud.com/patashu My twitch. I stream mostly shmups & rhythm games http://twitch.tv/patashu My youtube, again shmups and rhythm games and misc stuff: http://youtube.com/user/patashu
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Patashu wrote:
What were you thinking of doing instead? Kill Richter and library card out so the bad ending doesn't start?
I was just going to kill the Shaft orb. Released WIP 4 early because of the fork in the road with Richter and all. Link to video
Fortranm
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I second that you shouldn't skip Richter. How are you gonna get Holy Glasses though? Are you gonna enter the center of the first castle via glitches or you will have to get Silver Ring from Maria? (You get Gold Ring right away after the fight inside the coffin, IIRC.)
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Fortranm wrote:
I second that you shouldn't skip Richter. How are you gonna get Holy Glasses though? Are you gonna enter the center of the first castle via glitches or you will have to get Silver Ring from Maria? (You get Gold Ring right away after the fight inside the coffin, IIRC.)
You might have already seen to that point in the most recent WIP I posted, but I do it by wolf glitching into the slope to the right of the clock room. I could theoretically use the flea man to open a shiftline into it, but finding an experience route that actually works seems impossible seeing as how I have thousands of experience to the next level at that point in the run and flea men only give one exp per kill, and wolf glitch method skips the first half of the elevator ride. If this were PSP, I could just use shield rod spell chaining and be done with it, heh.
Fortranm
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ForgoneMoose wrote:
If this were PSP, I could just use shield rod spell chaining and be done with it, heh.
Is it true that the SOTN bonded with DXC has more glitches than the original version does? BTW, it's a kind of ironic that PPSSPP already emulates SOTN inside of DXC better than how most of current PSX or SS emulators do in emulating SOTN for most time.
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Fortranm wrote:
Is it true that the SOTN bonded with DXC has more glitches than the original version does? BTW, it's a kind of ironic that PPSSPP already emulates SOTN inside of DXC better than how most of current PSX or SS emulators do in emulating SOTN for most time.
The DXC version of SotN was coded using the original 1.0 Japanese print of the PSX version, a rare version that was replaced with an update with a number of bugfixes and additional features not long after its release. A number of the glitches in that version would combine to save significant time on the any% TAS most likely, but the time saved is basically all nullified by the arbitrary inability to skip the long opening FMV like you can in later versions, to my knowledge :P Back to the DXC version, it uses 1.0 as a base, and as such did not include a number of things that the US PSX version had. It has library card Richter skip (which, ironically, would probably be a good solution to my current problem if it worked in the US PSX version), lacks infinite wing smash, and has Shaft/Shaft cutscene skip (I recently experimented with 1.0 and found a variation of the already known Shaft fight skip that lets you skip the cutscene before the fight as well, don't know if that was known or not), to name the most significant differences that come to mind. Some things that are only in DXC but not 1.0 are the lack of any kind of shop glitch. On a positive note, ZX497 also found transformation buffer - since you have to use mist by pressing both other transform buttons at once instead of just having a dedicated button, they made it so that you have several frames to buffer inputs upon pressing either other transformation button to make it easier to time. However, this applies to any other inputs too, so you can hold other buttons with a transform button to have that button essentially be mashed at 60 hz. This lets you open shiftlines using just the shield rod. Sorry for the long response, but I just wanted to write that stuff here anyway since it could potentially be relevant to TASing this game in the future, and it did get back to the original point eventually anyways :P
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Lost more than half of my progress for at least the second time because I was supposed to know that you can just fucking jump through the floor that keeps you from just going straight to holy glasses on the way out. Too much of a time save not to include, will post another WIP when and if I ever get back to where I was. Starting to become disillusioned with the all bosses goal again.
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Worked my ass off pretty much constantly since my last post and was able to implement the changes I needed. I also found that I could have just used a library card after spirit orb, as well as a second or so of movement optimization I didn't see before, so it wasn't all pointless at least. Also, looking through comments on both the best ending TAS and 100% TASes of other Castlevanias, quite a few people have requested a non-glitchfest full game TAS of a Castlevania game, and I think that's enough to keep me going on this. Link to video
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I don't know that this wouldn't be considered a "glitchfest" by some viewers, given the amount of glitching through terrain you do, but it's awesome. None of the other SotN runs we have show off such a variety of different movement methods. Alucard really has a lot of options! This is great, keep it up!
Pyrel - an open-source rewrite of the Angband roguelike game in Python.
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Derakon wrote:
I don't know that this wouldn't be considered a "glitchfest" by some viewers, given the amount of glitching through terrain you do, but it's awesome. None of the other SotN runs we have show off such a variety of different movement methods. Alucard really has a lot of options! This is great, keep it up!
I mostly meant in comparison to the current 100% run for this game, which spends at least more than half the game on the wrong side of almost every wall it passes by. I guess this still hardly counts as glitchless though, I just take the same old skips that have been speedrunning bread and butter in this game for years for granted nowadays.
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